Lately I've been seeing a lot of commercials on TV with IT/Business professionals telling their horror stories with PC's and Windows. They then go into how they found the Mac, plugged everything in and it just worked. Is the Macintosh OS getting better and more accepted, or is it just a clever advertising scheme?
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What's up with Macintosh?
- Thread starter cderow
- Start date
CajunCenturion
Programmer
Just like the Microsoft "1 degree of separation" commercials, its advertising and marketing. Good Luck
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As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
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As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
Cderow,
Macintosh is definitly getting better! Mac OSX is their latest OS and it boasts an interface to die for!
I am a windows user because I have no choice. I decided to buy a Mac Laptop when I get a new laptop.
One of the main reasons why the latest macs are so good is that they are built on top of FreeBSD, a UNIX system similar to Linux you keep hearing about. Unix is a programmer's paradise and is stable as rock.
Macs have legendary usability and let's be honest it looks very very nice!
Now that Mac's latest OS is UNIX it is one of the most stable and polyvalent(means it can do a lot of things) system out there.
Programmers used to Linux or Unix will feel right at home when they open a console and veteran Mac users will also feel at home because the interface is as easy to use as ever.
It's really the best of both worlds! Gary Haran
Macintosh is definitly getting better! Mac OSX is their latest OS and it boasts an interface to die for!
I am a windows user because I have no choice. I decided to buy a Mac Laptop when I get a new laptop.
One of the main reasons why the latest macs are so good is that they are built on top of FreeBSD, a UNIX system similar to Linux you keep hearing about. Unix is a programmer's paradise and is stable as rock.
Macs have legendary usability and let's be honest it looks very very nice!
Now that Mac's latest OS is UNIX it is one of the most stable and polyvalent(means it can do a lot of things) system out there.
Programmers used to Linux or Unix will feel right at home when they open a console and veteran Mac users will also feel at home because the interface is as easy to use as ever.
It's really the best of both worlds! Gary Haran
CajunCenturion
Programmer
xutopia - You make some excellent points, and I agree with you. But I do have to ask, is the real improvement because the machine is a MAC, or is the improvement because the OS is UNIX? UNIX and its derivatives work just fine (better than Windows), on PC's as well. Good Luck
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As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
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As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
- Thread starter
- #5
There is also the possibility of Mac eventually releasing OS 10 on PC/x86 architecture. I personally think this would be one of the single best investment Apple could ever make. There are millions of PC owners wishing they could try Mac, but having already made an investment in PC hardware.
Shouldn't be too hard. After all, FreeBSD and Mach (part of Mac's subsystem) both work on x86 already. -------------------------------------------
Big Brother: "War is Peace" -- Big Business: "Trust is Suspicion"
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Shouldn't be too hard. After all, FreeBSD and Mach (part of Mac's subsystem) both work on x86 already. -------------------------------------------
Big Brother: "War is Peace" -- Big Business: "Trust is Suspicion"
(
Mac systems have always been quite stable (well in the last 8 years anyways). Unix just offers lots of technical improvements and opens up the system to a library of GNU software already running on Unix/Linux.
OSX is actually the nicest looking and most usable graphical user interface (GUI) that an OS ever had. It builds upon Mac's legacy and improves upon that.
The big reason why they decided to use Freebsd as their base is that it allows them to make Macintosh enter the realm of the server market where Freebsd is right now one of the leaders (it's in the top 5 or 10).
If OSX was to open up to the X86 platform I would buy their OS immediatly and without hesitation. One of the biggest drawback to having a mac are the costs associated with it (it is a bit more expensive). Gary Haran
OSX is actually the nicest looking and most usable graphical user interface (GUI) that an OS ever had. It builds upon Mac's legacy and improves upon that.
The big reason why they decided to use Freebsd as their base is that it allows them to make Macintosh enter the realm of the server market where Freebsd is right now one of the leaders (it's in the top 5 or 10).
If OSX was to open up to the X86 platform I would buy their OS immediatly and without hesitation. One of the biggest drawback to having a mac are the costs associated with it (it is a bit more expensive). Gary Haran
MasterRacker
Active member
You guys are missing the point here. It's discussing the "just plug it all together and it works by itself and you can dump your IT staff" aspect of the commercials that's crap marketing and actually dangerous.
Unless your company does nothing but write letters and print them, once you get above 6-10 people the peer network breaks down. You start needing a server to provide centralized storage. You need policies and procedures for data naming, structure, backup, archiving, disaster recovery, version control. What about software licensing, and version control. What about asset management. You're going to want to connect to the outside world so what about firewalls, virus checking and other security measures. These issues all exist on a Mac netowrk too.
