roundman18
Technical User
Is anybody tricking the IPO to be a key system? If so how and how well is it working?
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fake key sytem 4
- Thread starter roundman18
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thrtnastrx
Technical User
jamie77 That defeats the whole purpose.
APSS - ACIS - ACSS
APSS - ACIS - ACSS
Greybeard191
Technical User
my experience has been if that you don't actually have a phone in the HG, and there isn't actually a phone (even analog) there to ring, then the call just goes immediately to VM...
Maybe something is set up wrong, but that's my experience.
Jamie77, I completely agree, LA's are painful and really unnecessary, but if the customer is bound and determined to have them, then have the calls ring ONLY on the LA's is better than having them ring on both LA's and CA's, if you're trying to make the IPO act like a key system. I personally would try EVERYTHING to talk them out of it, but if they persist?
FWIW, one possible legitmate use of a line appearance is a trunk-connected doorphone that you want to make a call to... see the IP Office tech bulletin on the algo 3226, for example. I've never used a 3226 that way, I've always just pointed the ICR for line group ID at a HG of phones. But if you were trying to call the doorphone, it might be "legitimate"...
GB
Maybe something is set up wrong, but that's my experience.
Jamie77, I completely agree, LA's are painful and really unnecessary, but if the customer is bound and determined to have them, then have the calls ring ONLY on the LA's is better than having them ring on both LA's and CA's, if you're trying to make the IPO act like a key system. I personally would try EVERYTHING to talk them out of it, but if they persist?
FWIW, one possible legitmate use of a line appearance is a trunk-connected doorphone that you want to make a call to... see the IP Office tech bulletin on the algo 3226, for example. I've never used a 3226 that way, I've always just pointed the ICR for line group ID at a HG of phones. But if you were trying to call the doorphone, it might be "legitimate"...
GB
We've been giving the Park 1, Park 2, Park 3 for quite a while now for cust's that feel they need to put a call on hold and page. Not all customers mind you, but several. All the hunt grp and unused analog lone users is starting to sound a bit pricy. I'll just stick to the PBX that it was designed for... 
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1
- #25
joshsullivan
IS-IT--Management
- May 17, 2012
- 18
Thanks for the responses! This seems like a lot of extra work and based on most of the comments, is probably not the best course of action.
The more I read about the differences between the two types of system, the more I'm liking PBX's. We have a few guys that don't have an assigned phone and work out in the plant, so we will need to park/unpark calls. I can't seem to get it to work right, but I'll do some research and see what I'm doing wrong.
The more I read about the differences between the two types of system, the more I'm liking PBX's. We have a few guys that don't have an assigned phone and work out in the plant, so we will need to park/unpark calls. I can't seem to get it to work right, but I'll do some research and see what I'm doing wrong.
A star for Jamie77 because he is right.
You can put a bigger engine in a Smart but it will never ever be a Ferrari.
The biggest job will be training the users but when they are used to the IPO then the complaints will stop.
BAZINGA!
I'm not insane, my mother had me tested!
You can put a bigger engine in a Smart but it will never ever be a Ferrari.
The biggest job will be training the users but when they are used to the IPO then the complaints will stop.
BAZINGA!
I'm not insane, my mother had me tested!
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1
- #28
I'll say it again.
You should have sold these customers an actual key system, rather than an IPO.
Puck the system to suit the customer req."
Wrong. There are some specific applications where line appearances are needed, (IP Office works nearly perfect as a key system) and in these cases the customer needs and wants an Avaya switch (with access to the dev connect, CTI license, etc..., and don't want some cheap key system with no support!!!) Just because you always put in IPO's in a PBX environment, doesn't make your assumption true. 90% of my customers are in the PBX functionality with IP Office, but I have some customers with very specific requirements that need line appearances and still want, require, or only trust Avaya.
Greybeard191 and thrtnastrx methods work. Greybeard191, I do not have the privacy issue you mentioned, not sure why you do. I have my inbound analog lines routed to a HG with an analog port (I do NOT plug a pot phone into this port) as the only user, the huntgroup is set to collective call waiting. Callers with the line appearances can answer the ringing calls without it appearing on the call appearance like you mentioned, they can put the call on hold, and pick it just fine on another phone with the same line appearances (yep, they see the flashing lights and everything like a real key system) If a line is in use, they can't barge in. (The phone beeps at them) The "cannot be intruded" checkbox is at it's default programming (with a check in the box.), and I do not need to uncheck this to have another caller pick up a line on hold. If I need to set a station with line appearances to delayed or no ring, I need to check "delayed ring preference" for that user, so that they don't accidentally auto answer that ringing line. (which displays on the display as a ringing call even though the line appearance was set to no ring, "checking delayed ring preference" fixes this for me.)
I program my phones with 2 CA's (a=, b=)and a Direct Dial button labeled "Intercom"(for voice inter-coming stations) then I put on my line appearances. Customers are trained to hit the line they wish to dial out on, I could uncheck idle line preference and force them to do this, but I didn't like the way it worked (it seemed to remember whatever line you were on last.) This has been done on Release 8.0.18 with 1416's. (not even going to mess with 8.0.43 with the analog lines gain issues...)
