IT Career Dilemma! 1

[TwistedAdmin]

Hey all,

I've been involved in the IT field now, intermittently, since 1991. In 2000, I hit what I thought was a milestone, landing a job as a network administrator. Things were going great until the company was sold to its biggest competitor and I eventually found myself a casualty of 'down-sizing' in December of 2002.
Until January of '05... I struggled along by picking up the odd-ball consulting job and juggling 3 part-time jobs to make ends meet. In January of '05, I landed a full-time job for a small 'mom-and-pop' computer/copier business. I've been with this company since. The pay's not the best, but it isn't the worst. The major drawback is there isn't any health coverage (it costs the employee around $900/month if he/she wants it).
However, two weeks ago, one of the company's clients, came out of left-field and offered me a full-time position with the company as their network admin. The pay is $15k more annually and they offer full medical benefits. The company is also MUCH more lucrative and in a less volatile industry.
My dilemma... go with this new company... or stay with the my present employer. My present employer has been 'talking' about making me and two other employees partners of the company. I am 'the man' when it comes to computers and networking and related sales and service with my present employer. Talking to him today about this issue resulted in the dreaded 'counter-offer'. On top of that of course is feeling 'guilty' for wanting to leave... and the fact that it will be very tough for the owner to replace me with a similarly skilled individual for what he was/is paying me.
Lots more to this... but that's the core of it right now. Input would be greatly appreciated. And I apologize if this doesn't fit in the present forum.

Sincerely,
TwistedAdmin


[ A+ Certified, Net+ Certified ]

"Old men are always young enough to learn."

~ Aeschylus

 

[langleymass]

How does guilt serve you in this matter? What has your current employer done for you to encourage you to stay? Employers talk about doing things for their employees all the time. What does it mean anyway if you are made a partner?

This is a no-brainer. Take the new job.

 

[dgillz]

Unless being a partner actually gets you more money, either now or down the road, whats the point? Being a partner potentially puts you at considerable personal liability and risk.

I agree with langleymass. Take the new job. Put in your notice and never look back.

Software Sales, Training, Implementation and Support for Macola, eSynergy, and Crystal Reports

http://www.gainfocus.biz

 

[tazuk]

Just an echo of the two previous replies here - take the job.
"Talking about" doesn't equal doing - I've fallen for that one in the past and paid dearly.

TazUk

Blue-screening PCs since 1998

 

[Spirit]

You can be as loyal as you like to a company but a company will NEVER be loyal to you.

Go with you heart, there's no right or wrong answer as longs as at the end of it all you can say "yup, don't regret doing that one bit"

Good luck.

Iain

P.S. Mmmmmmm $15k extra!

 

[LadySlinger]

IMO? What's the dilemma? $15K extra, plus medical benefits in a less volitile industry?

Sure its a little heartbreaking when a job doesn't work out, but if you spent the past 5 years struggling, go with something that rewards you for your struggles.

Also, the "talk" of making you a partner is just talk until actions get going.

 

[rkolva]

Many years ago I was the 'right hand man' for a small food service franchisee (bagels). He relied on my efforts to manage the existing locations and train new management so that he could concentrate on finding new locations. There was for many years some veiled talk about becomming a 'partner' while we worked 16 hour days. That didn't happen until I had finally had enough and he made a few of the managers that I had hired and trained for many years his limited partners. To this day I'm not sure i did them a dissservice or not. Partnership essentially meant they were locked into the running the stores for no return for many years. Eventually all the stores were sold and I hope my former collegueges eventually realized a good return on their efforts.

I would echo the advice of the other posters. Unless your employer is ready to open his books and step up to the plate to make you a definitive offer that works for you I would take the other offer. It sounds like he has benefited from your loyalty long enough without properly compensating you. Don't wait until you find out that money is where the loyal really lies. Like it or not that is, unfortunately, far too often the truth.

 

[kHz]

What does partner mean? More money? Benefits? When? Why now?

$15,000 + health insurance! You are gambling with your own future without insurance.

What is there to think about?

 

[Grenage]

Indeed. I wouldn't give a second thought to it, personally. Take the job!


Carlsberg don't run I.T departments, but if they did they'd probably be more fun.

 

[TwistedAdmin]

In response to Langleymass... the guilt comes into play because the owner has become quite dependent on me to run the IT side of the business. I'm pretty sure that he's going to have a hell of a time finding someone with my skill-set and experience that'll work for the same pay-rate and lack of benefits. I know it seems ridiculous to feel guilty... I mean, it's just business, right?


To dgills, becoming a partial owner of the company would mean, for me, would mean that the company would provide for my car payment, car insurance and gas costs. There'd be additional tax write-offs... I'm just not sure what all they'd be at the moment.

LadySlinger... yes, it actually is sort of heart-wrenching. This is a small company, and I have a great relationship with all of the employees, the owner and his family. So, its not as cut-and-dry as working for a corporation is (been there in the past, done that).

Now, as an update... I had a meeting with the owner this morning prior to a joint sales-call we were scheduled for. He informed me that, "after further consideration of the matter", he's tired of losing his technicians every other year to higher paying employees... and that he willing to match my present offer.

