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Income for CNE - How much do you make? 8
- Thread starter mark01
- Start date
AndreaGilbreath
Instructor
The job market in Alabama has been dreadful for the past year. All the certifications in the world won't get you a position when there are no positions to be had. Since the few jobs available have been MS-oriented, most of the Novell folks here have let their Novell skills and certifications languish.
I really like Novell's stuff and have stayed current even though MS consulting has been paying my bills. I got a call a couple of weeks ago from an engineering firm here in Birmingham that had heard about me and asked me to come in for a visit. They're having trouble finding good Novell engineers for their clients. I like 'em, am signing a contract today and starting full time tomorrow at a salary in the 70's. I have an MCNE and a CNI plus years of experience, but the benefits at this place are great, the people are even greater, and the salary is enough for my family to live on. I'm delighted with the chance to work with these guys. Personally, I'd rather make less and work for an outstanding boss than make a fortune and work for a bone-headed jerk.
Tony is so right. Even though my existing certifications are up to date, I've put over 40 hours (unpaid, on my own time) of hard study in during the last week because I'll be responsible for a BIG GroupWise 6 consolidation project. My GroupWise has always behaved perfectly. Consequently, I don't know the product that well. You learn a lot more when a product breaks frequently than when it just hums along.
One more word on training.... It makes a difference. I had not taken a GroupWise class since 4.x and didn't really study the material then. I'm digging into the 370 manual for all I'm worth and making electronic flash cards to memorize the dreadful stuff. Can't believe the difference. I've had a GW 6 system running for months on my SOHO server and didn't have a clue about most of the powerful new features and management utilities. I sort of treated it like GW 5.5 and it has worked fine - but it will sure work better now that I've got the training.
I really like Novell's stuff and have stayed current even though MS consulting has been paying my bills. I got a call a couple of weeks ago from an engineering firm here in Birmingham that had heard about me and asked me to come in for a visit. They're having trouble finding good Novell engineers for their clients. I like 'em, am signing a contract today and starting full time tomorrow at a salary in the 70's. I have an MCNE and a CNI plus years of experience, but the benefits at this place are great, the people are even greater, and the salary is enough for my family to live on. I'm delighted with the chance to work with these guys. Personally, I'd rather make less and work for an outstanding boss than make a fortune and work for a bone-headed jerk.
Tony is so right. Even though my existing certifications are up to date, I've put over 40 hours (unpaid, on my own time) of hard study in during the last week because I'll be responsible for a BIG GroupWise 6 consolidation project. My GroupWise has always behaved perfectly. Consequently, I don't know the product that well. You learn a lot more when a product breaks frequently than when it just hums along.
One more word on training.... It makes a difference. I had not taken a GroupWise class since 4.x and didn't really study the material then. I'm digging into the 370 manual for all I'm worth and making electronic flash cards to memorize the dreadful stuff. Can't believe the difference. I've had a GW 6 system running for months on my SOHO server and didn't have a clue about most of the powerful new features and management utilities. I sort of treated it like GW 5.5 and it has worked fine - but it will sure work better now that I've got the training.
TechieToday
MIS
I'm a CNA as well as A+, and MCP with approx. 2,5 years experience. Working in New York making, 38,500. Im thinking I should be making more, just wondering if im in the position of asking for more, or am I lucky to be making what I'm making. Just want to pick your brains on this one. Any insight would help. Thanks a bunch!
I would say that with your experience and credentials you should be making closer to $45 - $50K per year. The interesting thing is, that there are jobs out there that will pay better, the only issue I see you facing is now you are in a position to play "Catch Up" because your salary is much lower. That being said, if you cant get the employer to pay more, get them to pay for the education so you can get more.
Mark C. Greenwood, CNE
m_jgreenwood@yahoo.com
With more than 10 years experience to share.
Mark C. Greenwood, CNE
m_jgreenwood@yahoo.com
With more than 10 years experience to share.
I'm a CNA (from way back) and should go through as CNE but - no time! Been in the industry for about 13 years... I'm a network administrator/db admin/web super/application designer/network designer... o.k. I pretty much do a bit of everything but.. that's how I stay self employed for so long. Currently I'm hiring CNEs at a rate of $48.00 - 60.00/hr - CANADIAN! That is!
algernonsidney
MIS
Gervo,
What is "almost guarnteed"?
Chris
What is "almost guarnteed"?
Chris
- Thread starter
- #27
Hey, can't blame the guy for being ambitious. I have a college degree in MIS and 2 Novell Engineering Certs and I make $60K a year plus some pretty good benefits, but I also have included the knowledge of telecommunications so I have experience with DWDM, SONET, ATM, GIGE etc. including Voice, Video and Data communications.
I would say that real life experience does help, but if its the 50-60K a year job you seek, the college degree will help you get there in addition to any technical knowledge.
I would say that real life experience does help, but if its the 50-60K a year job you seek, the college degree will help you get there in addition to any technical knowledge.
