Winodws shuts itself OFF!!! 1

[alberteinstein]

hi !!


My comp is PIII,64 MB RAM, 20 GB hdd , win 98 se ,win xp dual boot.

was workin fine till yesterday.

***Today,the computer switches itself OFF suddenly after only a few minutes of being ON..( varies..4 min - sometimes 20 etc).
Happens evertime after restart too...***


It jus switches off ! and then it restarts or sometimes it doesnt switch off but hangs.

this happens anytime - may be whn reading a doc file or on internet...

Yesterday i attached the LAN ethernet card ( DAX company). to the motherboard...but no cable connxn has been made...AND comp was fine yesterday without any prob...

I mostly use win 98 .
i checked the CPU...both the processor and SMPS (power)FAN are running...

the problem occurs in both 98 and XP.



<btw i don run any antivirus.....i used to hav NORTON 2003 b4, but it never found anything ever......so i dont have it installed..>

Could a virus actually cause this behaviour?

what could be the soln?
Thanx.

Albert.

 

[ManicMark]

You are asking for trouble not running any AV software at all and I suggest you install some asap, try AVG 6 it's free and works well. I'm assuming you have a firewall installed if not try ZoneAlarm that too is free over the Web.

Once you have installed your AV or before get hold of some anti spyware software, I recommend AdAware SE Personal and Spybot Search & Destroy these too are both free and available over the Web. Once you install them update them and then run them. Delete all they find. If your problem still exists post back.

Regards

MM

 

[marquitico]

Just a thought: since the problem is global (i.e. both 98 and XP are exhibiting the same behavior), do make sure that it isn't the actual wiring in your building, or a dying surge protector or power strip.

A friend of mine just did a full wipe and re-install of his whole operating system only to discover that his APARTMENT needed rewiring, and the issue became critical only recently, so there were repeated interruptions to the electricity supply in his room! These interruptions were too minor to cause the lights to blink, but they rebooted his system every time. He proved it by physically carrying his PC to a different location (in a different building), and it was trouble-free over there.

Can you STAND it?

Alternately, your power supply unit may be going bad; might need to buy a new one.

Best,

Mark ("marquitico")

 

[HeddaLora]

I concur -- sounds like a power supply or other power problem.

But as to the anti-virus program thing, you definitely need to have one installed and always on.

 

[TekTippy4U]

hi again albert;
check your PSU, and your BIOS(CMOS) battery - yet I'm inclined to think you either didn't fully seat the LAN card or you touched/damaged or knocked loose a wire when installing, since it only started occuring after installation. Any missing screws around? - did you forget to put the plastic/paper/fiberglass washers in between mobo screws and standoffs - if you even needed to unscrew them....Power down - fully Unplug from wall outlet or back of tower -open her up and took a look -check the seating for everything, and check for loose wires, possible frays and strays.

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
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[alberteinstein]

hi guys!

thanx for ur replies...
i dont think it is the power prob. i dont see any power fluctuations, and I hav UPS.

so may be - yea, ill install anitivirus....u see since iam on 64 MB ram, i thought y slow down the system with the AV always running...

any way today i cleaned up the heap of dust on the heat sink below the fan of the processor with the vacum cleaner.........

its 25 minutes since i switched my computer and COMP is ON............dunno how long it'll last though!

anyway, could a virus cause such a malfuntion?

 

[smah]

I agree with the others - the most likely cause is the power supply. This is not neccessarily the power coming from the UPS - more likely the actual power supply in the box.

It's unlikely that a virus will cause an immediate, complete shutdown without warning - but get current with your antivirus anyway. You could be wreaking havoc all over the internet without even knowing. If it's a financial issue, AVG has a version that is free for home use -

http://free.grisoft.com/freeweb.php/doc/2/

 

[alberteinstein]

Hi Guys!

my comp got just even more weird.

