Primary Master Fails - Help Needed 2

[sm9]

I have a problem with my PC that I hope someone can help me with. I booted up my PC at 8am one morning before going to work, and I left it connected to Kazaa downloading files all day (as I often do). When I came home from work at 6pm, there was a message displayed on my monitor about some sort of error (I've forgotten exactly what it said), and it was loading in safe mode - this was a DOS screen, and nothing else was happening.

I then reset my PC, and as it started loading. I got a message on screen saying "Primary Master Fails." I could click OK to continue, then it will tell me to insert a System Disk as there is a Boot error, or I can hit DEL to enter Setup.

Therefore, basically, it appears that my Hard Drive is broke. I checked all the connections, and everything is fine, so I assume this is hardware fault. (?)

I have now bought a brand new hard drive (a Maxtor 30GB), and have just installed Windows XP and all my software from scratch. So my PC is working now.

...But my problem is this, my old Hard Drive had about 10Gb of files that I would like to recover, but as it's broke, what can I do? I have heard that some places can fix broken hard drives and recover the files? I don't
really care about the hard drive itself, only the 10Gb of data that's on it!

My last backup was about 6 months ago so I am missing a lot of data - digital family photos (mainly), downloaded utilities, personal documents, the lot! I definitely won't be making this mistake again (of not backing up for so long), but what's done is done, and now I want to try and see if there is anything I can do to rescue these files.

I had put a post on a newsgroup about this a few weeks ago, and the two suggestions I was given to fix the Hard Drive were to to hit it (but not too hard), or to put it in the freezer for 10 hours, then try if it works. I have not tried any of these ideas yet, but they may be my last resort before I get expensive professional help.

I have tried connecting the broken drive as a Primary Slave drive, but I still get a message on startup, this time saying "Primary Slave Fails." But Windows will then boot up from my new Primary Master.

On the BIOS / DOS screen that appears on my computer on startup, the broken Primary Slave drive is listed amongst the other drives and components, so it is being detected. It's just not working for some reason.

Also, when Windows XP loads for the first time with the broken hard drive connected as a Slave drive (strangely, Windows takes a few minutes longer to boot up when the broken primary slave drive is connected), I get a window appear saying "New hardware detected." In Device Manager, the broken drive is listed, and it says "This device is working properly." I find this very unusual, and wonder whether I could fix it or try something to make my hard drive work again? It's all very confusing for me though.

The specification of my PC is as follows:
Windows XP Professional, Athlon 1Ghz processor, 256Mb SDRAM, 32MB nVidia Graphic Card, Sound Blaster 32 Sound Card, Quantum Fireball Hard Drive - 30GB IDE (broken hard drive).

I hope someone can help or advise me, it will be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Stephen

 

[Kerlouarn]

@edfair :

ok, let's say that the BIOS tries to read the sector 0 before the *boot* page. After I zero-filled the drive, I also reinstalled Windows 2000 and it didn't work. Do you think I should use some 98 or DOS fdisk in order to make the mbr better ?

At least, I have received new firmwares from Maxtor so I flashed the disk. No I really have reading/writing problems on the drive... (hope maxtor will be able to send me the old firmware back... couldn't do backups before flashing ).

@wyldeyes :

if your disk is not recognized in the BIOS, this is not the same problem. Have a look to the connections and/or master/slave jumpers. I suppose if the disk is not visible in the BIOS, you won't be able to read anything from it... Good luck anyway.

kerlouarn

 

[WyldEyes]

Thanx Kerlouarn

My cables and jumpers are all ok, I've installed another drive and it works fine. I contacted Western Digital and they say they don't have a firmware for it and I'd have to send it in to get replaced, but I lose all my data. Thanx anyways looks like I'll be losing my data.

 

[khaled2000]

I have the same problem with my maxtor drive ( I found this theard by searching for the dreadful UK0E02)
I tried the linux method, but I got
dd: reading '/dev/hdb': Input/output error
0+0 records in
0+0 records out

Oh well, guess my only option is to forget about the drive!

 

[WyldEyes]

I bought a new WD Hard Drive which came with a diagnostic disk. I used it and got an error message and sent it to WD Support who replied that my drive was faulty and that I would have to get it replaced. It was working fine before and then all of a sudden it stop for no apparent reason, I checked with our local computer store and they said they received 19 other with the same problem. So it doesn't look like an isolated incident. Beware everyone

 

[Kerlouarn]

@ khaled2000 :

at least, your problem doesn't seem to be exactly similar to mine... maybe try the disk on another computer...

