WIndows 98SE shows instead of XP Home Edition 2

[HelpMePleaseTek]

Hello everyone!
Hope I can get some assistance here as this is far beyond anything else I've encountered.

I'm upgrading a computer system from ATA to SATA drives (more complicated than that, if and when you require additonal information I'll be happy to provide as much technical detail to assist you!)
I have a SATA drive 600 GB WD Raptor brand new with my old ATA drive ( filled up 250 older GB drive with many partitions to letter V), transferred to it (it has a BSOD error for another reason when the transfer was done to save the data).
Upon reinstalling back in the computer and turning on instead of my usual four system Microsoft menu (four XP systems on the drive so solution can't be to erase a partition and do a parallel installation by the way as I have fully four OS on the drive) I saw something from my long long ago past, the Windows 98 SE logo saying that there was "no keyboard and no mouse" attached.
I worked hard to get a workaround and finally got a keyboard attached (older wired style to USB) which managed to trick the program into proceeding to the next screen. It now says "click" ok to proceed. And guess what? There is no keyboard control, no mouse control because it may appear that the only thing to work on the computer is the old style PS/2 type of round connectors! The new computer with both ATA and SATA connections on the MB, has only USB (2.0), while my older computer had only PS/2 with ATA controller card. Windows 98SE does not recognize USB until it is loaded and I can't get to the loaded page without clicking "ok" and I can't get the arrow to move. I even tried my old PS/2 keyboard and mouse with modern-day adaptors (belkin and staples) to convert to USB and the drivers of course do not load until the program loads and Windows 98 does not have the basic requirements to operate anything until then!)
And the purpose of all my efforts is of course is to get the Windows 98SE to operate for a few minutes, long enough for me to re-upgrade back to my XP Home Edition (no disrespect to my old 98, but I upgraded all my 98's to XP's long ago.
Which brings me to why this is occurring....I'm at a total loss but again I'm trying to restore my four XP systems with over 150 programs (most of which can't be reloaded as they have propritory information/data storage or product keys that the websites have gone done in the years since, so reinstalling is impossible!)
One more curious bit of information you should know, and no one warned me back in the 1990s' or 1980s not to do this, I only have one "full" microsoft edition, Windows 3.0! Everything else (3.1, 3.1.1, WIn 95A, B, C, 98 and 98SE and of course XP Home Edition are all the upgrade versions, so this is complicating things. I did not install or make any partiitons without assistance of others or Partition Commander 10 etc. so they all were functioning when this original problem occured. The question that no one at Dell (the maker of the current circa 2007 computer) is able to fathom why, is why it would drop back down to Windows 98SE?
Let me know if I left out anything. I checked out a number of items on this forum and found interesting items. Long ago, Microsoft alerted me to the "memory" problem of older OS's so while I had 4GB SDRAM fully loaded on the 2007 Optiplex 320 Dell computer, I reduced it to one of my older 1 GB chips while trying to fix the BSOD problem caused by inaccurate Dell manual information.
Thanks for reading this far everyone! I really apprciate the help and advice!
HelpMePleaseTek

 

[Freestone]

What software did you/are you using to migrate the older drive partitions to the newer drive?

 

[edfair]

In upgrade situations older versions are sometimes left in place and the boot loader takes care of loading the proper OS. I could see the bootloader not getting updated or corrupted causing the problem.

As far as the problems doing a total reload, you have found the largest issue /wrt having upgrades rather than clean installs. It is expensive to keep buying new versions but cheap in comparison to the efforts when you have start over.

I've resolved some of the upgrade issues by cloning a spare when I've reached the install level I desire.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[BadBigBen]

Take a look at Paragon Migrate OS to SSD (works with HDD's as well)...

This software will transfer your 250 GB (4 XP installs) all to the 600 GB VelociRaptor with out a hitch...



Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

 

[goombawaho]

The OP has created a giant mess. Almost incomprehensible. Revolting, yet interesting problem.

 

[kjv1611]

Not only is this a very strange mess you've gotten into, but also, the way you posted it here, it's very challenging to read. Of course, that isn't stopping many from looking at it, b/c this type of situation is one of those things we'd all avoid - or try to avoid - creating, but at the same time it piques our curiosity.

Anyway, I'm trying to go over your whole post, but for one piece, if you're still getting this:

Windows 98 SE logo saying that there was "no keyboard and no mouse" attached.

Are you using a USB keyboard/mouse? If so, use a PS/2 version of each until this issue is resolved. If you don't have one, go buy one.

I'll try to glance over the rest, and post back in a bit if able.

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[kjv1611]

Okay, now after I posted it, I read 2 words further and noticed more about the keyboard/mouse... somehow I overlooked it the first 3 or so times.

