Pear Shaped Women 4

[Lunatic]

In an effort to please the forum gods I shall try to break out the pear-shaped woman debate from the 'going pear shaped' debate.

I really don't want to offend any pear-shaped people out there, but calling a woman "pear-shaped", at least in the US, will not be taken as a compliment, even if it is a natural body shape for women.

As Stella pointed out, an "hourglass" figure is how you can describe a full-figured woman. Other pleasing descriptions might include curvy, voluptuous or, dare I say, Rubenesque. Pear shape indicates someone with much wider hips than chest/shoulders.

We must be from two different parts of the US then because I have heard pear-shaped used as a compliment many times... Although it was usually by a mother/grandmother to a daughter/granddaughter hinting at wanting a grandchild/great-grandchild.

As a compliment it is probably going out of style. Too be honest though, I'm not sure it was ever used much as a direct compilment, more often as a way to describe a person to others. The same way hourglass is used. I think I let myself get side-tracked on that one.

It might be better to say 'pear shaped' is intended as a complimentary way to describe a women to others. Much like 'barrel chested' might be for a guy. Just like a girl is unlikely to ever say, "I'm attracted to your barrel chested shape", a guy is unlikely to every say "I'm attracted to your pear-shaped/hourglass figure" (at least that I'm aware of).

It might be interesting to see how many people view pear-shaped as a complimentary way to describe a women, what part of the country they are from, and how large the community they grew up in was.

For example, as a rural country kid (town of 7,000, 2nd largest in the county which is bigger than some states in the NE) in the Pacific NW, pear-shaped is definately a compliment.

 

[Ladyazh]

I have a fresh one - I was talking to people last night you know? So Pear shaped is s description of a man with narrow shoulders and big butt!!! What do you say to that?

 

[RCorrigan]

Ladyazh

But don't men put on weight differently (see ref to apple shaped earlier on in 1st thread) ???
Most blokes with big butts are big shouldered, big gutted, big thighed etc !!!!!!

<Do I need A Signature or will an X do?>

 

[Ladyazh]

You said MOST I think theis is where it all came from, there are few with Pear shaped figures but everyone knows that shape. I think it can also pertain to the geographics and food consumprtion habits. So it is not a compliment if spoken about men (nor women if to believe everyone esle).

So summary would be it is deformation of the shape - Pear Shape, isn't it?

 

[KenCunningham]

Maybe this discussion is just going pear-shaped too eh?

I don't mind people who aren't what they seem. I just wish they'd make their mind up.

 

[Trevoke]

I'm not married, and I'm currently single, but I assure you there's no causal relationship between this and what I'm about to say.

If/when a lady/woman/tramp/girl/female asks, I will look, ponder, and then reply :
a) No, it makes you look fantastic
b) It doesn't compliment you at all. Wear something else.

"That time in Seattle... was a nightmare. I came out of it dead broke, without a house, without anything except a girlfriend and a knowledge of UNIX."
"Well, that's something," Avi says. "Normally those two are mutually exclusive."
-- Neal Stephenson, "Cryptonomicon"

 

[Stella740pl]

Do remind me. What's the correct answer when your wife asks "Does my bum look big in this?"

and

I said 'don't ask unless you really want to know because I won't lie and one day you might be offended by the answer'


I guess I am somewhat atypical woman.
I do want to know. But I don't ask at the time when I get dressed. It's too late. I ask when I just bought the thing and brought it home (my husband doesn't go shopping for my clothes, and often not even for his). So I try it on, I ask "So what do you think?" (I would never ask about any particular body part. What's the point?) If I see a smirk, or if he hesitates to answer, or says something like "How to tell you... It's... I don't know...", I wouldn’t try to kill him. I just take the garment back to the store at my nearest convenience. If he approves it, I don't need to ask at any later time, I already know. It is not in his best interest to lie, also; he is interested to prevent me from spending on things that I wouldn't want to wear later, and to insure me looking my best when we go somewhere. Well, if I did buy it without showing it to him for an approval, because I just had to have it, then I don't ask at all. Makes sense?

 

[Ladyazh]

Trevoke,
I hope she wil find you in a fine 'gentleman' stage as you are now. I usually get a laugh instead of an answer, not that I care

 

[rjoubert]

Stella...you should never take fashion advice from a male. What do we know about fashion. Give us a pair of jeans and a t-shirt, and we're set.

 

[Trevoke]

That much is true. And it's all in wearing the clothes, too.

A woman, even dressed in a potato sack, will easily look like she came from Dior.
A man, coming from Dior, will easily look like he's dressed in a potato sack.

"That time in Seattle... was a nightmare. I came out of it dead broke, without a house, without anything except a girlfriend and a knowledge of UNIX."
"Well, that's something," Avi says. "Normally those two are mutually exclusive."
-- Neal Stephenson, "Cryptonomicon"

 

[Stella740pl]

Stella...you should never take fashion advice from a male.