A couple of things about all of this don't sit well with me... why now? Basically, I've been worth this the whole time, but you're just now willing to pay me what I'm worth? Also, where's this money coming from? And what happens when things get tight financially? Who's the first one targeted for liquidation?

I have a feeling the general consensus here is right... I think the new job offer is the way to go.


TwistedAdmin



[ A+ Certified, Net+ Certified ]

"Old men are always young enough to learn."

~ Aeschylus

 

[kHz]

He may be saying that... but it's where the rubber meets the road that matters, because talk is cheap. Why you? Why didn't he want to lose others? And don't kid yourself. Your skills are not special. No matter who you are there is ALWAYS someone else who knows more.

 

[dennisbbb]

Let's take this a little further..

This is all a theory..

Being a small company and tight on funding.. I'm assuming you are getting paid $60K/year tops. With the new company, you will be making $75K/year+Health.

The owner will have to counter offer you at least $10K more than the new company ($85K/year+Health or roughly $90K/year). This extra amount is to compensate you as insurance due to the company's volatility. (Being the main "man" of the house, you should be at 6th digit income already, with or without insurance.)

I have to say.. if he's not giving you at least $90K, don't even bother.. he'll just have to move on with the next guy.

p.s. the income amount is just to paint a better picture of your delimma.

 

[LadySlinger]

I think there is too much to question. If the owner couldn't pay a competing salary to technicians, then he should expect a high turnover.

Small companies can be good to work for as you become the big fish in the small pond easily. In corporate worlds, the competition can be tough to get ahead and get noticed, so it's easier to quit them then smaller companies where everyone knows your name.

Sounds like the other employees didn't give him a fighting chance. You do what you have to do though. Again, I'd go for the new job.

 

[mikeydidit]

TwistedAdmin


I was pretty much in the same position that you are in. I was on call 24/7 and never had anyone mention anything about on call pay. I was offered a job that offered on call pay ($2.00 an hour for every other week) and a $3.00 an hour raise. I came back and put in my notice. My director looked at it and said “I will see what I can do." They matched the offer.

It worked out good for me, as I had already been here for 16 years at the time. Looking back on it, I think I really just made them get off their butts and pay me a little closer to what I should have been making to begin with. But in business, if you get the same job done by the same person for less money for ?? number of years; you saved your company lots of money.

It could also be that they didn’t want me to leave here too. Like you, I have them sort of spoiled around here...

Good luck to you either way.



"Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something."
(Plato)

 

[ctopher06]

IMO, if they "talk" about making you partner, it isn't so ... it's just talk. They would make the decision, then let you in. Take the new company.

Chris

 

[dennisbbb]

I have to add, a company that is about to make drastic changes to it's management structure is not a profitable company anyhow.. Move on ASAP.

 

[NetworkGhost]

What ifs are never absolute. Just like ctopher said, talk is talk. Dont believe anything until it is in writing. Do whats best for you and your family of you got them. This field is still competitive and will continue to be as long as we (the tech field) force them to be. Outsourcing is crap and evrybody knows it. There is nothing a customer hates more than to be talking to abdul in India or Princess in the PI about their network issues. When Big business puts the customer first again, outsourcing is dead. Sorry about the rant. Take the Job, If your boss can match consider it. Chances are they wont. And I guarantee they will regret it after you are gone. Ive been in the same scenario and left for the bigger job in a bigger company and have had my old company ask for me back but by them my new company gave me a raise that my old company couldnt match. Companies that are willing to onvest in their IT are few but when you find one take it.

 

[spi200]

Hi

Get out of the mom and pop company. If they valued you they would be paying you more. I was in a similar situation and two of my work friends and I were offered shares in the company so we could share in the profits of our hard work. I left the company and became an Admin for a little more dollars, my friends stayed and busted their arse for another year and waited for the profits to be distributed. They got stuff all and could not understand where all teh money had gone, so they hacked the accounts system (MYOB) and discover the owner had everyone including his house cleaner and 15 year old son on the payroll. He had upgrade his BMW and had enough money allocated to repairs he could run another car for his wife. My friends had been used, promises of more money only ever came when they complained and threatened to leave. Well one day one of them went on a service call and never came back (now a bartended) and the other became a prision officer, both were burn't out as the boss just kept driving them. My company grew at 20 to 30 % per year, listed on the stock exchange and I am making twice I was earning 4 years ago. Training was also not existent at the old company, but now have been learning new things and I have been in the inductry for 23 years, so I know the importance of keeping upto date. Once upon a time I was teh best techo on an OS which does not even exist any more, go figure. Had to go and learn Netware and Lotus Notes and now Microsoft and VMWARE, it just does not stop.

Take the money and run.


Dave

 

[TwistedAdmin]

Thank you to everyone for your input. With a few new recent events, and your feedback, I've decided to opt for the new company. My start date is the 15th and my new office will be completed next Friday.

Cheers!


[ A+ Certified, Net+ Certified ]

"Old men are always young enough to learn."

~ Aeschylus

 

[LadySlinger]

Congratulations! and thanks for the update!