Yesterday , after cleaning the heat sink and fan, the comp was ON for 2 hours.I thought the problem
was solved. But , it actually got even more weird.

Now the comp hangs any time- during boot process ( the very 1 st screen when the comp is turned on -"Americant megatrends" - motherboard info etc ) or even after the boot menu for XP and 98 is displayed.
So i dont think it is a OS problem..probably on the hardware side.....


I tried once booting into command prompt - same efect. the comp switched off after few minutes after being in command prompt.

[ the red and green LEDs of the cpu glow together continuosly].
The comp in most cases does not restart- jus switches OFF..


I have also removed the Lan card.and changed the CMOS battery.(new)

hmm...i git the msnp32.dll not found ...i extracted it from sfc..still gives the error.
other files like vnetsup.vxd,vredir.vxd ,dfs.vxd were also reported missing,but after extracting from SFC
i havent got error messages for these 3files.

I tried to install f-prot Anivirus, hanged after install.....
so you see, even if i were to install a AV, iam not sure the comp will be able to stay up as long as reqd for full scan!!

>>So any new ideas?

 

[TekTippy4U]

f-prot has a DOS version you could try from a boot disk - for DOS only not XP side.
suspect PSU is dying, not recharging battery - perhaps even bulging/leaking mobo capacitors?
those files you mention all belong to Client for MS Networks in Network Tab

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
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[Rick998]

Just a thought but this can sometimes be down to poor seating of memory or other components - a condition caused by heat creep, i.e. when components in slots warm up they sometimes move slightly upwards but stay in the same place when they cool down instead of returning to their previous position.

Over a period of time they may move fractionally upwards, just sufficient to reduce their connections. (This is why slot-based components have latches or are screwed down in place on the mainboard's backplane.)

As your problem can occur even before the POST test has finished, I suggest checking your RAM. It's a quick check so worth doing.

Remove the RAM and check the contacts. If they're dis-coloured then this is an indicator of poor seating. The contacts can be cleaned by gently rubbing them with an eraser to buff them up. Don't use anything else other than an eraser. Make sure you blow off any bits of rubber that come off the eraser before you replace the RAM.

Hope this helps...

Rick

 

[TekTippy4U]

agreed; and relatively simple to do to try and resolve the prob.
especially since it's an older pc and you've already found a lot of junk in the case and heatsink fan area. Using a pencil eraser is the way to do it. BTW - not that it'll be factor, but when ordering new RAM, make sure the 'contacts' are of the same metal (tin or gold) as the seating contacts are on the mobo
(ex., tin with tin - or - gold with gold). Just besause gold is a much more precious metal, doesn't mean it's better for "your" mobo.

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs

 

[alberteinstein]

ooh !! tx for ur replies ..wil chk out the RAM...
meanwhile.....i'll post what i have "prepared"!!
Dear friends,

i have noticed some other weird things....

I have disconnected the UPS and connected directly to the power suppy- jus to see if the problem is with the UPS.
No luck.

As i said earlier, mostly when the comp switches off , both the Red and Green Led's on the case glow.
Moreover,iam not even able to start the comp these days - even for the first time.
As i press the button on CPU to start on the COMP, bothe the R & G led's glow together[ & the 2 fans run], but the comp doesnt start - It's dead still - NO ,not even the starting screen appears( i mean motherboard type,drives listing etc).

After repeatedly hitting restart many many times, the comp has finally started! and iam writing this...

oh yes - i have cheked the connxn from the LED's to the Motherboard- they are ok.

Humph..............iam convinced the ** prob is in motherboard** somewhere ,coz not even the boot screen appears!! but as i said, after repeatedly hittnig restart button , comp starts once in blue moon....and lets me do things in windows!

 

[alberteinstein]

hi!

I have cleaned the contacts of the RAM, and now the comp starts when i push the ON button of CPU!~
Thanx RICK998.
but still.......

