Tek-Tips is the largest IT community on the Internet today!

Members share and learn making Tek-Tips Forums the best source of peer-reviewed technical information on the Internet!

Register Log in
  • Congratulations strongm on being selected by the Tek-Tips community for having the most helpful posts in the forums last week. Way to Go!

Frameset scaling problem 2

Status
Not open for further replies.
jamiebettles

jamiebettles

Technical User
Dec 15, 2005
23
DE
Hi there,

I've posted this message in the GoLive forum already but haven't had any responses so I was hoping somebody here could help me out...
I have a problem with this flash website im doing:


Its a basic 2 frame frameset made in golive, the top frame holds the navigation movie and the bottom holds the other pages which are flash movies of the same size. The problem is; the top frame is fixed but the bottom one floats around when you make the browser window bigger and smaller. I want both frames to be stuck to each other, so that it looks miles better and you won't ever have to scroll on either of the frames.
It is possible to do it easily with a table within a normal html page, but the advantage of a frameset is that wherever the user navigates on the site, the menu bar in the top frame stays the same...ie. the whole page including the menu at the top doesn't re-load every time the site is refreshed or a link is clicked.
Can anybody tell me how to fix the whole frameset in place, in the middle of the browser, like you can with a table? I'm guessing theres a way using the html script for the frameset, but I don't know what the script would be!

thanks a lot to anyone who can suggest a solution,

jamie
 
Sort by date Sort by votes
Clive,

With respect to you too, I don't think you've understood what I was trying to say. I said I thought it was a good workaround but could potentially add a lot of extra work (which I believe it could) when it could be simply be avoided by not using frames. All I'm trying to say is that all of these workarounds simply add to the complexity of the site when if the site had been made without frames then they wouldn't even be an issue.

When it comes to the subject of framesets it seems that you only want to discuss perceived disadvantages and ignore advantages and then pretend that framesets are the only part of web development that have problems that cannot possibly be solved.
Click to expand...
It's not that I don't want to discuss the advantages and in fact in these two threads on the subject, I've said "I really like the idea of having a quick response when I click a link, and that only certain parts of the page are refreshed as necessary", "I was easily able to navigate it and the response time was very quick" and "Frames can obviously be useful in some situations". Surely this shows that I can see some benefits - it's just that I believe the cons far outweigh the pros.

As I understand it from your comments, any solution to any problem must NOT rely on Javascript, neither must it cause any extra work from the developer and it can't be a workaround.
Click to expand...
I think the key word in that statement is [attn]must[/attn]. I do believe that solutions shouldn't rely on javascript - I think it should be used to compliment the site for those users that do have it, but that it should degrade nicely for those that don't. However, as for workarounds and extra work, yes of course this is going to be issue in any site that is created but I think it's best to reduce the amount of these that we have to do if that is possible. Why add to the problems that we already face?

OK! solve this problem. The user's requirement is that one portion of the screen remains stationary while the rest can scroll. No JavaScript, no extra work, no workarounds.
Click to expand...
Put simply, (and thanks for the leading question [smile]) I can't, but that's only because of IE! But, the "extra work" and workaround, in my opinion, is nowhere near the extra effort that you would have had to do for your bookmarking pages and it could be done very simply in a CSS file e.g.
Code: 
.fixed {
position:fixed;
top:50px;
_position:absolute;
_top:expression(body.scrollTop + 50 + "px");}


____________________________________________________________

Need help finding an answer?

Try the Search Facility or read FAQ222-2244 on how to get better results.

 
Upvote 0 Downvote
OK, fair enough - there's probably been way too much talk on this anyway!

[smile]


____________________________________________________________

Need help finding an answer?

Try the Search Facility or read FAQ222-2244 on how to get better results.

 
Upvote 0 Downvote
I get the drift of this thread that Frames are considered a no no these days but what is a better alternative to:-

A website where each of 35 pages has to have the same fixed header section and a fixed left hand nav bar. I am sure the CSS guys will have a floating panel type solution which works in most browsers except some of the more popular ones.
Personally, I would rather not use frames for some of the very valid reasons mentioned within this thread but I have found the 'modern' methods not to be as reliable.


Keith
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Only 35 pages?

I have websites with several hundreds of pages that all work in every browser in common use (and some that aren't) and not a frame or a table (for other than tabular data) in sight (or site even [smile]).

Chris.

Indifference will be the downfall of mankind, but who cares?
Woo Hoo! the cobblers kids get new shoes.
People Counting Systems

So long, and thanks for all the fish.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Thanks Chris but I was looking for some advice on how to approach the problem of fixed header sections without using frames.
A simple example, or a pointer to some worthwhile reading would be far more useful than cloaked sarcasm.

Keith
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Keith, If you see a handheld (or coding for a handheld) in your future I would recommend that you keep a frameset approach.

I upgraded to the 4.0 Blackberry operating system yesterday. Images are now transmitted and it is more important than ever to keep branding and menu separated from content.