When you say you have 150 programs all of which are no longer supported, and you cannot find any of them. I'm not saying it's absoutely impossible, but I have to say I seriously doubt it.

And also, you're saying you cannot do without 150 programs??? I have to ask this: What are the programs, and how do you use them? How do you KNOW there is no replacement for each of them, or at least some? Perhaps if you talk about the actual programs, someone else might can say, "hey, I know company XYZ no longer exists, but I know where you can find an archived copy of the software installation."

As for the product keys/serial numbers, well, if you bought them all, and they are all so important, surely you kept those somewhere? And besides that, surely they are stored on the computer - messed up as it is? So if you know where to look, perhaps you could use an alternative OS to browse and find what you need.

Otherwise, if you can clean-up your post, maybe repost your situation/question/isssue as best you can, perhaps you can get more or better help, not sure.


..............

And really... IF you do really need this all like it was... well, I'd look FIRST at the link BBB shared. If it doesn't work, worst case scenario, you're out $19. That's far less than the value of your time of trying to figure it out otherwise.

Whatever ends up being, post back with your progress.

"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[HelpMePleaseTek]

Hello everyone!
First and foremost: Thanks to both of you for taking the time and interest to reply to me! I really appreciate it.

I of course did not write my full information therefore creating a shorter initial message, but as I see from your replies (2) to me, creating confusion, so here are some answers and missing information you were in the dark about so far....
I do not know the exact name of the software used to copy the ATA to SATA....that is because the Dell company itself did the transfer for me. Why? How? Read on.....

Dell (the company itself) was the source of the assistance in copying everything from the ATA Drive to my new SATA drive (especially since I purchased the new drive from them as I wanted to be 100% positive it was approved and certified to work in my older (but new to me only had it 2 years now) 2007 Computer.

That was due to fact that in this particular model of Motherboard by DELL neither myself nor the re-seller nor Dell when it sold me the new SATA 600 drive for use in copying over the material from the ATA Drive to the SATA Drive realized....that you can't have ATA and SATA drives in the computer at the same time (yes you physically can, but not operating!)

The two drives refused to see each other, so copying was not possible!

Running programs from one or the other was impossible as well. The BIOS "reports" both drives and their sizes, but communication is not possible.

Dell and their technicians worked with me on the phone on the problem for months and finally pulling the plugs in and out so often and attempting to use different BIOS settings on the motherboard, that we got BSOD for the one running XP operating system. So that stopped me from playing around on the phone with Dell technicans anymore.

As its Dell's new SATA Drive I"m trying to copy to they made me a one time offer, to copy everything from my ATA Drive to their SATA Drive as Dell company did not realize until my case, that the Optiplex 320 User guide and all documentation does state that the motherboard supported four drives, and saying 2 ATA and 2 SATA ports, but never indicated that you can't have one or another of one or the other type running at the same time. (I mean you "can" but they can't "see" each other!).

And you know and I reserached the cost of data transfer, so it was a win-win situation for both of us, and I just sent off the Drives (old ATA and new SATA to Dell and they copied it and sent it back) The settings for the motherboard (I trust they did it, I sent them Letter/Email with the package reminding them to do so and just didn't want to over emphansize what it was, but they said they would use the exact same model to do the transfer (using another computer for my ATA of course) something I did not have here to do this and so the new SATA would be configured properly to the same exact computer/motherboard that I had. Really convenient and easy.

But when I got it back I got Windows 98 and Dell tried to figure out why as the settings are all the same as they used (reset to factory standard anyway).....so since its Windows 98 they signed off on helping me.
Since its WIndows 98, Microsoft will not help me either..

Leaving me with a drive with four operating systems on it and I can't tell which one or any of the four is doing this as the splash screen from Microsoft indicating there are four systems is missing as well after the copying was accomplished. I assume its something on the MBR, but I was assurred that everything was copied from one HDD to the other HDD.

So now you know where I am (other than "up a creek without a paddle") I do have help that has been promised to me. From Dell, should I get it back to the XP operating system again, THEN they will assist me as I still am warrantied for the software under Dell, and Microsoft has the same promise to me as the owner of the XP Home Edition, that once it boots up to XP again, THEN they can still help me (but only till 2014 I hear now).

Thanks again for reading all of this.... Hope it helps!

HelpMePleaseTek (sorry for the long handle)

 

[HelpMePleaseTek]

OOPS ! took too long writing the post I'll read the new ones (appreciate all of your advice) and get back to you!