The actual desktop computers, netowrk and software are at least partially immaterial. They all work together through a network to support a system for conducting business. That system needs to be guided if not fully controlled by a professional trained in that area, even if they're part-time in a smaller company. Installing software and taking help desk calls is not the real value if IT. These other areas are.
Dave Kearns of Network World magazine recently wrote a couple of articles that say it better than I can:
Jeff
No matter how bad it is, it can always get worse ....
Unless your company does nothing but write letters and print them, once you get above 6-10 people the peer network breaks down. You start needing a server to provide centralized storage. You need policies and procedures for data naming, structure, backup, archiving, disaster recovery, version control. What about software licensing, and version control. What about asset management. You're going to want to connect to the outside world so what about firewalls, virus checking and other security measures. These issues all exist on a Mac netowrk too.
The actual desktop computers, netowrk and software are at least partially immaterial. They all work together through a network to support a system for conducting business. That system needs to be guided if not fully controlled by a professional trained in that area, even if they're part-time in a smaller company. Installing software and taking help desk calls is not the real value if IT. These other areas are.
Dave Kearns of Network World magazine recently wrote a couple of articles that say it better than I can:
Jeff
No matter how bad it is, it can always get worse ....
MasterRacker,
are you referring to commercials? I never saw these commercials. I am in France with no TV.
Advertising has alwas been exagerated sometimes even lies. The microsoft 1 second commercials are no different. Gary Haran
are you referring to commercials? I never saw these commercials. I am in France with no TV.
Advertising has alwas been exagerated sometimes even lies. The microsoft 1 second commercials are no different. Gary Haran
I guess OSX is stable, it better be...especially when it's made to only work on one platform made by one company. If you can't make an OS that works in an environment that you totally control...well, maybe you shouldn't be in the computer business.
Paying more for less hardware that can only run a MAC OS and a flavour of Linux is ridiculous. And if MACs are so amazing...why do they need to use gimics to sell computers?? The see-through monitors and the swivel flat screen...all just smoke and mirrors to catch the eye of some "kid" who likes shiny things.
If you don't know how to set the clock on your VCR...buy a MAC...it'll be a perfect fit.
Paying more for less hardware that can only run a MAC OS and a flavour of Linux is ridiculous. And if MACs are so amazing...why do they need to use gimics to sell computers?? The see-through monitors and the swivel flat screen...all just smoke and mirrors to catch the eye of some "kid" who likes shiny things.
If you don't know how to set the clock on your VCR...buy a MAC...it'll be a perfect fit.
- Thread starter
- #13
I have no quarrels about the Mac OS being stable, especially if Unix is thrown into the fray. If Macintosh were to put the OS out for a PC platform, I would be interested in trying it out. However, the ads that are being put out have bothered me a bit due to these end users claiming that if you buy a Mac, all your technical problems will vanish because Windows makes things break. I, too, feel that is misleading and dangerous.
butchrecon
MIS
The comercials are misleading. The "I'm <insert name here>, and I am a windows programmer and I switched to mac" commercials are just marketing. If the user was a windows programmer and having constant PC crashes then he needs to find a new line of work. As long as M$ is the top dog in PC's the major manufacturers are not going to offer alternative OS's with their machines to the mainstream public. THe new macs are stable because of the unix platform not the hardaware. Windows is not perfect but for now it is the defacto accepted OS that most users use on a day to day basis. James Collins
Field Service Engineer
A+, MCP
email: butchrecon@skyenet.net
Please let us (Tek-tips members) know if the solutions we provide are helpful to you. Not only do they help you but they may help others.
Field Service Engineer
A+, MCP
email: butchrecon@skyenet.net
Please let us (Tek-tips members) know if the solutions we provide are helpful to you. Not only do they help you but they may help others.
Hello,
I'm in Japan, and there are the same stupid TV commercials here. Listening to the reason why they switched to MAC is really laughable. ie: someone complaining about the fact she lost a file because of a crash. It happened to me when using a MAC (the deadly bomb) and a clever computer user would save his work as often as possible.
Anway, according to me, The OSX interface is clogged with useless features that sucks CPU power. The more CPU get stronger, the more they add useless code on OS. That's a reason why I avoid even the last OS from microsoft.
I'm in Japan, and there are the same stupid TV commercials here. Listening to the reason why they switched to MAC is really laughable. ie: someone complaining about the fact she lost a file because of a crash. It happened to me when using a MAC (the deadly bomb) and a clever computer user would save his work as often as possible.
Anway, according to me, The OSX interface is clogged with useless features that sucks CPU power. The more CPU get stronger, the more they add useless code on OS. That's a reason why I avoid even the last OS from microsoft.
