ibm 300pl aaaaaaaaaaaarrrrgghhh!!!! 1

[scottian]

ive just picked up an ibm 300pl with pentium 2 processor. it was runing win95 so i decided to upgrade to 98. but thats where the trouble started. it took me all day to get it to format the hard drive then all night to get it to recognise it. now im trying to install 98 and it wont give me the option of booting from the cd. ive tried every way i can think of, but no luck. it just goes to dos. my last thoughts were that it wont accept win 98. ive done a search on the web and found ibm 300pl's with win98 installed. so it must be possible.... but i cant get it// can anyone help me out

PLEASE

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[SESaskDFC]

Howdy:

Try going to

http://www.bootdisk.com

and downloading a Win98SE startup floppy.. Use that to fdisk and format the hdd and then install Win98..

Murray

 

[TekTippy4U]

Hi scottian;
Are you using a 98 OEM CD...?

Also...be VERY careful using Fdisk, concerning hidden partitions (IBM, COMPAQ, HP)and the BIOS code that may ne on the HDD itself..
Atleast; type
Fdisk /status
once you boot from floppy.

other thoughts;
-- The HDD may be dead....
-- You need

http://www.killdisk.com

first

TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[scottian]

ive moved n with this ivemanaged to work out how to format the hard drive, but i removed the hard drive and placed it in another PC formatted it and then installed the system. then put the hard drive back into th IBM but it wont find the system.
also i dont think im using 98 SE. is this the best operating system to use? That is without moving to one of the more security mad OS's such as NT or 2K

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[yada]

Windows 98 is fine. You shouldn't have to move the hard drive to another machine. Get a win98 start disc from a friend or e-mail for one. Set cmos to boot from the floppy first. Boot your machine with the "not from cd" option. At tha a prompt type c:\. At that prompt type fdisk. B
e sure you delete every partion on the hard drive. Reboot, go to fdisk again and make a primary dos partition. Reboot, at the a prompt, type format C: and let it format. Reboot and then select the cd support option, insert your win98 cd, and at the a prompt type "setup". That should do it for you.

 

[TekTippy4U]

The BIOS codewaslikely on the the HDD in that hidden partition I warned you about.
That's why the mobo won't recognize it

TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[scottian]

yada,
Ive done everything youve said, but no luck, I get an error on boot that no system was found, and then it prompts me for a boot floppy. I'm really going to have to 'go back to school' to sort this out.

cheers for the help everyone.

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[brassmann]

scottian,
yes it's possible to run win98/se on an ibm 300PL. I'm using the same thing right now with win98se. (ibm 300PL tower with p2-450, 256mb's ram). You shouldn't have to worry about deleting any special partitions or messing up the bios. it runs with an eeprom so it's easy enough to update it. if you're using a western digital drive, the wd install utility won't do a whole lot of good (at least not for the larger hdd's above 6-8gb's.) All you should have to do is run fdisk, use a standard win98/se boot disk and have an install cd whether it's oem or not. (mine installed fine with an oem disc). depending on what capabilities you have onboard (ie, crystal semiconductor sound chip, s3trio onboard video) you'll need to install the drivers for them. if you don't you'll be stuck with no audio and 16 color display (unless going with add-on audio/video cards) also, i believe the latest bios update for the 6862, 6872, 6892, 6893 models is nvjt58a which i have a copy of if you need to flash your bios. (also includes instructions/documentation of the file). Best of luck to you.

 

[scottian]

hope someone can point me in the right direction,
i still cant get this pc to boot, and i think its because the bios is contained on a partition of the hard drive but ive no idea how to set this up or how to install the bios, does anyone know of a website for idiots that will guide me thru the process?

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[Blujacket]

i think its because the bios is contained on a partition of the hard drive"
The BIOS is in the CMOS [Complementary Metal Oxide Semiconductor] in a socket on the motherboard, not the hard drive. The hard drive probably does have a type of BIOS soldered onto the interface card on it but that is generally not changeable.