Yes! Thanks! Great idea about the 150 programs.....to be critical, I have some programs that cost maybe 1,000 for a license and they saved it in their proprietary software saving method. I have copied and recopied the data, but without the original program installed in the windows and operating, its all gibberish to me....I can think of several that comes to mind who are very protective of their data, Adobe Page Maker, ABBYY Fine reader OCR, carbon copy cloner (used when Norton Ghost at one point could not handle the newer size HDD files! Quick Cad and Auto Cad programs that stored architectural drawings and plans in undecipherable formats, and various video Codexes (SONY, Hitachi, etc) for my video editors (will get you names when I get back, leaving for a while now ok?)

Oh, I might be wrong about the current versions of these programs saving in certain special formats, you have to remember these are the programs from circa 2004 to 2006 the latest, so they might have changed to a non-proprietary format now, but the costs are still the same last time I checked the advertisements (I still am listed as a owner so I get ads on an Email on web I can access without my computer...)

Thanks to all!

 

[Freestone]

I'm sorry if I missed this, but is the original ATA drive still in its original, bootable state, as it was prior to this Dell fiasco? If so could you not purchase an external USB drive large, install your your original ATA drive in the PC, use a product like Acronis True Image, create an image of the entire ATA drive onto the USB drive, remove the ATA drive, install the SATA drive, use Acronis to install the image back onto the new SATA drive from the USB drive?

 

[edfair]

Not certain of model # where I faced a similar issue but ended up using acronis boot recovery on USB, ATA on secondary controller, and SATA on primary. Mine did have PATA for the opticals.

Can be done off acronis recovery CD, USB external, and whichever internal, but it will take forever. IIRC a 20 took somewhere around 12 hours.

I have also used acronis to a NAS box. Can't recall if there were any issues coming back out.

As far as the boot loading issues you might want to consider partition magic on top of the current mess. It would give you some positive control of them as you can limit which ones are active.

AS a practical matter I would find another computer with all ATA for the time being and clone your hard drive so you don't end up losing everything.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[HelpMePleaseTek]

Hello again everyone!
Great points by all especially; kjv1611's suggestion that I repost the quesiton: (And listening to Ed Fair's advice: "Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solution.") here goes:

So if I do it as I really would have liked to do (without losing everyone's interest) here it is in full (abbreviated albeit)----if you want details just point out the numbered paragraph and I'll go into greater detail and provide as much data (redacted) as I can for your help and assistance.

1. I began with a computer c. 2000 designed for my needs by a "gamer" who worked for a major computer company that built it with a Gigabyte MB (model # if you need that but we are far beyond that problem at this point). I was more "well off" then so the whole thing cost me circa $3,000 back then even with reusing parts and old drives wiped from my other computers (we're talking old here 486's and Pentium I's)

2. The computer was hard wired with the first of the RAID programs (RAID 0) and between that and Norton Ghost I copied and made sure everything was backed up! I had everything set to "automatic" (last time I'll ever do that!) by the "gamer" to make things simple i.e. 10% change in data in any one of my 15 Drives and/or Partitions caused the restriping if I remember correctly of that data. Otherwise, weekly backups were automatically set to go in the background.

3. That computer had the acquired programs (totalling 150 when the final disaster of 2006 described below, set in) mostly all upgraded to XP from their original Win 95 or Win 98 versions so it was all working just fine.

4. Occassionally, due to the nature of what I do, sometimes I"m forced to pull the plug and go offline (off the internet) despite having encryption and Norton Anti-Virus etc programs to guarantee safety of information I simply do not ever use the internet for any other reason (leaving Email to another computer (dumb terminal) at work back then. (trying to be short in describing this, but not successful).

5. On or about September 2005 I turned off the Internet and turned it back on February 2006.

Immediately Microsoft had some critical updates (I always set to notify not download or install without my checking) and I checked them out first, and approved them for installation. Along with it came a small program "Windows Genuine Advantage" to check if I had a genuine Windows product. No problem, go and check as I knew I had the genuine product, as I said in my first posting, as I always preferred having my own owned Microsoft product versus OEM for all of the problems I've always known of having a OEM causes in transferring to other drives in those days before the programs (like BBB mentioned in his reply) which are easily available to help us today.

6. Now this gets interesting. I had 3 XP OS's on one drive with all the programs, the other drives being set aside for data storage on USB daisy chained off the computer. One by one, the Microsoft W.G.A. product determined that they were "not genuine" and refused my product codes and eventually started to lock down the drives. Before this occurred, it took three days to complete this lockdown process (and recording over a long video during that time, this occurred in the background unbekown to myself) I found myself with locked drives. Due to the Automated RAID Process, the W.G.A. program had spread like a virus into all the data drives & their backups too leaving nothing untouched. Unlike a regular virus, Microsoft warned that WGA is "not removable" by any method.