Clive
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
I don't have any aims for hand held apps. but who knows what the future holds.
Most of my output is auto generated from PERL scripts and up to now, I have used frames as a means of constant header display. The pages are created on the fly so the number of pages is not important to me, what is important is clearly displayed information. Many of my clients specify static headers so their contact details are visible at all times, probably old hat but clear and concise.
The SEO issues with frames are a valid concern but I have never been able to find a method, whether CSS or otherwise, which reliably mimics the behaviour of frames and allows the static header.


Keith
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Keith, The only SEO issue is pointing to a page other than the index page. Since you are already using Javascript why not make a JS file:
Code: 
if (top.location == self.location)   {
    self.location.replace
    ("index.htm")
}
and point to it from each page.

Also if you combine branding and menu (preferably on the left) and then put a link to the home page from the content pages, the whole thing becomes less of an issue.

Clive
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
How about this:


Seems to work fine in what I've viewed it in so far (FireFox 1.5, Opera 8.51, IE6, IE5.5, IE5.01). IE4 sort of works but IE3 doesn't!


____________________________________________________________

Need help finding an answer?

Try the Search Facility or read FAQ222-2244 on how to get better results.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Fails to work in IE5.x where the whole page scrolls.
Click to expand...
And ??

what if the sites target audience do not generally use IE5 or NS4.x or [insert name of obscure browser] or even a blackberry

Personally Clive I don't care if you don't think it's a alternative to your beloved frames, It's actually up to Keith to decide if it is an appropriate solution that would suit the users of whatever site it may or may not be used on.

Plus does not help with multiple content pages.
Click to expand...
And this means ????



Chris.

Indifference will be the downfall of mankind, but who cares?
Woo Hoo! the cobblers kids get new shoes.
People Counting Systems

So long, and thanks for all the fish.
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Microsoft has been warning for sometime not to use the "* HTML" hack. It would be interesting to see if it works in the IE7 beta for those of you who installed it.
Click to expand...
Yes it does - I've just used IE7 and it still works fine...


____________________________________________________________

Need help finding an answer?

Try the Search Facility or read FAQ222-2244 on how to get better results.

 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Chris Hirst,
I suggest you read my post of 27 Jan 06 13:18. Also you might re-read thread253-962240.

You will note that in the thread all I asked for was:
I would be interested to know if this works with other handhelds if anyone would be kind enough to try it.
AND
Since there are plenty of threads on the frames debate I would just as soon not get into that. However, I would appreciate any feedback on how other devices work with the code.
Click to expand...

You did not seem to realize that a frame IS a page and you had no interest in the subject of the Blackberry anyway. Why not just respond to threads where you know something about the subject or where you have some personal interest instead of just being unpleasant.


Clive
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
I do wish you ladies would discuss rather than fall out. lol

Questions:-

What is the HTML hack which Microsoft warn against?

What experience have any of you had working with the example ca8msm pointed at.

This may be a numb question so please be gentle with me.
How do I edit a HTML / CSS document which set positions on the fly?
I like WYSIWYG but I am old fashioned that way.



Keith
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
What is the HTML hack which Microsoft warn against?
Click to expand...

If you write a CSS rule like this, for example:
Code: 
* html div { color: red }
It will turn the text of any <div> red, but only for people using IE. The rule will be ignored (as it should be) by other browsers. This is rather handy, as it means you can use the [tt]* html[/tt] hack to send rules to IE which fix up their otherwise buggy rendering.

When IE7 comes out, it will ignore [tt]* html[/tt] like the other browsers do. However, it's also supposed to have fixed all the bugs - so we won't need it, right?

Well, maybe. IE7's like all other pieces of software - it'll have bugs. You'll need to test your pages with it, and maybe tinker with them to get them working on it. No doubt somebody will come up with a hack to target IE7 only, or you can use IE's conditional comment syntax if you don't mind having to put it onto every page. Personally, I'm not worrying about it at all till a finished version of IE7 actually comes out. Changing things for the sake of beta software = which may itself change before release - just isn't worth it IMO.

-- Chris Hunt
Webmaster & Tragedian
Extra Connections Ltd
 
Upvote 0 Downvote
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

c0deM0nK424
  • Locked
  • Question
Joomla Installation problem - Could not connect to the database ?
Replies
3
Views
112
ChrisHirst
ChrisHirst
audiopro
  • Locked
  • Question
A Curious Problem With Chrome 2
Replies
3
Views
91
audiopro
audiopro
shpangle
  • Locked
  • Question
301 redirect problem
Replies
6
Views
113
shpangle
shpangle
ColdPhreze
  • Locked
  • Question
Scrolling problem with show/hide div 1
Replies
2
Views
82
ColdPhreze
ColdPhreze
tg2003
  • Locked
  • Question
Problem that happens in FireFox only
Replies
2
Views
64
johnwm
johnwm

Part and Inventory Search

Sponsor

Back
Top