The maker of the motherboard may have a BIOS update available but you'd have to check with them.

 

[scottian]

so, i have one reply telling me to be careful of hidden partitions that may contain the bios and i have another telling me the bios is stored in the cmos. hmm!
I know the bios should be stored in an 'eprom' (is that right?) but for some weird reason when i obtained this pc i found the start up disk sequence fairly easily, since ive formatted the drive i cant find the start up sequence.

is it right that the cd rom switches its letter from D: to E: if so i migth have cracked this.

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[TekTippy4U]

Scottian;
is it right that the cd rom switches its letter from D: to E:
Absolutely!
The RAMDrive created from the startup disc gets loaded to D:\....the CDROM gets pushed a letter (what letter?)
(depends on how many disk partitions there are).

Here's what I was talking about;
***************************
Hidden Partition - Compaq, HP, Packard Bell, IBM, Format, Install, System Restore issues

This FAQ pertains to older versions/styles of PC's listed above, and maybe some newer ones as well. This list should not be considered all-inclusive either.

This FAQ was intended to help users understand what difficulties occur, and why, when trying to
-Re-Partition,
-Re-Format,
-Re-Install the OS on one of the above branded PC's (usually older versions)

Compaq and IBM used a scheme similar to Flash ROM (iFlash, EEPROM), called IML (Initial Microcode Load), in some of their "older" Pentium and 486 Systems. IML is a technique in which the BIOS code is installed on the HDD (Hard Disk Drive) in a Special Hidden Partition. It is loaded every time the sytem is powered on or reset.

The System still has a core BIOS on the Motherboard, but all that BIOS does, is Locate and Load updated BIOS code from the Special HDD System Hidden Partition. This technique enabled Compaq and IBM to distribute BIOS ROM updates on a disk/diskette for installation into the HDD System Partition. The IML BIOS is loaded every time the system is powered on or reset.

This Special HDD System Hidden Partition also contains a complete copy of the Orig. System Setup and Diagnostics (or Reference disk), along with the BIOS code. This provides the option of running the Setup and System Configuration software at Anytime during the reboot process. This option eliminates the need to boot from the HDD to re-configure the system. It also gives the impression that the entire Setup and Diagnostics or Reference Disk is contained in the Motherboard BIOS ROM.

In short, basically, the MoBo BIOS is only a pointer to the Real BIOS code needed for booting, which is located on this HDD "hidden partition".

http://www.langa.com/newsletters/2003/2003-02-06.htm#1

*********************************
also;

"...Some Compaq computers store the system BIOS information in a non-dos or diagnostic partition on the hard drive instead of storing it on a chip on the motherboard as most other systems do. If you have such a Compaq model and you install the new drive as a master, you will need to copy or reinstall the diagnostic partition onto the new drive. If you don't, you will not be able to get into your BIOS upon bootup...."
In this case you are advised to use Data Lifeguard Tools, a WDC utility to rectify the problem.

http://support.wdc.com/tips/index.asp?tip=39

TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[TekTippy4U]

AND of all things ....after rereading all the posts....I can't believe nobody told you to SEt THE CDROM AS THE FORST BOOT DEVICE in the BIOS......I thought you couldn't acess the BIOS..

AND I also see that... Yada told you to set Floppy as first boot device..

With an OEM CD you can pound on your floppies with a sledgehammer if you like...You DON'T NEED THEM!!

If the CDROM is set as first Boot device and No CDROM drivers are loaded,(or a non-bootable CD is in the drive) then the PC will move on and look for an alternative to Boot from....ala floppy.

The problem comes in when the 2nd and 3rd Boot devices are out of order....
Should be CDROM 1st.., then, A: 2nd, C: 3rd....so it'll look to floppy 2nd, before a bad HDD..