7. I contacted Microsoft, and after two years (yes you read it right, two years) of communication with them in Redmond WA in their research division, they established that my motherboard (not just mine I assume but all those gamers who built from that Gigabyte version) were a motherboard that was not accounted for in the creation of the WGA. Therefore, due to my hardwired RAID tending to "reset" the Product keys to different ones --every--single--hour of use---(back then it was "ok" but not totally acceptable, but as soon as WGA was created that was the death knell for the computer as I had to be by the computer to "phone in" the new product key to reset WGA every hour to stop it, and the 3 hours video recording led to drive lockdown).

8. BY this time in 2006, I had not the resources I once had that created the expensive computer, so while I limped along for the next 5 years researching any way out of this predicament, Microsoft said they were willing to unlock the three locked drives, and helped me to create a new "parallel" installation of Windows XP Home Edition, with a new Product Key, provided that they researched and got the Hardwired RAID 0 system turned off. Thus I was left relying just upon Norton Ghost for copying & backing up my information after that. The new Parallel XP Home Edition OS Partition was "empty" and only those programs that I had without product keys or those I managed to get newly installed from new versions are on this smallest of the four operating systems. Important to note for what later occurred that for whatever reason: In no way (I tried, Microsoft tried) are the programs in the "locked" drive accessible by WIn XP from this new installation. They say that its because this was the original type of punishment of locking up of the drives that Microsoft later modified to have less problems, but too late for me as I was locked down by the earlier version that prohibits access

9. Their final and only solution was that they could not restore my system without moving it to a new motherboard i.e. computer. I could not afford that type of transfer until 2010 when I finally got what I needed. A Dell (name branded computer for the first time) Optiplex 320 3.6 Ghz computer with four bays and two ATA ports and two SATA ports available.

10. With this new Dell computer it was such a simple matter to slowly (when I could afford to do so), move my ATA drives to the new computer and copy them off into the SATA Drives, cleaning up the registery and other minor errors as I went through them.


11. .......I had purchased the Dell 2007 computer from a professional re-seller for Dell locally who in March of last year, successfully followed the data transfer methodology, (I would assume he did) and transferred the ATA Drive ( and my daisy chain of seperate data drives I had too) all to the new motherboard of the Optiplex 320 and left me with a working system (Remember now that clearly I had only one of the four XP OS was working when I gave him (the Dell re-seller) the drives to transfer and that is what he returned to me the one XP Home system with dozens of programs still working). Again to be very clear, the one XP that was working successuflly on the Dell 2007 was the fourth "parallel" XP OS that Microsoft helped me to install successfully on the one ATA Drive.

12. So I was using my new Dell Optiplex successfully, no real problems to report, (keeping backups via Norton Ghost again) for a few months before I started on the planned "upgrade" to SATA drvies as this was to be my "inbetween computer" to slowly raise all the my drives (I must have over 15 with all the backups from Norton Ghost and etc) But every single drive until I got the new SATA drive were and still are ATA Drives.

13. The new 2007 computer has both ATA and SATA drive ports and will support four drives with power supply clips and bays galore! Just what I needed.

14. Yet this was not to be true.....

15. (Longer story here which I give just to prove that the 2007 Computer is able to function with the SATA drive--- Meanwhile I got another small 300GB SATA drive (purchased also from Dell Direct) and installed a brand new clean XP Professional on it as I always wanted one with that, but since it was entirely empty of programs, its purpose was to have been used only for "new" programs that I've purchased but never installed or used over the years. I then took that 300 GB WD Raptor drive I used for the new Windows XP Professional and removed it from the internal bays of the computer and set itaside, so I knew that SATA Drives, by themselves, DO work on the computer ---again I purchased that new SATA Drive from DELL to insure it would operate).

16. Then I got the newer 600 GB Drive as I have always had at least two or more separate drives for Data and Programs and wanted to have one new drive for all my programs together rather than swapping out drives as my older (Gamer-designed) computer had hot swappable bays...

17. I guess you should/could ignore all this extra information above (paragraphs 15& 16), but I wrote it anyway in case you wondered "does SATA drives work on the 2007 Computer ?" and the answer is YES, I've done it and it worked.

18. Someone I asked early on in person, suggested that I use my old ATA Drive for the programs and just leave the 600 GB for all the data and elimiate the need for the daisy chained drives, or other copies.

19. Yes! One would normally assume that is possible!

20. One other thing........I always purchased my own operating system from Microsoft (remember the upgrades I mentioned in my earlier post), so the problems of the OEM changing motherboards does not apply and I've moved these programs and operating systems from one system to another over the years successfully until this ATA SATA problem, nothing really bad that I could not fix occurred.