- Thread starter
- #29
After 14 years, I'm making three times what I made when I graduated. Not as much as I'd like; but a lot better than many.
Follow Mark's advice. Don't sell yourself short. But don't let yourself become a commodity, either!! We don't want all out IT jobs shipped off to the newly democratic Iraqis!!
Dollarize your value according to the following formula:
(every dollar they pay you in salary and benefits)
(hourly rate x 2000 hours/year) x 1 = salary
salary x 0.75 = payroll taxes, benefits, and overhead
so your real cost is about 1.75 of what you get...
Now multiply it by 5 (i.e., 8.75)
In order to justify a salary of "X", you need to show that your actions can/will/are bringing in 8.75"X" in new business or cutting 8.75"X" in costs, or some combination that adds up to 8.75"X"...
For example, if you want a _salary_ of $80,000, you need to affect "the bottom line" by $700,000...
It's not impossible or improbable... but _you_ need to do the research for _your_ position...
TCO is Total Cost of Ownership: Assume you work in a place with 1,000 PCs and users... Assume internal billing rates for support are $65.00/hour...
700,000 / 1,000 PCs = $700.00
$700.00 is less than 1 hour per month of PC support... can you automate something and save an extra hour per PC per month?
The formulae are the same for "coding and rework" or any other thing... desired salary x markup / users affected
Good Hunting!!
JTB
Solutions Architect
MCSE-NT4, MCP+I, MCP-W2K, CCNA, CCDA,
CTE, MCIWD, i-Net+, Network+
(MCSA, MCSE-W2K, MCIWA, SCSA, SCNA in progress)
Follow Mark's advice. Don't sell yourself short. But don't let yourself become a commodity, either!! We don't want all out IT jobs shipped off to the newly democratic Iraqis!!
Dollarize your value according to the following formula:
(every dollar they pay you in salary and benefits)
(hourly rate x 2000 hours/year) x 1 = salary
salary x 0.75 = payroll taxes, benefits, and overhead
so your real cost is about 1.75 of what you get...
Now multiply it by 5 (i.e., 8.75)
In order to justify a salary of "X", you need to show that your actions can/will/are bringing in 8.75"X" in new business or cutting 8.75"X" in costs, or some combination that adds up to 8.75"X"...
For example, if you want a _salary_ of $80,000, you need to affect "the bottom line" by $700,000...
It's not impossible or improbable... but _you_ need to do the research for _your_ position...
TCO is Total Cost of Ownership: Assume you work in a place with 1,000 PCs and users... Assume internal billing rates for support are $65.00/hour...
700,000 / 1,000 PCs = $700.00
$700.00 is less than 1 hour per month of PC support... can you automate something and save an extra hour per PC per month?
The formulae are the same for "coding and rework" or any other thing... desired salary x markup / users affected
Good Hunting!!
JTB
Solutions Architect
MCSE-NT4, MCP+I, MCP-W2K, CCNA, CCDA,
CTE, MCIWD, i-Net+, Network+
(MCSA, MCSE-W2K, MCIWA, SCSA, SCNA in progress)
MrMajik
IS-IT--Management
- Apr 2, 2002
- 267
I began working for our State government's IT department almost 5 years ago. Graduated from college with a degree in networking and electronics and am a Novell CNA. I also have a pile of paper certificates from training classes.
I began in the computer industry in the early 90s and know how to program in six different languages including database development.
Technical help wanted ads around here are almost non-existant right now. The current economy conditions have created a bloat of technical people seeking employment.
I currently make around $40k and have real good benefits. It sure beats flipping burgers so I plan on staying right here. However, I keep looking for something better...
MrMajik
I began in the computer industry in the early 90s and know how to program in six different languages including database development.
Technical help wanted ads around here are almost non-existant right now. The current economy conditions have created a bloat of technical people seeking employment.
I currently make around $40k and have real good benefits. It sure beats flipping burgers so I plan on staying right here. However, I keep looking for something better...
MrMajik
What I use to do is study for a couple hours each night and on saturday I would do the practice exams... My wife also understood the benefits of getting this done. Now I have to update my CNE one more time, and just started getting into the NW 6 update self study. I hope to have that accomoplished by the end of October, if not, I will just go back to school and get my Masters degree. But I want my CNE 6 done too..so maybe I will do both...
HairyBanjo
Technical User
Just thought I'd chuck my 2 cents worth in here....
I graduated 6 years ago with a Masters of Engineering from a top Scottish University, went on to work for a Network Services team at a Swissbank in London. Started in support at a salary of 21K (pounds), then moved rapidly on to Projects for design and implementation - everything from LAN/MAN and WAN to BCP/DR sites and managing telco's, got to utilise all sorts of different technology. Finally designed their Optical MAN's for them, at that point I was earning 70K Per annum (pounds).
