Any Good Opinions of Windows 8 To Date? 15

[kjv1611]

So far, from my perspective, I think Windows 8 is looking to make Windows ME even look good in retrospect. A month or two ago, I installed the consumer preview in a virtual machine, and had it running - did take a little tweaking but not much. However, once I had it running, it did look like I was trying to control a giant phone with a mouse - forget the keyboard at all - and frankly, what I clicked just didn't make sense. To me, nothing felt intuitive at all. I could pick up any version of Ubuntu Linux I've seen to date, and though I'm not as familiar, at least it mostly feels intuitive, even the latest one I've tried where they try to go somewhat Mac-ish. I suppose Microsoft has decided to not try to copy the Mac anymore on their interface, but rather just make a big dumb smartphone. Maybe it should now be labeled Windows Smart-top.

Any good experience so far? Any reason to try it again? I only gave it 10, maybe 15, minutes of my time.

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[vacunita]

Any good experience so far? Any reason to try it again?

Yes:

I only gave it 10, maybe 15, minutes of my time.

You can't expect to get to grips with an OS in 10 or 15 minutes. I would have given up Ubuntu in that time frame if i hadn't dug a little deeper and figured out you can change the damn Unity bar which is annoying as hell, and doesn't work all that well.

It sounds like you haven't even been in the Desktop Mode for Windows 8.

I Installed Windows 8 when the Developer Preview was released last Year. I'm still finding interesting things about it.

Sure the Metro Start Screen is not very intuitive in a Desktop PC, and can get quite annoying with the sheer amount of tiles you'll end up having, but as with everything its the first iteration of it, I'm sure we'll see improvements as it goes along.

Comparing it to Windows ME is just ridiculous. Win ME was a very unstable slightly nicer looking Win98. but really didn't offer anything substantially new to warrant the update. Instead, and realizing this, Microsoft opted to develop the NT platform, a.k.a Windows 2000 and eventually launched Windows XP which to date is one of the best OS'es Microsoft has released.

I think 8 is more akin to Vista. Its a step in the right direction, it just not there yet, and needs a bit more work. Vista eventually gave way to windows 7 which is pretty good.


I think it will be a good platform for Tablets, but for Desktop, you should spend most of your time inside Desktop Mode. Rarely if ever going out to the Metro Start Screen.




----------------------------------
Phil AKA Vacunita
----------------------------------
Ignorance is not necessarily Bliss, case in point:
Unknown has caused an Unknown Error on Unknown and must be shutdown to prevent damage to Unknown.

Web & Tech

 

[hairlessupportmonkey]

Metro GUI is a total fail on a desktop PC with a mouse and keyboard.

ACSS - SME
General Geek

 

[kjv1611]

Yep, I didn't mess with desktop mode. My assumption was that you could simply click an option somewhere to swap modes. Maybe I'll look it up and try it again some time - in the next month perhaps.

I guess what would be ideal is that when Windows ships, that they have it auto-detect the CPU type, and based on that, default to desktop or metro interface, but allow the installer to change the option manually if so desired. But that's just a guess on my part.

I'll need to learn it, I'm sure eventually anyway, so may as well try it sometime soon again.

hmm...

Oh wait, according to this link:

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/zxue/archiv...to-1-switch-between-metro-ui-and-desktop.aspx

I did look at Desktop mode, but there was practically nothing there.

Maybe somehow I overlooked everything? I didn't see much of anything for settings, control panel, anything of that sort..

Well, maybe, we'll see.

I definitely felt like in those first moments that it was a waste of time, and didn't want to waste anymore. Perhaps I was being too short-sighted, but really, more pressing things to work on, so had to make a decision.

Oh, and the start menu was missing, but I did see the thread, thread1787-1679923, mentioning that. So I'll try a couple of those suggestions whenever I do get it up and running again.


"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[kjv1611]

On the desktop vs Metro deal, here's an interesting blog post:

http://blog.laptopmag.com/6-ways-to-totally-avoid-metro-and-use-only-desktop-mode-in-windows-8

I'll want to refer to that, possibly, as well whenever I try it again.