21. I put a Brief summary here: I've only been talking about 2 problems so far:
1. The WGA original one with my Gamer Computer that caused me to seek out a new computer MB to get further help with that problem.
2. The ATA/SATA not seeing each other problem with the Dell 2007 Computer that caused me to have to copy over everything from ATA to SATA using some other method!
Now comes problem #3. I will now go over what occurred to create the copy of the ATA to SATA drive and the resulting Windows 98SE Splash screen with the "ok" button I cannot press to go on.

22. Dell (the company itself) was the source of the assistance in copying everything from the ATA Drive to my new SATA drive (especially since I purchased the new drive from them as I wanted to be 100% positive it was approved and certified to work in my older ( but new to me only had it 2 years now) 2007 Computer.

23. That was due to fact that in this particular model of Motherboard by Dell, neither myself, nor the re-seller, nor Dell, when it sold me the new SATA 600 drive for use in copying over the material from the ATA Drive to the SATA Drive realized....that you can't have ATA and SATA drives in the computer at the same time (yes you physically can, but not operating!).

24. The two drives refused to see each other, so copying was not possible!

25. Running programs from one or the other at the same time was impossible as well. The BIOS "reports" both drives and their sizes, but communication is not possible.

26. Dell and their technicians worked with me on the phone on the problem for months and finally after pulling the plugs in and out so often and attempting to use different BIOS settings on the motherboard, that we got BSOD for the one running XP operating system. So that stopped me from playing around on the phone with Dell technicans anymore.

27. As I had purchased the new drive (Second SATA in this story) from Dell itself, the new SATA WD Raptor 600 GB Drive I"m trying to copy to and use, the Dell Escalation Team made me a one time offer, to copy everything from my ATA Drive to their SATA Drive as Dell company did not realize until my case, that the Optiplex 320 User guide and all documentation does state that the motherboard supported four drives, and saying it has 2 ATA and 2 SATA ports, but never indicated that you can't have one or another of one or the other type running at the same time. (I mean you "can" but they can't "see" each other!).

28. And you know and I researched the cost of data transfer, so it was a win-win situation for both of us, and I just sent off the Drives (old ATA and new SATA to Dell and they copied it and sent it back) The settings for the motherboard (I trust they did it, I sent them Letter/Email with the package reminding them to do so and just didn't want to over emphasize what it was, but they said they would use the exact same model Optiplex 320, to do the transfer (using another computer for my ATA of course) something I did not have here to do this and so the new SATA would be configured properly to the same exact computer/motherboard that I had. Really convenient and easy.

29. But when I got it back and turned it on for the first time I got Windows 98. I installed the newly copied SATA Drive while I had a Dell technician on the phone as I wanted to be 100% certain that BIOS and everything else was set properly for it. He and me tried to figure out why I got the Windows 98 screen as the settings are all the same as they used (reset to factory standard anyway).....so since its Windows 98 they signed off on helping me.

30. Since its Windows 98, Microsoft will not help me either..

31. Leaving me with a drive with four operating systems on it and I can't tell which one or any of the four is doing this as the splash screen from Microsoft indicating there are four systems is missing as well after the copying was accomplished. I assume its something on the MBR, but I was assurred that everything was copied from one HDD to the other HDD.

32. Currently, today, I have a SATA drive 600 GB WD Raptor brand new with my old ATA drive ( filled up 250 older GB drive with many partitions to letter V), transferred to it (it has a BSOD error for another reason when the transfer was done to save the data).

33. Upon reinstalling back in the computer and turning on instead of my usual four system Microsoft menu (four XP systems on the drive so solution can't be to erase a partition and do a parallel installation by the way as I have fully four OS on the drive) I saw something from my long long ago past, the Windows 98 SE logo saying that there was "no keyboard and no mouse" attached.

34. I worked hard to get a workaround and finally got a USB keyboard attached (older wired style to USB) which managed to trick the program into proceeding to the next screen. It now says "click" ok to proceed. And guess what? There is no keyboard control, no mouse control because it may appear that the only thing to work on the computer is the old style PS/2 type of round connectors! The new computer with both ATA and SATA connections on the MB, has only USB (2.0), while my older computer had only PS/2 with ATA controller card. Windows 98SE does not recognize USB until it is loaded and I can't get to the loaded page without clicking "ok" and I can't get the arrow to move.

35. Note: that I even tried my old PS/2 keyboard and mouse with modern-day multi-adaptors (belkin and staples) to convert to USB and the drivers of these modern ones of course do not load until the program loads and Windows 98 does not have the basic requirements to operate anything until then!

36. And the purpose of all my efforts is of course is to get the Windows 98SE to operate for a few minutes, long enough for me to re-upgrade back to my XP Home Edition (no disrespect to my old 98, but I upgraded all my 98's to XP's long ago.)

37. Which brings me to why this is occurring....I'm at a total loss but again I'm trying to restore my four XP systems with over 150 programs (most of which can't be reloaded as they have propritory information/data storage or product keys that the websites have gone done in the years since, so reinstalling is impossible!)