For those of you who cringe at the thought of this, understand that this isn't with PRI's, SIP's, etc with a bunch of 9504's. (seriously does anyone sell these?!?!? 4 buttons to see at a time?!?!) Sometimes there are Avaya customers with very specific needs that require Avaya or some dev connect proggie that is certified and supported that works with Avaya IP Office and they still need line appearances. Granted it's rare, but it does work. For my other smaller-type customers that want simply key functionality and Avaya, they get muppet mode. (Partner mode), but that's another story for another time. (USA has tons of small pbx's with the PartnerACS system, Partner version of IPO is very close to what the Partner ACS was, and once you know the weird "not quite the same as the Partner ACS" quirks, it works just fine. For those of you that know nothing about the Partner ACS, then you don't understand what I'm talking about anyways.)
Either way I think IPO is just grand and swell and I've learned a lot in these forums.
You should have sold these customers an actual key system, rather than an IPO.
Puck the system to suit the customer req."
Wrong. There are some specific applications where line appearances are needed, (IP Office works nearly perfect as a key system) and in these cases the customer needs and wants an Avaya switch (with access to the dev connect, CTI license, etc..., and don't want some cheap key system with no support!!!) Just because you always put in IPO's in a PBX environment, doesn't make your assumption true. 90% of my customers are in the PBX functionality with IP Office, but I have some customers with very specific requirements that need line appearances and still want, require, or only trust Avaya.
Greybeard191 and thrtnastrx methods work. Greybeard191, I do not have the privacy issue you mentioned, not sure why you do. I have my inbound analog lines routed to a HG with an analog port (I do NOT plug a pot phone into this port) as the only user, the huntgroup is set to collective call waiting. Callers with the line appearances can answer the ringing calls without it appearing on the call appearance like you mentioned, they can put the call on hold, and pick it just fine on another phone with the same line appearances (yep, they see the flashing lights and everything like a real key system) If a line is in use, they can't barge in. (The phone beeps at them) The "cannot be intruded" checkbox is at it's default programming (with a check in the box.), and I do not need to uncheck this to have another caller pick up a line on hold. If I need to set a station with line appearances to delayed or no ring, I need to check "delayed ring preference" for that user, so that they don't accidentally auto answer that ringing line. (which displays on the display as a ringing call even though the line appearance was set to no ring, "checking delayed ring preference" fixes this for me.)
I program my phones with 2 CA's (a=, b=)and a Direct Dial button labeled "Intercom"(for voice inter-coming stations) then I put on my line appearances. Customers are trained to hit the line they wish to dial out on, I could uncheck idle line preference and force them to do this, but I didn't like the way it worked (it seemed to remember whatever line you were on last.) This has been done on Release 8.0.18 with 1416's. (not even going to mess with 8.0.43 with the analog lines gain issues...)
For those of you who cringe at the thought of this, understand that this isn't with PRI's, SIP's, etc with a bunch of 9504's. (seriously does anyone sell these?!?!? 4 buttons to see at a time?!?!) Sometimes there are Avaya customers with very specific needs that require Avaya or some dev connect proggie that is certified and supported that works with Avaya IP Office and they still need line appearances. Granted it's rare, but it does work. For my other smaller-type customers that want simply key functionality and Avaya, they get muppet mode. (Partner mode), but that's another story for another time. (USA has tons of small pbx's with the PartnerACS system, Partner version of IPO is very close to what the Partner ACS was, and once you know the weird "not quite the same as the Partner ACS" quirks, it works just fine. For those of you that know nothing about the Partner ACS, then you don't understand what I'm talking about anyways.)
Either way I think IPO is just grand and swell and I've learned a lot in these forums.
My experience has been that some customers absolutely refuse to change. We want them to change to our current century but they refuse. What do you do when you are an Avaya shop. You are forced now to install an IPO and configure it so it will work and they will be happy. I have had this issue on Nortel when changing a customer from analog to PRI. The CEO wanted to see the lines. Those who know Nortel we put 7 SWCA keys on the phones and they have been happy for several years. It is all about keeping the customer happy. Having said that I believe that we have a responsibility to inform them of things they don't know. Some changes would only be temporary inconveniences but in the long run it will be better for them. If they cannot be convinced then what do you do?
SHK Certified (School of Hard Knocks)
NCSS, ATSP/IP
SHK Certified (School of Hard Knocks)
NCSS, ATSP/IP
norstarboy125
Vendor
The IPO is a key system in Partner mode am I wrong? In certain situations i.e. a system with 3 lines and 4 phones
I don't think they are going to want to park calls etc. They are just going to want line appearances and be able to put them on hold. I agree that the PBX format is much better for bigger sites with alot more phones but there are still a boat load of small sites out there that need the muppet mode as you guys say.
Jeremy J. Carter
Charm City Communications
Norstar. BCM. CS1000 Programmer
I don't think they are going to want to park calls etc. They are just going to want line appearances and be able to put them on hold. I agree that the PBX format is much better for bigger sites with alot more phones but there are still a boat load of small sites out there that need the muppet mode as you guys say.
Jeremy J. Carter
Charm City Communications
Norstar. BCM. CS1000 Programmer
amriddle01
Programmer
Those sites are what Panasonics and the likes are for
We converted all our internal Parners,Legend, Norstar to IPO standard mode . I have no complain from closer to 1500 users once we show them how to use the 4 park call buttons ( 1-4 ) as most had 4 lines to begin with.
Now parking across the SCN is something is much much more desirable at current release( instead of us using the stub hunt group method ). Why Avaya is ignoring this feature is beyond me !
Now parking across the SCN is something is much much more desirable at current release( instead of us using the stub hunt group method ). Why Avaya is ignoring this feature is beyond me !
amriddle01
Programmer
Avaya ignore most feature requests with no explanation, they have been asked about better, more unique and distinct ringtones per user/group hundreds of times yet they just stay silent on the issue
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