You misunderstood.

It's in no way a fashion advice.

It's, basically, another way (or, I would say, a better way) of asking "Does it flatter me or should I wear something else?"/"Does my whatever-part look bigger in this than it might in something else?" - nothing to do with fashion.

It is just that that from all the fashion trends I would choose only those that are flattering to me personally, not some generic woman - and I do it at the stage when I still can return the thing.

And believe me, he does know what's flattering and what's not, and it is all I am asking.

 

[AlexCuse]

I didn't want to say this, lest I offend anyone who actually does feel that pear-shaped is a compliment, but a 'pear-shaped figure' is actually one of the first easily noticeable symptoms of type 2 diabetes...

For what it's worth, I don't think pear shaped could ever be complimentary to a woman anyway. It would imply that she is flat-chested. And as every guy knows, no woman is flat-chested or large-chested, they are always just right (even when flat-chested or large-chested).

Alex

Professor: But what about your superintelligence?
Gunther: When I had that there was too much pressure to use it. All I want out of life is to be a monkey of moderate intelligence who wears a suit. That's why I've decided to transfer to Business School.
Professor: NOOOOOOOOOOOO.

 

[fumei]

Hmmmmm, there are some wild generalities here. ALL men are happy in jeans and a t-shirt? Hardly.

A man, coming from Dior, will easily look like he's dressed in a potato sack.

Perhaps not, if he bought something. Mind you, in most cases it would only look good if a woman helped him....

I totally understand what Stella is talking about. It is not "fashion" being looked for/asked about, it is a seeking for appropriateness and what is complimentary.

My wife would always ask me about colour. It would go - "You're the artist...does this work?" I have a lot of women friends - I would be included in my wife's "sister" gatherings - and it IS a bit of a minefield, from a male's perspective. You just have to to get the subtle language layers.

However...shape? Ohhhh, that is a hard one. One has to be careful.

I remember one time a woman friend was visiting and asked about a new dress, in the "do I look fat in this" vein. I looked at her, and...well,she did. What I said was:

"No, not at all but, hmmmmm, it seems to bunch up a bit here." And I gathered some material at her waist and tugged it a bit, and got into a serious discussion about the hemline seemed a bit off, but if you did these wee alterations here, and here etc etc etc. All the while complimenting the colour etc etc.

She listened and decided that getting alterations was too much bother and she would take it back. When she left my wife burst out laughing and said that was the most diplomatic performance she ever witnessed. "She looked terrible!"

Gerry
My paintings and sculpture

 

[Ladyazh]

I am always amazed when people ask other people for fashion advice and I think one people just like me invented a mirror!!!

 

[Stella740pl]

What you see in the mirror, you see, well, with your own eyes, so it, most often than not, is highly subjective. There are two main kinds of people, though: those that tend to flatter themselves, and thus see in the mirror what they want to see; and those with low self-esteem, so they tend to see a much poorer image in the mirror than exists on the other side of it.

Very few people actually see themselves as objectively, as an average other person would. Besides, have you seen flattering mirrors (most often in big stores, though), with complimentary lights, and many other things to make you buy the thing.

Of course, other people subjective, too, but they tend to be more objective in seeing other people than themselves - and you can see other people from more angles than you can see yourself.

I see you are programmer, too. Did it ever happen to you that you were screening your own program for the hundredth time looking for the cause of the error you got, and couldn't find what's wrong with it. Then someone else steps in with a "fresh set of eyes" and finds it right away. This is, in a way, is a similar process. Or you could compare it with getting a second medical opinion.

Of course, you should trust the person you ask to be your extra pair of eyes - known to say the truth, not hide it.

Of course, I use that mirror thing, too, to get the first opinion, and a trusted person to get a second or third opinion. So if that second or third opinion is, for some reason, unavailable, then the only thing I would do is to trust what my own eyes see in that mirror thing.

Another note... Those people in that other thread that wear tube tops even though they shouldn't wear them, I bet, did see themselves in the mirror - and liked what they saw. They just didn't have anyone they can trust to give them more or less objective second opinion. I don't want to be in their shoes.

 

[Ladyazh]

other people subjective as you are", correct!
So who knows you best - YOU! Why to ask another subjective opinion that can be build on envy to your beauty, cheapness of the person who suppose to shed money for it, person who see you differently then you see yourself etc. List is endless. I think you do least damage to your image if YOU decide if you like the way YOU look. Just mu humble opinion.

btw those in tube tops look really happy having all of 'them' coming out of it and I am sure they were asking people around but who has a courage to tell the truth to a fashion impared?

 

[Stella740pl]

"other people subjective as you are", correct!
Of course you would find it correct if you quote yourself. I didn't say this phrase. It is your interpretation.