38. One more curious bit of information you should know, and no one warned me back in the 1990s' or 1980s not to do this, I only have one "full" microsoft edition, Windows 3.0! Everything else (3.1, 3.1.1, WIn 95A, B, C, 98 and 98SE and of course XP Home Edition are all the upgrade versions, so this is complicating things. I did not install or make any partitions without assistance of others or Partition Commander 10 etc. so they all were functioning when this original problem occured. The question that no one at Dell (the maker of the current circa 2007 computer) is able to fathom why, is why it would drop back down to Windows 98SE?

39. Let me know if I left out anything. I checked out a number of items on this forum and found interesting items. Long ago, Microsoft alerted me to the "memory" problem of older OS's so while I had 4GB SDRAM fully loaded on the 2007 Optiplex 320 Dell computer, I reduced it to one of my older 1 GB chips while trying to fix the BSOD problem caused by inaccurate Dell manual information.

40. So now you know where I am (other than "up a creek without a paddle") I do have help that has been promised to me. From Dell, should I get it back to the XP operating system again, THEN they will assist me as I still am warrantied for the software under Dell, and Microsoft has the same promise to me as the owner of the XP Home Edition, that once it boots up to XP again, THEN they can still help me (but only till 2014 I hear now).

Thanks again for reading all of this.... Hope it helps!

HelpMePleaseTek
====== = = =
P.S.: New responses : To specifially direct some replies to various very good, clear quesitons you have all raised:

The reason as you can see from the longer story above, why I seek to raise the ATA to SATA and create I hope (I did not mention it but I need the space to create dynamic disks so that I can go beyond Drive Z!) to help me restore the drive back with its 150 programs is that Microsoft has a case number (I keep checking to make sure its still active from so many years ago, as my excuse for not having a new computer is documented), that they would and still promised to provide the assistance in "unlocking" those three locked drives so I can once again access the 150 programs and their data "just as I left it" and not have to reenter or buy new programs to do the same thing.

What could be so important? Well take for example (I do make errors, but at the time they are not errors!), that I purchased an early version of Family Tree Maker. I entered 1600 names of family into it laborasily over many years at the time my computer (described above) was the biggest one of anyone else in family so it fell to me to do that daunting task. Unfortunately the WGA problem occurred and I did not buy the "in-between version" of the Family Tree Maker. So that the newer version needs the older version to be "activated" one more time so I can use it to rewrite and "export" properly the data before the newer program can read it. I do not have the in-between Family Tree Maker that could have read the data without exporting it in another format, and just by resaving it (or so the FTM phone help told me circa 2006) that was the only option I had since my version was so old. The only other option left for me is to physically retype into all the fields every single bit of information on 1600 relatives and dates of birth/death/ etc all again from my written notes (hoping that I did not make corrections that I did not write down first and get fact checked!) Just a personal note of the magnitude of the loss that the original WGA created. My profesional losses are even greater and occur with the other programs I mentioned in my addendum to the prior letter and include ABBYY Fine Reader, and , Adobe Page Maker, ABBYY Fine reader OCR, carbon copy cloner (used when Norton Ghost at one point could not handle the newer size HDD files! Quick Cad and Auto Cad programs that stored architectural drawings and plans in undecipherable formats, and various video Codexes (SONY, Hitachi, etc) for my video editors.

For another example, I've used ABBYY Fine Reader to scan and OCR many articles (c. 10,000 ) I've collected over the years to transform huge piles into the computer digitized format merely for space saving reasons. I never had time to bother labeling each file, so trusting the ABBYY to display either thumbnail or information from the file which would serve as my searching under broad topics I saved them i.e. "Architecture" or under "Architects" "Frank Lloyd Wright" etc etc you get the idea, Again, never realizing that despite my very good backup processes I would lose the ability to access them by losing the ABBYY program itself along with its code unlocking feature of how it compressed and saved the files! Thus, I cannot "point" to any particular files to save and spend time and money for those versus the others as without labels and without the programs "viewer" (If I remember it was called that its been a long time since I used it!), I cannot locate which files to save without the program.
Also, I have several other video and audio programs which use compression features that only they use, so once again I need the operating programs (even for just a few minutes or hours) once again to upgrade to higher level ones, even if I could afford to do so. Much easier for everything all around if only I got back the original XP OS the way it was and just limp along with those files and hopefully one day get funds to jump up to better, more open filing systems!