@ wyldeyes :

for sure, this is not an isolated incident... Finaly I think I will have to throw out my hdd. had luck to save all the datas at the begening !! I personaly suspect some kind of viruses...

have nice day everyone, good luck to those trying to repair their disks and to save datas... next time, do backups !

kerlouarn

 

[PeterGriff]

This thread has been very educational - I have been coming back for a peek every so often and have improved my understanding greatly. Can I suggest that an FAQ going through all possible scenarios and avenues of repair be posted. I will start it here. If the Linux users could add more extensive instructions for their section (I tried to follow their instructions with Mandrake 8, but got lost mid-way somewhere). As Ed has been the main contibutor I would propose that he proof read after the Linux users (sjk1 and Kerlouarn), then add and post the FAQ under his name (if he wishes and has time...).

Here goes:

Three common scenarios:

1. The hard drive boots reasonably normally but may start developing strange symptons such as running slowly, missing or damaged files (Windows may not boot correctly, or other programs may fail, but work on re-install). Scandisk may start running at each start-up suggesting that one of your hard drives may have developed problems. This is caused by bad sectors developing on the hard drive. This can happen due to a bad crash, a physical shock while spinning, or due to deteriation of the hard drive surface. In the first two scenarios you are likely to one or two bad sectors, but no new bad spots arise over time. Running scandisk (with surface scan / thorough mode) will detect the bad spots, mark them as bad and Windows will avoid using these spots. If the surface of the drive is deteriorating then more faults will appear in time - sometimes within 24 hours. In this scenario you should save any data you can and replace the drive ( If it is still at an early stage of damage I have successfully used Norton Ghost providing I stipulate that it ignores bad sectors - this also takes much longer).

2. Your hard drive is recognised in the BIOS IDE detection but cant find a system disk (check that you dont have a floppy in the FDD drive first). If you boot from a floppy you can see C drive, even access it and copy files to it (but you shouldnt). You may see one or two folders or nothing at all. This appears to be a corruption of the FAT table (which stores the location and all the details of every file), or possibly due to using fdisk on a usable hard drive. You can successfully recover data by mounting the hard drive in a different computer (so you are not overriting data on the failed hard drive) and running disk recovery software (eg. Ontrack Easyrecovery) These utilities tend to be quite expensive. Any good free or cheap ones?? These utilities are also useful to recover deleted files on a good hard drive.


3. Your hard drive is recognised in the BIOS IDE detection but displays a primary hard disk failure error. This is something to do with corruption of the boot partition?. Linux users have been able to mount drives that suffer from this and recover the data (full instructions needed here...). The hard drive can then be low-level formatted (using a utility from the manufacturer), fdisk'ed, then formatted with format.com, and used normally (Question - does this failure indicate that the drive may suffer from this again???)

4. The "death rattle". The hard drive may function fairly normally then just stop dead, or reboot the PC. On restart the hard drive may start making a loud distinctive rattle - either immediately or within a few minutes. Each time you reboot the usable time decreases until it dies soon after IDE detection. This is caused by a mechanical malfunction of the drive mechanism (the head crashing into the platter?). I have found that leaving the hard drive for 24 hours or so gives the best window of time to reboot the disk and copy off everthing I possibly can (every time I tried after only 2 - 3 hours I only had about 3 minutes of access to the drive). Provided the user has not rebooted endlessly and done a lot of damage you can usually have a fair degree of success in recovering data. Some users suggest freezing the hard drive (in an airtight container or bag) as a solution (also twisting the hard drive). This was originally proposed for older drives (e.g. 40 MB, not GB) that suffered from stiction, and the temperature change (or twisting) caused expansion and contraction and unstuck the drive head (or something along these lines). I was originally sceptical that this would have any effect on modern drives. However my observation that leaving the drive to "cool" for 24 hours helps, makes me think that there is a temperature effect and that cooling or freezing the drive may aid in getting a longer window of time for recovery. In any case, if all else fails you have nothing to lose by trying it. Can you try and swap in new parts from an identical drive - No! Even if you had the specialist tools and knowledge to do the physical transplant the new components would not align in the smae manner as the old and your data would be unusable.

5. The hard drive isnt even detected by the BIOS (note - this isnt relating to new drive setups, where other issues may cause this). In this case it would appear that the drive controller board (which is a circuit board mounted on the hard drive itself) has failed. The only repair option is to remove the drive controller from the hard drive and replace it with a completely identical one. This is a tough call for most users with a hard drive a few years old, but is not too difficult to do in terms of the actual repair (usually two or three screws and pins or contacts that align with the rest of the drive). (Even though I have saved dozens of failed hard drives I still have not found an occaision to do this repair for real as I havent had matching components for the drives that have failed).