I have mine at CDROM, C:\, A:\...I have an OEM CD and a CDRW drive....so floppies are Gone, Gone, Gone....forever


TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[scottian]

Tektippy,
thanks for the advice, this is exactly the clarity i was after.
so now all i need to do is find out how i create a hidden partition and how large it needs to be. i have downloaded the latest said flash bios file from IBM site. so im hoping that and fdisk is all i need.

thanks again.

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[TekTippy4U]

Scottian;
you're welcome
As I said in my very first post...be careful "before' deleting all partitions...once done it isn't that easy to recreate the mobo specific proprietary driver crud and BIOS and diagnostics 'hidden partition'.... Western Digital seems to have an answer, and a Compaq Restore CD (ordered thru them for ~$10)would do it too.

Ok,...question

Can you access your BIOS?
If so, can you get at all the normal BIOS setup functions?

You may not even need to worry about this 'hidden partiton' stuff at all.
I'm still trying to ascertain what is the exact problem
-- NO boot from CDROM?
-- NO access to BIOS parameters?
-- Do you have a Win98 SE OEM CD?
-- Are you seeing the HDD recognized on POST? along with CDROM drive? (IDE channels).

The Website you've obtained the BIOS flash update from, has the procedures outlined normally...

MAKE SURE you have the CORRECT update specific for your MoBo.
(In this case, as most iflash procedures go, you MUST set the BIOS to A:\ as First Boot Device again...change it back to CDROM after a couple of reboots and you're all done with the Flash).

You basically d/l the update and double click the .exe file to extract the contents to any Temp folder on the HDD (sometimes it's a zip file)....
Then you copy the contents , minus the original .exe and possibly the ReadMe.txt file, to a New, Clean, Formatted floppy...then write protect it....and then Boot from the floppy

Beware; some mobo's require you to move some jumpers on the Mobo BEFORE flashing.....Look around the website you've obtained the update from for exact precautions and procedures...

TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[TekTippy4U]

Scottian;

Here;s my canned instruction set for OS Installing using an OEM CD

The first three steps are for removing all old partitions....so skip to #4, yet review 1-3 for info for yourself..

======================================

Set your BIOS to CDROM as "First Boot Device" (not HDD, not Floppy)

Have your (C.O.A) Product Key handy (xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx)

With your OEM CD in the CD/DVD drive, restart,
After POST (Power On Self Test) use the up/down arrows to
Choose "Boot from CD-ROM" (or Startup floppy)
Choose "Start Computer with CD-ROM support"
Type Fdisk /status press "Enter" to view existing partitions ....to make sure that there's "NO" Non-Dos partitions...If so !!Stop Now!!, don't go any further and post back if you see Non-Dos partitions listed.

1. Floppy discs are NOT needed with an OEM 98 CD, yet it's good to have in a pinch anyway (Choose Yes to make a floppy DURING win98 Setup when you get there, this'll also put the entire contents of startup disc tools in the C:\Windows\Command folder for use later).

2. Print out your Device Manager Screen (doesn't apply to you)

3. Place the OEM CD in the drive and wait ten seconds (in case it autoruns) and go Start > Shut Down > Restart
Choose "Boot from CDROM" then
Choose (#2) "Start Computer with CD-ROM support" on next screen
type Fdisk and press Enter
Choose Yes to Enable Large Disk Support
(This is always the first Fdisk screen, no worry)
Use Fdisk to delete partitions in this order
1. Non Dos partition
2. Logical DOS drives in extended Dos partition (if any)
3. Extended DOS partition (if any)
4. Primary Active
Esc to exit fdisk
CTRL+ALT+DEL to restart

4. "Boot from CD-ROM" then
Choose (#1) "Start Windows98 Setup from CD Rom"
when asked "Setup Windows Now?" press Enter
Choose "configure unallocated HD space" (recommended)...press Enter
Select Yes to "Enable Large Disk Support" (see more info below)
Now Fdisk will run on it's own, unless you choose NO to Enable Large Disk Support
select Yes (most common) for "large disc support"(Fat32) as mentioned below...press Enter
It'll tell you "Setup will restart your computer now"...press Enter
Ignore the "make sure startup disc in Drive A:\ before restarting" (you have bootable CD)