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[flyboytim]

Windows 8 (I have tried 2 previews and one leaked version) has many features to commend it - and some to condemn it - In my favoured order :-

Windows To Go - the ability to have a full Windows 8 installation on a USB device that will run on any PC that can boot from USB (snd a few that don't using a boot enhancer like Plop Boot Manager).

Improved networking over Windows 7 - It is just always there and immediately working without any attention or tweaking.

Windows Explorer Search Tools - these return the power, missing in Windows 7, but available in XP Windows Search to a ribbon in the explorer Window, so you can search for files with extensions .odt, between 4 and 5 MB in size, modified between two dates containing the text "wubble" in a set of drives or folders.

The ability to natively mount .iso and .vhd images.

Speed of startup even when not enhanced using the fast startup hibernate feature
---------------------------------------
Less favourable features mostly involve removal of choices available before :-

the Start Menu Orb replaced with nothing, and the Start Menu itself with Metro tiles.

Reported removal of Aero transparency effects.

Removal of the ability to play DVDs

Removal of Media Center.

Not many like the Charms Bar, or the "Hot corner" method of reaching parts of the system.

There are also many little "tweaks" that follow the time old Microsoft tradition of hiding features behind different menus than the ones that gave access to the features before.

"Add features" is a new name for "Anytime Upgrades" but it does not appear under Features and Programs. It also, so far, just presents a dialog which asks for your product key, without any explanation.

Logon with your Windows Live ID is a pain when you have a network login that is not your Windows Live ID.

Turning off UAC renders the Metro Apps unworkable. So you can either be in full control of your personal computer, but not have access to your apps, or you have your Apps, but put up with the UAC reminders in the desktop when you want to do something vaguely system-threatening.

A minimum 1024x768 resolution renders Metro Apps unusable on Netbools with smaller screen resolutions.

Comparing Windows 8 to ME is partly wrong, and partly right - So far Windows 8 is still Beta software - like any Microsoft OS, Beta testing will be ended with the first Service Pack - so it has many bugs to resolve - as did ME at first. Windows 8 is, like ME, considerably cut down from it's previous version - intended to speed everything up, but it also has the inevitable slew of bloated fail-safe resources to call on when trouble strikes. Unlike ME, there is a lot of innovation in Windows 8, and it will take a while to get it all working together properly.

Windows 8 had got me to examine my way of working with Windows, and improve how I use the desktop - I've concentrated on using the desktop and taskbar better than before, and ignored Metro for the most part. When there is a raft* of new Metro Apps available I shall start using Metro, at the moment it has nothing to interest me.

By the way - it is interesting that Tek-Tips has updated the "Reply to this Thread" buttons to have more of an "XP Luna look and feel" than the previous version! About 2022, we may get the Metro Look for Tek-Tips

*note my careful use of words

 

[kjv1611]

Thanks, flyboytim! That'll give me some things to look at and play around with! The USB deal sounds like a neat way to try it besides the Virtual Machine as well. And the native mounting of ISOs is interesting as well. Before, I'd just download a 3rd party app for that.

As far as Media Center, yeah, that's rather shocking, since they had one of the best, it seemed, in Windows 7. Other alternatives are good though. I actually went to using XMBC on my Win7 desktop instead of Win7 Media center, and saw a big performance boost as well as better media controls and info, and easier handling of ISOs vs digital files, etc.


"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[kjv1611]

Oh, and yeah, I'll have to try the advanced search. You could get an advanced search in Win7, but it was more of a pain to do so.

Usually I've just used SearchMyFiles when I REALLY needed an advanced search:

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/search_my_files.html

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[vacunita]

Yep, I didn't mess with desktop mode. My assumption was that you could simply click an option somewhere to swap modes. Maybe I'll look it up and try it again some time - in the next month perhaps.

Yup, one of the tiles in the Metro Start Screen is the access to Desktop Mode.