Why to ask another subjective opinion that can be build on envy to your beauty,
Yeah, right. Like my husband, for example. Or I used to ask my brother, when I was younger. I don't ask girlfriends.

cheapness of the person who suppose to shed money for it,
Oh sure. I make not less than he does.
And I know the size of our joint budget just as well as he does - and I am a responsible person.

person who see you differently then you see yourself etc.
Of course differently. That's why I am asking. Do I really need another me?

I am sure they were asking people around but who has a courage to tell the truth...?
Well, and I ask a person who I know would tell me the truth, and I would listen and not take an offence if I don't like his opinion. And might find that he is right.

Just mu humble opinion.
Exactly. And this is mine. I said above that I might be "somewhat atypical woman".

Of course yours may also be based on the fact that "I usually get a laugh instead of an answer, not that I care "

I usually get something to the effect of what Trevoke said:
a) No, it makes you look fantastic
b) It doesn't compliment you at all. Wear something else.
And I prefer it this way.
And from reading fumei's post I can see that he does something like this, too, even though not so straight forward.

So what's the point to argue?
I do it the way that is best for me, you do it the way you like it.

 

[Ladyazh]

It was not about YOU personally Stella. It was about every woman in general. Other women have husbands too and some of them forbidd them from spending money on clothes. I am just secure enough to not to ask anyone's opinion about my looks - that is it. It turned into 'so much ado about nothing' and I am sorry it turned out to be this way.

 

[SantaMufasa]

Okay...there's a reason that I have waited until reply #36 to "weigh in" on this matter.

I have been happily married to the same (beautiful) woman since 1973 (33 years for the maths impaired). And there is a reason for the above "facts". She is "beautiful" for many reasons, not the least of which is that she chose to marry (and stay married to) me.

When she asks, "Does this make my butt look big," she already knows whether or not it makes her butt look big...what she doesn't know for sure is whether or not my assessment of her beauty has changed in the last 10 minutes from what my assessment was 33 years ago.

If she has to ask me that question, then I am not doing my job of reassuring her of my love for her and my appreciation of her eternal beauty. If I were doing my job right, when she starts trying on clothes (whether they make her butt look big or not), I should be saying (without prompting,) "Wow! How do you stay so beautiful?"

Also, if she really wants to know which outfit to wear (since each outfit will probably make her butt look approximately the same size), ask her to lay multiple outfits out on the bed and allow you to choose an appropriate selection for the event that will do the best job of complimenting and complementing her natural beauty.

And if you don't want her to make the mistake of spending money on something that is truly garrish, then take the time to go outfit shopping with her and you become part of the selection process so that when the appropriate time comes you can say with honesty, "I've always liked that outfit on you...And I've always liked you."

Sorry to go sappy on everybody, but I just could not stand by silently any longer.

Mufasa
(aka Dave of Sandy, Utah, USA)
[I can provide you with low-cost, remote Database Administration services: see our website and contact me via www.dasages.com]

 

[Ladyazh]

Brilliant! No woman can say it is not true!
"she already knows whether or not it makes her butt look big...what she doesn't know for sure is whether or not my assessment of her beauty has changed" and I appload to Dave for being such insighfull husband. I bet your wife is one happy woman! I wish she read this thread.

 

[Stella740pl]

Thanks for "weighing in", Santa.

I always value your opinion, even though not always 100% agree with it.

(since each outfit will probably make her butt look approximately the same size)
Not really. Some will make her look much better that others (or make the butt seem smaller than it is, and she knows that for fact. But, on the other hand, maybe she should appreciate the fact that she is equally beautiful to you in every one of them. But if she does want to know the truth about the outfit and to have an extra set of eyes, not reassurance of your love, she might want to ask, say, one of your kids instead. ;-)

If I were doing my job right, when she starts trying on clothes (whether they make her butt look big or not), I should be saying (without prompting,) "Wow! How do you stay so beautiful?"
Well, that's probably not what I want to hear from my husband when I am still thinking whether to keep the thing or to take it back. There are plenty of other situations where he can/does reassure his love, and this is not one of them. To compliment on the garment which does not look good on me is not what I want him to do - I am secure enough to take his opinion without extra flattery and reassurance.

And if you don't want her to make the mistake of spending money on something that is truly garrish,
then take the time to go outfit shopping with her and you become part of the selection process
Hm. Better not, I would say. As I found out, it would save sanity to both of us if he didn't. It's much better if I made the pre-selection without him, then brought home for an approval - to make him part of the selection process and to save me from making a mistake.

so that when the appropriate time comes you can say with honesty, "I've always liked that outfit on you...And I've always liked you."
Exactly. With honesty. And sometimes something like:" When did you get this? I didn't remember you had that, but you look really good in it."