Reply to latest suggestion by Ed Fall about Adonis (vs my Norton Ghost version _____) I always read reviews first and to be clear, I appreciated your suggestion that Acronis True Image is to be looked at, but reading the review and all the comments that follow it leaves me in the dust as I'm a "user" not an IT person, (there is one in charge where I work, but only those computers with the "label" purchased by the company can be helped by the IT guy, after they clamped down on that rule, I got no help from him for my home computer, though he had done lots of this stuff for me which is why I sound like I really did a lot, it was his "instructions" that I followed!). Therefore I really leave those things for people who know these systems inside and out. When I told others of the amount of collected data I had to transfer (saying I only wanted the programs transferred was bad enough) they quoted me very high prices and long time spent doing unknown computer clean up work (more about that in another post if anyone wants to know). Please look at this series of reviews and comments and tell me what you think.

http://www.techsupportalert.com/drive-imaging-reviews.htm

(especially first four comments by users)

If you still think Acronis True Image is better over Ghost I can always give that a whirl, but again I have no external SATA enclosure yet (and I know how difficult it is as I just took someone else's laptop in to have that done (at "Staples" no less) with it as it had no backup and I"m just not confident of myself doing it alone using the newer SATA systems and Windows 7 on that laptop yet to set up the system, and we can say that is ditto for my own, newer to me, 2007 Dell computer. I just don't yet feel confident enough to set up such a copying/disk imaging a whole drive externally by myself. I'm not even sure which direction the copying should be done in, as should it be from ATA external (I have IEEE ATA FIrewire enclosures or Mad Dog ATA slower USB ones, or should the new 600 GB be in the enclosure (I would need a new type of SATA one!) By the way, this reminds me that due to production line problems at Dell I could only get the 3G/s version which I had to Jumper down to 1.5G/s for my older-type 2007 MB, and don't know if that would work successfully across the external Drive should I set it up that way. Thus, as you can see, while I know the terms I'm really not confident enough doing these things (as mostly I do them once in my life, not every day), to ensure that I don't mess up the original ATA drive, which is whole reason why I entrusted DELL to do the copying and not myself. (Just so you know I can "experiment" I had Dell copy it over to an unused ATA Drive just in case, so there is an extra copy, but I'd rather not touch that one at all unless there was no other way to do this!---so I'm not testing or experimenting with that one to see if it too has a Windows 98 on the start up screen!) I just do the process once its been set up by "someone else" if you get the meaning. I still am waiting to get "back to work" on all these programs and catch up someday from these problems!

I also worry, that since I never tried that, the point of paragraphs # 18, 19 etc above shows that the MB does not see the two drives, so its unkown by me at this point if they would have read both types of drives (as the BIOS has to report seeing the drives on the external enclosure as well in order to do the copying successfully). And I would wonder, if that was simply all I had to do, why didn't Dell recommend I get an enclosure (they knew I had others and was familiar with using them), and do the copying with the SATA either in the computer or the enclosure connected via USB or Firewire? They had to resort to the expense and time consuming process of actually seting up two complete computers at their HQ to do the copying "peer to peer".

I used Partition Commander 10 for everything (earlier versions of course). If Partition Magic is better let me know, but I remember reading somewhere about using two different types of Partition programs that they use different methods, and it confuses the drive MBR?? if I switch back and forth (as I would be likely to do as I'm more familiar with the Partition Commander control screen, et al.)

Nice thought, to get a 100% ATA computer, but as I have limited resources now, and what does this all mean? That I cannot carry my older computer system files and programs up to a brand new SATA type computer someday down the road, that I'm permanently stuck in ATA style? Let me know my options should this be the unfortunate case!

 

[goombawaho]

Wow - information overload post of the year nomination for the above.

Do you really think anyone is going to read all that, follow it and analyze it? I think you're asking too much for a free internet forum. I don't think I'd take the job if it was PAID.

1. Buy a full software license (XP, Visa, 7 - pick one)
2. Put in a new hard drive
3. Load Windows on new hard drive
4. Copy data off old hard drives
5. Move on

 

[Freestone]

Find someone who knows how to use Acronis, Ghost, or <insert your favorite image software tile here>. Have them image your entire old drive onto the new 600GB drive. Notice I say IMAGE, not copy. Insert new drive into your system and continue with your years quests of unlocking the other three partitions, which from my search, I can't find anywhere Windows Genuine Advantage doing when detecting a failure.

to be critical, I have some programs that cost maybe 1,000 for a license

After spending this much on a program, are you trying to tell us you don't have the install media any longer and/or its keys? For none of the most critical apps you want to get access to?

 

[edfair]

So far as straight cloning, Ghost and TI are about the same. Throw a change in size into the mix and I prefer Acronis, enough so that I buy multiples to give to customers. Both can ahve problems but over the last 20+, including multi generational copies, I've had none with TI.

You may need to buy expansion controller cards to enable the mix of drives you are involved with. That would resolve the 320 issue you are fighting.