Its Basically just the Windows 7 desktop minus the start menu, but as you pointed out , its easy to get that back.

My point was, that if you really wanted to you can use windows 8 just like you do windows 7 with a few differences. So condemning the OS for something that can be bypassed quite easily seems a little silly.

One thing to note that's happened several times to me is that the new context Menu that pops out of the bottom left corner when you hover there will sometimes not show up. It has the options for Settings, Search, and a few others like shutting down which make it a little harder to effectively turn off the PC.



----------------------------------
Phil AKA Vacunita
----------------------------------
Ignorance is not necessarily Bliss, case in point:
Unknown has caused an Unknown Error on Unknown and must be shutdown to prevent damage to Unknown.

Web & Tech

 

[kjv1611]

Yeah, that was another annoyance - the context menu doohickey. I noticed it wasn't consistent, but then that's Beta - surely that's something that'll be fixed by the time it rolls.

But as I mentioned later, I apparently did get to the "Desktop Mode" and just forgot about it. I saw so little there that it just seemed worthless. Then again, I didn't try every keyboard shorcut I could think of, and hadn't gone and read too many references just yet.

I guess I'm used to Windows "just working", at least since Win95 pretty much. Headaches, changes, yes, but it just worked. Personally, the Start Menu, I think, has been a very powerful tool since inception, and think that's one thing that should always be a part of "Windows". But who am I to say?

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[vacunita]

I guess I'm used to Windows "just working", at least since Win95 pretty much. Headaches, changes, yes, but it just worked. Personally, the Start Menu, I think, has been a very powerful tool since inception, and think that's one thing that should always be a part of "Windows". But who am I to say?

Hey, no arguments there, the lack of start menu was my first major gripe. The start Menu as a Menu and not a tile ridden screen should always exist.




----------------------------------
Phil AKA Vacunita
----------------------------------
Ignorance is not necessarily Bliss, case in point:
Unknown has caused an Unknown Error on Unknown and must be shutdown to prevent damage to Unknown.

Web & Tech

 

[DSummZZZ]

So, beyond the user interface, is Windows 8 going to be stable? Reliable? How about bugs, patches, updates, KB's, and so on. Is Microsoft going to release another OS that is a maintenance nightmare for users and admins?
However we get the applications to run be it a bulky, ugly UI or a sleek "Start" UI, I want to be able to use something where I don't have to hold my breath every time I tax the system a little.
I want to be able to run something that when I com in the next day or the next week still has the application running, not some blue screen that says "Error 0x76234234742323476 for Instruction 0x72349734278923789 caused a system fault".


-Dave Summers-

Even more Fox stuff at:

http://www.davesummers.net/foxprolinks.htm

 

[JAG14]

Hi (Belatedly),

I have the RTM installed on both a Tablet and a Bricks and Mortar (Keyboard and Mouse) PC.
I can honestly say that 8 is a massive leap in UI design, but once you get to grips with it, it really is more intuitive to use than 7 or indeed any windows before it.

Do you REALLY (And I mean REALLY) use the start menu tree in 7 to navigate 3 levels and find a program before clicking on it. Or did you use the 7 start menu the way it was designed and click once, type a letter or two of your program name and press enter, Or select it from the MRU.
I ask because essentially, 8 is better at this.

1. You have one key access to search apps. (Like 7)
2. You have a CUSTOM MRU (unlike 7) in the first tile screen.
3. You have a stack of information to hand (live tiles) that wasn't native to 7 (or indeed any OS)
4. You have Pinch&Zoom/CTRL+Scroll on the Start screen to see all apps. And One Click/Swipe to see them laid out in "Start menu" Fashion
5. App switching (especially on tablet, but equally on Desktop) is more informative and just as simple as ALT+TAB/WIN+TAB. (AND those combos still work)

I understand the Metro Interface is a big change. But we said that about DOS to Windows, NoRibbon to Ribbon, and indeed from No start menu (3.1) to Start Menu (95). Then the same moans could be heard rattling around Redmond, WA as are today. Those products changed the face of modern (sic) computing, and so will 8. Just give it time, grasshoppers.