Peter G

 

[Kerlouarn]

@ peter G :

Greetings Peter, I will try to give some more informations about my experience.

> 3. Your hard drive is recognised in the BIOS IDE
> detection but displays a primary hard disk failure error.
> This is something to do with corruption of the boot
> partition?.

in my case, it was not. it was definitly not a partition table problem, it might better be firmware or hardware failure, maybe reported by the SMART features of the disk.

> Linux users have been able to mount drives that suffer
> from this and recover the data (full instructions needed
> here...).

yes, this is the first thing I would ever try to recover datas because Linux is more safe than windows (i mean it will not do things without telling you about and asking you to confirm... Windows does). The way to do that is the same way a Linux user would mount a normal partition (remember there was not any problem), that is :

- eventually declare the partition in /etc/fstab
- mount the drive using "mount /mnt/*directoryToMount*"

if you do not want to declare the partition in /etc/fstab, you may use this :

"mount /dev/*device* -t *typeFs* /mnt/*directoryToMount*"

where *device* could be :
hda1 (primary partition for primary master disk)
hda2 (secondary partition for primary master disk)
...
hdb5 (fifth partition for primary slave disk)
...
hdd7 (seventh parition for secondary slave disk)

where *typeFs* could be (for example) :
ext2fs (Linux ext2)
vfat (Win32 LBA)
fat16 (DOS Fat)
ntfs (Win32 NT/2K/XP)
nfs (network file system)
smbfs (windows shared directory)

I have founs a great Linux distribution that fits on a single bootable CD (no installation needed) that allows to use most rescue-needable utilities. This distribution is Trinity Rescue Kit (TRK) and can be downloaded at :

http://harakiri.dyndns.org:2080/trk-howto.htm

Once again, remember I could recover the datas at this time because the hard drive was working both for writing/reading. It just couldn't boot. I am quite sure Windows would have read it... My problem was that windows was not able to boot because it was installed on the failing disk itself. I could have tried to install another windows on another disk, that would have surely worked.(at least, I didn't want to try at all )

> The hard drive can then be low-level formatted (using a
> utility from the manufacturer), fdisk'ed, then formatted
> with format.com,

yes, at this time, i got no error code

> and used normally

no !

here, I still have the primary &quot;master drive fails&quot; message, low-level formating the disk didn't change anything. At least, it was usable as secondary disk but not as a bootable disk (with just a detail : it may then crash anywhen <-- not sure this is english ;o))) ).

After that phase, I asked Maxtor (manufacturer) to send me a new firmware in order to test it. Flashed the firmware with no possibility to save the old one (.
Now, I have serious errors, the diagnostics programs report errors and the disk can not be formated completely. I will try to see if Maxtor can send me the old firmware back but I'm quite pessimistic about the issue.

> (Question - does this failure indicate that the drive may
> suffer from this again???)

good question, could not get the answer from me, sorry...

hope this helps !

kerlouarn

 

[rlondoner]

I have a Maxtor 30 gig that has the same problems out lined in this form. (recognised in bios but no drive letter and a hard drive failure message)I am trying to fix this drive for a friend. The interesting thing that I have found while reading these discussions is the link brtween kazaa and hard drive crashes. I too have had this problem. My system was constantly crashing and my hard drive was making loud clicking noises that I was told was the read head hitting my hard disk. This I was told was impending failure of my hard drive. ( I have a 40 gig maxtor drive that is about a year old. ) Before giving up on this drive I decided to flash my Bios and reformat my drive. I did this two months ago and my hard drive is once again silent and system crashes are very rare. ( My system use to lock up once an hour and now it locks up once every 24 hours. A lock up once every 24 hours has always been normal for me because I am an avid gamer.) The only virus I was able to find was a person to person virus that my PCcillin anti virus software did not detect. F secure anti virus software identified this virus and rewrote the file name. The software was unable to remove the virus from my system. I am not sure if it was responsable for my hard drive problems. You will Know if you have this virus if at the bottom of your kazaa browser it says, you are sharing a large number of files EG. 213, when you know you only have 20 files in your shared folder. If you try and find these bogus files and delete them , they will once again reappear when you restart your computer. This virus was a real nightmare for me. I beleive that the info I have given you could save your hard drive if indeed there is a virus that is infecting our hard drives.