You can find used computers that will handle drive cloning at reasonable prices. They are not barn-burners but sufficient, GX270s, for example, sell around $50.00.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[goombawaho]

After spending this much on a program, are you trying to tell us you don't have the install media any longer and/or its keys? For none of the most critical apps you want to get access to?

Yes, this type of comment always rings a suspicious bell in my brain. OP has no full O.S. licenses and that extends to critical apps. That is how NOT to do things. I hate to be critical, but people find themselves in predicaments for a reason.

I want to give credit to anyone that actually read that huge post!!!!!!!

 

[kjv1611]

I'm with goomb on length of the question/post by the OP. I hope you get it sorted out - one way or another, but no way I'm going to damage my eyesight to read that long a question.

So, I guess I should have said something more like:

To get the best answer, make sure your question is "short and sweet" or succinct yet to the point.

But then again, since I'm not going to take the time to read the latest long posting, I suppose I am just missing that it is just really that difficult.

If you go with the imaging solution that's been mentioned a few times now, then that's the only way this is gonna work.

One thing to keep in mind that is if you are moving to a new motherboard, etc, besides the hard drive. Take a long look ad something like the Paragon tool mentioned. Some tools specifically help handle differences in drivers and such. Whereas a straight image transfer may work... and then again... may not work, depending upon what drivers are changed.

Otherwise, have fun.


"But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." 1 Corinthians 15:57

 

[HelpMePleaseTek]

I appreciate all your responses and really am writing down a plan of action based upon your lists and my searching in the web since then. I will reply to everyone soon.

A short reply to goombawaho and Freestone:

I felt I should reply to you two first, so others don't get discouraged--let you know that I am legit. I owned, purchased all the programs for job or personal use and I kept EVERYTHING! All organized on bookcase shelves and on desk in an open common area, with CD's kept in their boxes so with all Product Codes and Documentation.....until (long before I had any problems with the WGA), I had a week/two mandatory serving on jury---got sequestered (case was settled so never had decision!) but while I was gone, the "neat" (think of Felix Unger person type--I'm more Oscar Madison, but he did get the sports stories out, right?) said all these messy things on shelves! You have all these programs "inside" the computer so you don't need old boxes full of notes and junk that say things in bold type like "2003 ! Latest Windows XP improvements!") so oops! out they went! And by the time I got back, its far too late and too many lost to recover the damage. Stuffed the rest in boxes "under the bed" and have not lost a Product Key or important installation note/patch since (of course its hours to find something I need when I need it but I got them all saved since then!) Some people not familiar with technical side of things just think computers exist 100% inside the "box" on the floor-stand and that's all there is to it! I know about saving important items inside the computer in password protected etc programs, but remember I know what its like to not have access to the computer, so I always kept important information, real-physical phone numbers and addresses for each program "outside" the computer box just in case diasters would occur.

Therefore, unfortunately, the only product keys and codes are inside the computer and I "should have" "could have" resurrected some of them by finding the "about" sections of the programs while the computer was operational and placed them back on paper again, but by that time I got the 2005 project to do until February 2006 when I lost the drive and backups to WGA.

Thanks again for your help and understanding....

HelpMePleaseTek

 

[edfair]

Yeah, I read it. It sets the mind to work, which is a longstanding problem. Others might think I'm into S&M.

Although there was one comment about different partitions there was another about drive letters to "V" and this would indicate that there was an extended partition with logical drives, and some possibility that the boot stuff for XP2 and XP3 were on logical drives.
That might explain why WGA identified them as bogus.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[Freestone]

@edfair Just so you don't feel alone, Ed, I too read the entire post, and some parts more than once. And no, I'm not into S&M

@kjv611 You are rightly concerned about moving an image to a different motherboard. Acronis supplies a separate add-on, used to be called Universal Restore, but now for the True Image 2012 & 2013 versions, it's part of their Plus Pack. It basically strips out the HAL and redetects devices. Have drivers handy when opting this route. Lately, however, if moving from Intel-based to Intel based motherboards, you can get away without anything extra, usually.

@HelpMePleaseTek My wife is somewhat of a Felix Unger and I must remind her at times that those little small boxes of stuff she eyes throwing out contains things costing hundreds of dollars it total, so she might want to curb the cleaning desire.

If you are not comfortable with imaging, do yourself a favor and try to find someone who knows this stuff. There will no worse feeling than finding out you cloned an empty drive onto the drive you wanted to get an image of! There is no easy recovery from this situation, if any. I think I read you have a copy of your drive tucked away.

I'm hesitant to ask, and a short answer would be appreciated by all, but say you are successful imaging. Aren't you still only going to end up with a drive that has four partitions, three which are locked somehow and inaccessible, and one usable partition that is basically empty?