On a stability note, i've had one crash. And it was my fault. (Testing a 16 bit bootstrapper installer on a 64 bit system.) And i've used the Dev Preview & Consumer Preview and now have the RTM installed on 1 Laptop (Acer Aspire 5742G/Core i3-330/8GB-DDR3/750GB/Rad5450), 1 Desktop (Acer Aspire Revo RL70/AMD-E450/4GB-DDR3/640GB/Rad6320) Running 24/7 and 1 Tablet (Acer Iconia W500/C50/2GB/128GB SSD) with no stability issues at all.

Hope this helps.

JaG

[tt]'Very funny, Scotty... Now Beam down my clothes.'[/tt]
​

 

[dilettante]

The later previews of Windows 8 silently improved on complaints about the earlier ones, so things are better in some respects.

The idea that the Start Menu isn't used is laughable though. Vista (and Vista II, a.k.a. Win7) gave you the best of both approaches: you can use search or navigate the full tree, or pick pinned or heavily used items, and so on. Finding a software product's co-shortcuts (Help, Uninstall, readme files, secondary utilities) is all lost in Win8. You have lots of flexibility with none of the claustrophbia induced by the Metro overlay.

In a very real sense the Metro overlay (they desperately need another name before dropping this one) is merely a full-screen version of the Gadget Bar in Vista (and Win7 if you bother to turn it on). I usually just have a clock, calendar, weather, server monitor, and local performance monitor gadget running and I find that covers all my needs for "info at a glance." Docking it at the right of my second monitor works just fine and it isn't in my way.

Hiding information and going to washed out color schemes was bad enough in Win7. Even the current preview version of Win8 has only made the PC more difficult to use.

That doesn't mean there aren't real improvements inside Windows 8. It is just too bad the negatives outweigh them so much.

 

[JAG14]

Dilettante,

I see you haven't used the RTM version of 8. So just to point out the following:

1. I did not say the start menu wasn't used. I suggested that if it was used in the way it was intended, that 8 is better at it. You can see the full Application collection (including every installed desktop products "co-products") by tapping/clicking "search" on the Charm bar. Simple, more effective and easier to use than a multi-level start tree.

2. The Metro overlay is nothing like the gadget bar in that it uses less memory, works faster and natively and creates no lag.

3. I disagree (although I understand it is a matter of opinion) that the PC is more difficult to use. Again, I must refer you to the Final Version before such a sweeping statement is made.

4. I invite you to list the negatives as you perceive them, so I may put your mind at ease.

JaG

[tt]'Very funny, Scotty... Now Beam down my clothes.'[/tt]
​

 

[kjv1611]

Wait, one of the pieces is now called the Charm bar? I didn't realize that before. Not that it really matters, I just am not fond of that. I'd be fine with it still being the "task bar" even if it's now different.

4. I invite you to list the negatives as you perceive them, so I may put your mind at ease.

So, do you work for Microsoft? Else why are you concerned with putting someone's mind at ease over their take on a new OS?

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[dilettante]

My mind is quite at ease, thank you very much.

If you think Metro is nothing like the Gadget system you're lost. And there isn't any particular reason why Metro applets would be "faster" or "lighter" or anything else. Most of them will be HTML+script - just as Gadgets are.

If you have 382 "readme.txt" files on the system how is search going to help find the one you want? Or maybe 15 things called "documentation.chm" - or anything else?

 

[JAG14]

kjv1611,

That sounds quite confrontational, I don't work for Microsoft, nor should I be bothered about dilettante's personal opinions but when one is spreading misinformed babble as "truth" and does not listen to reason, I feel the need to interject simply to correct and inform.
YOUR thread is titled "Any Good Opinions of Windows 8 to date?." I provided good, honest opinion and truth based on ACTUAL usage of the final edition of windows 8. If you did not want this, I suggest you title your next thread "How crap is that Windows 8 that I haven't used, eh?"