Choose same Boot choices from above in Step #4
Upon Restart it'll automatically start Formatting the HDD...
once Format is complete and a restart

Choose same Boot choices fom above in Step #4
Win98 Setup now begins and asks if you would like to install to C:\WINDOWS (default)
I usually accept all the defaults.
choose "Typical Setup" for ease, you can customize components later from Control Panel>Add/Remove Programs>Windows Setup Tab (plus you want to make sure the OEM default Window components for your hardware are installed)
I let it assign "Computer Name", "Workgroup" and leave "Computer Description" blank (the defaults)(this can be changed later anyway)
Select your country and it starts copying files

Once the Windows installation is complete, the VERY FIRST next thing you should install is the Motherboard Chipset Drivers first...then follow up with all the other drivers.... Video Card, Soundcard, Mouse, Keyboard, Modem (if internal), and Network Card (NIC) if necessary.
Then install Programs (DVD Software, CD-RW Software, Office/Word Processor, Graphics, Greetings, Photo, etc...)

==============================================

Hope we're making progress here


TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[scottian]

tektippy4u,
thanks for this guide, i will print and keep in a safe place, unfortunately im working away from home this week so will need to wait until the weekend to try this. But i will let you know.
i think i have understood this correctly, by choosing start with CDrom support, i am taken to dos. by choosing start without CDrom support the PC should boot from the CDrom.
forgive me, i am a mac user, and this all seems a bit difficult


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[TekTippy4U]

by choosing start with CDrom support, i am taken to dos.
Will load the generic CDROM and SCSI drivers automatically (3-5% of really old....~'95 DROMs don't work.)
and your CDROM drive LETTER will be pushed back..

by choosing start without CDrom support the PC should boot from the CDrom
no, no, no..

Here's the deal; with the OEM CD in the CDROM drive, and the BIOS set to "Boot from CDROM" as first boot device, the following is true.....WHENEVER you try to Boot (OS installed or not installed) from an OEM CD, You are presented with 2 choices...
1. Boot from Hard Disk
2. Boot from CDROM

Once you choose #2 using the up/down arrows.
(it'll default to #1 usually with a 10 second timer, unless you choose).

You are then presented with another 3 choices
1. Start Windows98 Setup from CD ROM
2. Start Computer with CD-ROM Support
3. Start Computer without CDROM support

(the default timer here for a choice is usualy 30 seconds)

Ok??...clearer now???
It's all good scottian...you should stick with macs and *.nix systems anyway


TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[TekTippy4U]

Scottian;
More Info;
(revised 4 u)
Results of Booting from Win98 OEM CDROM;

Choosing (#2) "Start Computer with CDROM support", will load the generic CDROM and SCSI drivers automatically You end up at D:\ and in DOS mode usually (RAMDrive created from startup files) , with the Diagnostic tools loaded also, just like you booted from a Win98 Startup Floppy....
and your CDROM drive LETTER will be pushed back....
You're CDROM drive LETTER is usually E:\ for now....

(3-5% of really old....~'95 CDROMs don't work., and you'll have to use a Startup Floppy unfortunately and Edit the Config.sys and Autoexec.bat files to add the loading of CDROM drivers....AND...the actual correct CDROM Driver and the MSCDEX.EXE (MS CDrom Extensions) needs to be placed on the startup floppy as well).

Apple Mac Users Note;
FWIW; to all you Mac users...Windows does NOT run/boot the full OS from the CD, like you may be used to with an apple


TT4U

Notification:
These are just "my" thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs..All involved shall be spared the grief.

 

[dosxp]

Hi, Guys:

I wonder if the Hidden partition is a must for IBM laptop when I upgrade a 6gb HDD to 40gb HDD, and from win98se to winXP?

Thanks!

Sureming