Throughout all this time, I was only sent on 2 Cisco courses and 1 Nortel course (yes, the company was a bit slack on training - promised lots, but delivered nowt), although we were a company that was using FCS of most Cisco and Nortel products and usually got free training. Never got any of their paper certifications, although I did do the training courses. I learned most of what I know by using/supporting/breaking the products, plus learning from my peers.
The point is, It's not just about Vendor training. I've met far to many CCNA's, CCNP's and CCDP's that couldn't tell a switch from an ADM, didn't know what an X.21 cable looked like and thought a torch is all you need to test optical fibre, But all wanted to earn top dollar cos they'd done the certification!.
Gaining experience in the field across a diverse range of technologies can and will serve you far better than just having some of these qualifications. Use the vendor qualifications to enhance and support your knowledge, not as the foundation of your knowledge.
Great thread BTW, nice to see how the job market has changed over the last few years!!
I graduated 6 years ago with a Masters of Engineering from a top Scottish University, went on to work for a Network Services team at a Swissbank in London. Started in support at a salary of 21K (pounds), then moved rapidly on to Projects for design and implementation - everything from LAN/MAN and WAN to BCP/DR sites and managing telco's, got to utilise all sorts of different technology. Finally designed their Optical MAN's for them, at that point I was earning 70K Per annum (pounds).
Throughout all this time, I was only sent on 2 Cisco courses and 1 Nortel course (yes, the company was a bit slack on training - promised lots, but delivered nowt), although we were a company that was using FCS of most Cisco and Nortel products and usually got free training. Never got any of their paper certifications, although I did do the training courses. I learned most of what I know by using/supporting/breaking the products, plus learning from my peers.
The point is, It's not just about Vendor training. I've met far to many CCNA's, CCNP's and CCDP's that couldn't tell a switch from an ADM, didn't know what an X.21 cable looked like and thought a torch is all you need to test optical fibre, But all wanted to earn top dollar cos they'd done the certification!.
Gaining experience in the field across a diverse range of technologies can and will serve you far better than just having some of these qualifications. Use the vendor qualifications to enhance and support your knowledge, not as the foundation of your knowledge.
Great thread BTW, nice to see how the job market has changed over the last few years!!
I have to add to this as well. My background is quite extensive, and how I gained it was by being tasked to learn something new with every new project. I didn't have the joys and pleasures of heading off to class, and to this date, I have not had any official Cisco training, learning to program a router or switch is easy, but being afraid of that technology is what will hurt you in the long run. It's a computer, a toy, a device that wants you to tell it what to do.
That bein said, I have gained knowledge and experience with Digital Microwave Radio networks, point-to-point and poin-to-multipoint wireless, DWDM, GIG-E, SONET, ATM, ATM over Sonet, ADSL.
Now I am going to throw a curve into this, the IT world from my point of view needs to look at how the Telecom Industry works. I went from IT to telecom, had my eyes opened, then back to IT, and the telecom industry does it right. Standards, engineering documentation, professionalism...its all there
That being said...enjoy...
Mark C. Greenwood, CNE
m_jgreenwood@yahoo.com
With more than 10 years experience to share.
That bein said, I have gained knowledge and experience with Digital Microwave Radio networks, point-to-point and poin-to-multipoint wireless, DWDM, GIG-E, SONET, ATM, ATM over Sonet, ADSL.
Now I am going to throw a curve into this, the IT world from my point of view needs to look at how the Telecom Industry works. I went from IT to telecom, had my eyes opened, then back to IT, and the telecom industry does it right. Standards, engineering documentation, professionalism...its all there
That being said...enjoy...
Mark C. Greenwood, CNE
m_jgreenwood@yahoo.com
With more than 10 years experience to share.
rmorrow2003a
IS-IT--Management
Have a BA in human psychology.
I'm A+, Network+, and I just completed CNE 5. I have 5 years
experience working as a tech for a medium sized public school system. Responsabilities cover maintaining/updating the network, working with and training staff, on site repairs, assisting in purchasing decisions,some administrative responsabilities, and any other duties
that are handed to me.
The job is good, rewarding, great benefits, and I'm
treated well. The pay is *low* at just a little over
$26,000 a year. I know I'm under paid, and while I'm
not greedy, I know that I can make more money.
*shrug*
Money certainly isn't *everything*,but sometimes it helps pay your bills. And something tells me that I'll soon be exploring other options.
-Rick
I'm A+, Network+, and I just completed CNE 5. I have 5 years
experience working as a tech for a medium sized public school system. Responsabilities cover maintaining/updating the network, working with and training staff, on site repairs, assisting in purchasing decisions,some administrative responsabilities, and any other duties
that are handed to me.
The job is good, rewarding, great benefits, and I'm
treated well. The pay is *low* at just a little over
$26,000 a year. I know I'm under paid, and while I'm
not greedy, I know that I can make more money.
*shrug*
Money certainly isn't *everything*,but sometimes it helps pay your bills. And something tells me that I'll soon be exploring other options.
-Rick
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