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Nonsensical idioms 1

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sleipnir214

sleipnir214

Programmer
May 6, 2002
15,350
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I have had a multiyear ongoing debate with an Australian friend of mine who uses the idiom "flat as a tack". I've pointed out on numerous occasions that the salient feature of a tack is that it's sharp, not flat.

Does anyone have another example of an idiom that seems to defy common sense?

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TANSTAAFL!!
 
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If we're going for things being mis-interpreted, I seem to remember that the "Thumbs Up" given by a Roman Emperor meant that 1 gladiator should kill another, so thumbs up does indeed mean "yes" but it is now used to symbolise something good happening / everything being ok - quite the reverse of its original meaning.

Rgds, Geoff

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Talking of digits, as we now appear to be, the 'V' sign popularly used to express a, let's say, 'contrary view' in the UK is apparently the result of British longbowmen being threatened with having the fingers they used to draw back the bowstring chopped off if captured by the French in one of the intermittent squabbles between the two countries long ago. Apparently, the bowmen took it upon themselves to wave the two fingers in a V formation towards the French to illustrate their contempt at such a threat. Who said l'entente cordiale was dead?
 
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KenCunningham:
Yeah, that hand-signal is the English sticking it to the French for most of the last 600 years.

The Battle of Agincourt, October 25, 1415, where an English force comprised primarily of logbowmen under Henry V defeat a numerically superior French force comprised of a great number of armored cavalry. At one point in the battle, Henry didn't have enough men to guard the prisoners he had taken, so he ordered the prisoners killed. More French taken prisoner by Henry died when a building in which they were being held burned down.

The battle is militarily famous because it demonstrated the effectiveness of lightly-armored troops and armor-piercing weapons against mounted armored cavalry and because it is one of those battles where the victory went to the most numerically inferior force.

The battle is literarily famous because it is immortalized in Shakespeare's play, [/u]Henry V[/u]. The "Band of Brothers" monologue is a survivor of the Battle of Agincourt talking about his experiences. The "St. Crispian's Day" mentioned in the monolog is October 25th -- the date of the battle.

Legend has it that the French were so incensed at the loss and treatment of prisoners by Henry that Charles VI declared that any English longbowman found on French soil would have his bow fingers cut off. The "v-sign" is England's way of saying "here are my bow fingers -- come cut them off"



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useless trivia time,

pulling your leg, get your leg over, and pull the other one all come from the days of the british navy.

where there were women on the ships. the deck master in the morning would call out "get your leg over" which was a que for the women on board to stick there leg the side of the hammock so the deck master would know.





Filmmaker, gentleman and i have a new site coming soon..
 
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Tack, in the nautical sense, is a rope. We still use it that way in "block and tackle". My guess would be the the idiom in question emphasizes the flat head rather than the sharp point of the tack. It's sort of a glass is half empty/glass is half full arguement as to who is right.

 
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Legend has it that the French were so incensed at the loss and treatment of prisoners by Henry that Charles VI declared that any English longbowman found on French soil would have his bow fingers cut off. The "v-sign" is England's way of saying "here are my bow fingers -- come cut them off"
Click to expand...

It is interesting, however, that the french do not see the "V"s as insulting!

Take Care

Matt
If at first you don't succeed, skydiving is not for you.
 
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Concerning Break a leg:
If I'm not very mistaken, the "Break a Leg" wish has nothing to do with any "break" - it has been adapted. The "original" would then be the German "Hals und Beinbruch", i.e. "Break neck and leg!", which itself has its origin in Yiddish "Baruch".
Whilst the original "Baruch" means "Health", "Bruch" means break.
Strange how orthographical "corrections" can reverse meanings. :-D

Concerning "Flat as a tack"
i have just found somehting in my dictionary:
It also defines tack as some dry, twice-baked bread, eaten on ships - this would certainly be flat.

Any marine onboard who could confirm this? :cool:
 
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No Marine, but this is certainly a use of 'tack' have come across, and one which makes more sense in 'flat as a tack' terms. Unless, of course, we're referrring to the flatness a tack would be imbued with if it were driven flat to the surface of a piece of wood.
 
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MakeItSo,

Have to correct you in some details. "Baruch" is actually a Hebrew word from at least the times of Torah (Old Testament). It's where it came from to Yiddish, and it doesn't actually mean "Health" in both languages, it means "Blessed", as in "Blessed the Lord" in the beginning of most if not all Jewish prayers and graces. For a quick reference I found the following:
and then you click on the word in question or go right here:

Stella
 
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Hi Stella,

just wanted to state the rough meaning of baruch towards the leg breaking - but thanks a lot for the correction and research, interesting details! ;-)

Following that course, I've found that the orignial "Hals und Beinbruch" was
"hazloche un broche", meaning "be blessed and successful" or freely translated:
"live long and prosper!"
-23.gif
 
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MakeItSo,

...thanks a lot for the correction and research
No problem, I did a quick research only because I already knew the meaning. :)

I've found that the orignial "Hals und Beinbruch" was "hazloche un broche", meaning "be blessed and successful"...
... the German "Hals und Beinbruch", i.e. "Break neck and leg!"...
Wasn't it a great transformation, and what's interesting, the literal meaning of the words changed to the opposite, but the loose meaning of the phrase in whole was preserved.

 
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Right, Stella!
P.S: In the area I come from, we have an old idiom saying "One day I'll throw a rock in your garden too", which actually means "Thanks a lot for your help, I owe you something!"
This is about as nonsensical as I can imagine...[lol]
 
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Unless it is a rock garden.

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
 
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MakeItSo,

In the area I come from, we have an old idiom saying "One day I'll throw a rock in your garden too"
What area is that (if it's not a secret)?

In the area I come from, the expression that can be translated as "[to throw] a rock in someone's [vegetable] garden", have a meaning of being critical towards that person, although it's hard to translate the meaning exactly. It can be used as following (just one example):

A persong is saying more or less publicly: "And some people present here had the impudency of doing/saying such and such". You, knowing that it could very well be a hint about you, say to the person talking or a person sitting next to you: "What is it, a rock in my garden?"

 
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Glen:[lol] That's a good one...
stella740pl: No secret...
2.gif

I'm from the Palatinate/Germany, about 15 kms from Ramstein Airbase.
 
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xmsre,

"It's sort of a glass is half empty/glass is half full arguement as to who is right"

To the Optimist, the glass is half full.
To the Pessimist, the glass is half empty.
To the Engineer, the glass is the wrong size.

Ha Ha!
 
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