* comp gives a beep after few minutes on win 98 and then hangs...no operation is possible ....the screen freezes.Not even CTL-ALT-DEL is possible ..only option is restart.

or
* comp switches off in few min's.

 

[Rick998]

alberteinstein,

OK... given what you've done so far yet the problems you still experience then, as per earlier posts by many, the problem now looks like it may be confined to power (i.e. the PSU inside the PC case) or overheating (unlikely since the PC rarely starts so doesn't get the chance to overheat).

You have a PIII processor so it's 100% certain you're using an ATX PSU (whereby the mainboard uses 2 small identical DIN sockets for keyboard and mouse) instead of the older AT PSU's (whereby the mainboard uses a large DIN socket for keyboard and a 9-pin serial connection [usually COM1] for the mouse). (Please, anyone feel feel free to correct me.)

If memory serves me correctly then ATX PSU's deliver 3 different power supply lines... 3.3-3.5v to CPU, 5v to mainboard and 12v to peripherals. They also usually have 1 integral fuse... but if this integral fuse (usually hard-soldered) had blown then there would be no power at all... so that definitely isn't the problem.

Unfortunately I have no idea how to test the 3 seperate line voltage outputs by the PSU except by a knowledgeable electrician or by temporary substitution of the PSU.

I don't suppose you have a similar PSU around or could beg/borrow one, do you?

You've told us that you've cleaned crud off the mainboard ("i cleaned up the heap of dust on the heat sink below the fan of the processor with the vacum cleaner") so there are more possibilities re: diagnosing overheating (although I still think this is a power supply problem).

- Have you tried cleaning the PSU using compressed air?
- How recent is your mainboard?
- Does is have (connected) thermal sensors that can switch the mainboard off in case of overheating?
- Does the BIOS show the temperature of the CPU?
- Have you swapped the CPU recently but not used thermal dispersion paste?

Hope this helps...

Rick

 

[alberteinstein]

tx rick 4 ur reply...........

Unfotunately, iam back to my old state.Comp cannot be started!
---
i read through this page:

http://www.ati.com/support/infobase/biostutorial.html

i think this quote applies to me..

"An incorrect BIOS configuration can negatively impact the performance and functionality of the system.

An incorrect BIOS configuration can cause various issues such as:
*failure to boot
*no video
*system hangs
*poor performance
*power management problems
----
My bios : AMIBIOS....

--------------------------------------------------
I think all these apply tome....coz sometimes comp starts but hangs after few min's<rarely starts >.Also b4 this comp debacle i recently tried using the stand by functn,where in after the comp went to standby, the comp wouldnt swtch on when i hit the keyboard or mouse....
---------------------------------------------------

Excuse me for askind this.but by PSU u mean the SMPS box inside the CPU with fan....??<seen from back of CPU>

-------
Well.......i cant get any extra PSU from some 1 dude..
------
So t clean the PSU i think i hav to open the PSU box and clean.......ok ill do that.
-----
By main board youi mean mother board?its atleast 3.5yrs old( Year 2001)
----
Quote :"Does is have (connected) thermal sensors that can switch the mainboard off in case of overheating?"
.Well.how do i find that out?

---Cant chk if bios gives temp of CPU---cant boot now!!
--My cpu is the same one - that came with my comp whn i bought it..no i havent swapped the cpu with another cpu case.

--
Thanx for reading thru.
--Albert.

 

[TekTippy4U]

alberteinstein;
can u go to a local dealer and buy a PSU Power Supply Unit?
Replace old with new and see if it works....if not return it and get credit (or cash - if possible) that can be used for other PC items in future or sooner?

your sure you replaced OLD battery with NEW

Does the BIOS POST (Power on Self Test) indicate the correct processor (CPU) speed?
If you can - check the BIOSs main page also for correct CPU speed and FSB (Front Side Bus) and amount of installed MEM....What can happen with a BIOS reset to system defaults (from Bad CMOS battery , or from manually removing the jumpers ) - this can throw the mobo into specific settings(factory defaults) to diff than what's actually installed.