Dilettante, Where to start?

1. I reconfirm, Metro is nothing like the gadget system. You understand nothing of code if you think as such. A clock on the screen does not constitute "like gadgets" because Windows and every other OS has had a visible clock since the GUI was introduced.
2. I did not say anything about Metro apps being faster and lighter. I said the Metro Interface was faster and lighter than the combined Gadget/Start Menu of Windows old.
3. If you have 382 "readme.txt" files in the Windows 7 start menu, they will be arranged in EXACTLY the same way (ordered by program name) that they are now, just on the Application Search Screen (Without the need for searching)

Please read the posts correctly before calling someone lost, and if you wish to spread misinformation, may I direct you to "NationalEnquirer.com" or "MailOnline.com" depending on locale.

[tt]'Very funny, Scotty... Now Beam down my clothes.'[/tt]
​

 

[vacunita]

Wait, one of the pieces is now called the Charm bar? I didn't realize that before. Not that it really matters, I just am not fond of that. I'd be fine with it still being the "task bar" even if it's now different.

No, the Charm Bar is not the task bar nor anything related to it. The Charm Bar is the right hand side button bar that shows up when you move your mouse to either right side corner (top or bottom) And has the Search, Share, Start, Devices, and Settings buttons.

With that said, I'm with JAG here. Complaining about a OS you haven't tried yet is like complaining about a food you've never eaten.

And one does not need to work for a company to get to know a product and appreciate its good points and understand how it works while at the same being able to criticize the bad points.

The more I use windows 8, the more I like it. Its seems every time I find something new and useful about it.

With that said, I still think the Metro Start screen is a little harder to navigate on a desktop and not quite as useful in a desktop environment as it would be on a mobile device, as you get every single item that gets put inside the Program folder in the start menu as a tile. So there are quite a few things you'll probably never click on, that will clutter up the start screen.







----------------------------------
Phil AKA Vacunita
----------------------------------
Ignorance is not necessarily Bliss, case in point:
Unknown has caused an Unknown Error on Unknown and must be shutdown to prevent damage to Unknown.

Web & Tech

 

[kjv1611]

First, never was a confrontational statement about "do you work for Microsoft"? I would think of it as an honest question based on the given syntax. For someone to say "set your mind at ease" about something is not the same as "clear up confusion". To me it sounds more like "change your opinion".

As far as whether I'm complaining about something I've not used. When I opened the thread, my experience thus far was negative, not that I never used it. It was not MUCH use, as I mentioned, but I did indeed use it. And I will at some point try it out again - the latest version. By the way, when I posted the thread, I couldn't travel into the future. This thread was started in June. So unless you want to complain to Doc from "Back to the Future", then not sure how you come off basically fussing that I'm complaining about something that did not even exist when I opened the thread.

[ROFL2] @ "How crap is that Windows 8 that I haven't used, eh?"

----
Now, since this thread got basically re-opened, I know I've not had time to test the latest version of Win8. When I tested before, the charm bar, I guess it is, (which at the time showed at the top left or bottom right, depending upon where you hovered - perhaps it was either side, or any corner, I simply do not remember), it was very buggy. When I say buggy, I mean that it would not respond the way you would expect any hovered link/button/whatever to respond - probably mentioned this earlier, not going to go back and read my old posts at moment.

That said, can anyone here say from recent/current testing whether that bugginess has been corrected, or whether it's still an issue?

And yes, I WAS asking for any positive information about it. My hope was that I missed something in my short initial testing.

By thew ay, this piece by Jag:

You understand nothing of code if you think as such

If dilettante was wrong in his understanding, perhaps you can provide some clarity - an online reference or a short explanation to prove you are correct. I mention this for no other reason than that it would be good to explain. It could be that others are misinformed, if indeed you are correct.

Thanks again to anyone who can share their experiences... Now that it's at RTM stage, perhaps someone has found something new to add?



"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57