Review your Manual - D/l from the web (usually any manual can be found) for any specific settings / jumpers which you may have overlooked or need resetting. For ex...if the BIOS detects wrong CPU speed - you may have to move to CMOS jumper on mobo to a "redetect"/"recover" position so the mobo can sense the CPU speed.

as an aside;
Have you tried flashing the BIOS lately?


TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
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[alberteinstein]

hi tektippy........

Thanx for ur reply.
Actually the previous posting was done from a cyber cAFE,as the comp didnt start.Now , by tryin a few times the comp has started....and iam typin from my comp.

i think that will answer some of your questions..(since iam not sure if i understand all ur questions!!)

oh--- What exactly is POST? does it refer to booting?canu say somethin abt it?
when i hit the start button, only the 2 leds glow,otherwise i dont even hear the BEEP one hears whn comp is booted.

But if i do hear it (like i did now, once in a blue moon,the comp starts..ofcurse how long it'll stay up is random ),windows usually starts.

where do i find the front side bus value?After pressin del when booting?< oh the bios settings page ,huh?>

heres a quote:
"What can happen with a BIOS reset to system defaults (from Bad CMOS battery , or from manually removing the jumpers ) - this can throw the mobo into specific settings(factory defaults) to diff than what's actually installed. "

which jumpers are u refering to?CMOS jumpers? where do i find them?all i know is the cmos battery location and i hav changed it.

I hav heard abt BIOS flashing...that it is dangerous-one wrong move and MOBO is useless i s wat i heard...
Anyway what is flashing BTW?

txtxtxtx!!!!

 

[TekTippy4U]

alberteinstein;
your welcome
wish i had the time to go into explicit detail about everything - at about this point, i would highly suggest RTFM (Reading The F'n Manual). ALOT of questions will be answered.
The RED and GREEN together indicates an electrical prob somewhere - it may just be the actual Front Power Switch is incorrectly wired (when you installed LAN? - did you unhook it?)...OR an electrical short somewhere from Unproper groiunding of Mobo and/or components..or maybe even a backwardsly installed floppy drive cable.

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs

 

[alberteinstein]

HI!

well it is a ATX power supply.

i manged to get into BIOS setup screen:

i couldnt find the value of front side bus.where do i look for it ?
--
During the boot process, whn the American Megatrends logo etc are isplayed the term " PIII 650 Mhz " is displayed.
Also 65536 kb . OK . is displayed.Thats memory?
however inside BIOS settings page ,under CPU Pnp, the CPU speed (Mhz) was set as 200 MHz (100 x 2 ).
I changed it to 650 Mhz (6.5 x 100).
--

heres the temp values:

CPU Slot1 temp:51 C/123 F
Socket 370 temp : 44 C / 113 F
Sys temp : 46 C/105 F

Cpu fan speed : 4753 RPM
Chasis fan speed : 0 <zero>

The VCC values are appx same as the specified reqd values.

--
When the computer goes off , actually the monitor switches OFF and the leds on the MOBO glow simultaneously.or whn it hangs instead , then at times it does so with long beep.

--
A weird thing again. the last 2 days the comp has been down , I find that it is far easier to start my comp
at night after 11 pm than during day.in both caes the comp does go off, but during night time , iam atleast ble to start system with restart each time it goes off.....

FYI:I live in India and its quite a hot place.
but then i didnt have these problems all these years.
--
well i checked the front power switch and other switches..its not them that is the prob...coz it does start after all and the monitor goes off...
--
--
what does F in RTFM refer to? is it "fckn?" lol

 

[alberteinstein]

oh yeah!! i know this post is sucking up your time!!!
and i feel bad about it dude.

You know , i used to wonder how u answer so many posts ,that too in a detailed manner....!!!(& for free!!!)

whats the drive for u to help others so much tektippy?

wanna know!!