I used to Manage a Macintosh technical support centre for a mail order dealer, and let me tell you, they may look nice (they do.. I'll admit it), however, they have always been plagued with things such as limited hardware drivers. Peripherals are usually more expensive as additional drivers have to be specifically manufactured. Replacement parts, e.g. new logic boards are extremely expensive.
OS X although stable is very clumbersome. The 'Dock' the bit at the bottom of OS X what you can launch to store you application short custs gets cluttered very easily.
But the thing that annoys me thae most is that if you want to run previous Mac OS 9 (or earlier) applications from within OS X you have to boot the OS 9 operating system on top of Mac OS X. This eats you processing power and memory, and the general performance of your computer goes down hill.
I will admit - they are good for the non-technically minded, the designers and video editors of this world who just want to get on with their work and not have to worry too much about he workings of the machine. But they are far to expensive.
OS X although stable is very clumbersome. The 'Dock' the bit at the bottom of OS X what you can launch to store you application short custs gets cluttered very easily.
But the thing that annoys me thae most is that if you want to run previous Mac OS 9 (or earlier) applications from within OS X you have to boot the OS 9 operating system on top of Mac OS X. This eats you processing power and memory, and the general performance of your computer goes down hill.
I will admit - they are good for the non-technically minded, the designers and video editors of this world who just want to get on with their work and not have to worry too much about he workings of the machine. But they are far to expensive.
dilettante
MIS
I'd be glad to have the following put to rest as an ignoant rumor. I'm sure no Mac guy and a very lightweight Unix user...
A young co-worker who has some "hackish" acquaintances at a large nearby University (ok, I admit several degrees of separation here - story may be bogus) says these OS X boxes are delivered so wide-open they're dangerous. Much more exposed than out of the box Windows XP. The story goes further and claims typical Mac people are so Unix illiterate they don't take even the most basic security precautions.
For example, my co-worker says his buddy sent him an email listing root passwords for about 100 OS X Macs on campus - all school machines. The guy claims it was gathered running a common and rather old script these types kick around, in a matter of seconds.
So setting the ethics of this aside for a second (not easy), I wonder how true this is? Remember, I have the word of a guy taking the word of a shady guy here.
If it is true, how risky is it for a business to put these things online anyway? Seems damned-foolish if true, and I'd think any "hacker insurance" would be voided.
Then again perhaps they're easy to lock down too. But hey, "no IT Department" right?
A young co-worker who has some "hackish" acquaintances at a large nearby University (ok, I admit several degrees of separation here - story may be bogus) says these OS X boxes are delivered so wide-open they're dangerous. Much more exposed than out of the box Windows XP. The story goes further and claims typical Mac people are so Unix illiterate they don't take even the most basic security precautions.
For example, my co-worker says his buddy sent him an email listing root passwords for about 100 OS X Macs on campus - all school machines. The guy claims it was gathered running a common and rather old script these types kick around, in a matter of seconds.
So setting the ethics of this aside for a second (not easy), I wonder how true this is? Remember, I have the word of a guy taking the word of a shady guy here.
If it is true, how risky is it for a business to put these things online anyway? Seems damned-foolish if true, and I'd think any "hacker insurance" would be voided.
Then again perhaps they're easy to lock down too. But hey, "no IT Department" right?
The only known out of the box security bugs that Apple had on OS X were fixed. One of the bugs was substantial but required domain name spoofing which cannot be done as easily as one would assume.
One of my coworkers told me that he could hack Apache easily and that MS-IIS was safer because he didn't know how to hack it.
Of course I didn't believe all that testosterone being spread around like that so I put him to the test. "I've got apache on two machines, one Windows and one Freebsd. Try to hack both of them please.".
Guess what happened? A big boring nothing.
Apple is doing some things right and I'd definitly be buying one if they were less expensive. Heck if the OS became x86 compatible(technically feasible but commercially not yet viable for Apple) I'd be on the OS in no time!
Gary Haran
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One of my coworkers told me that he could hack Apache easily and that MS-IIS was safer because he didn't know how to hack it.
Of course I didn't believe all that testosterone being spread around like that so I put him to the test. "I've got apache on two machines, one Windows and one Freebsd. Try to hack both of them please.".
Guess what happened? A big boring nothing.
Apple is doing some things right and I'd definitly be buying one if they were less expensive. Heck if the OS became x86 compatible(technically feasible but commercially not yet viable for Apple) I'd be on the OS in no time!
Gary Haran
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ThomasJSmart
Programmer
- Sep 16, 2002
- 634
it could be me but isnt osX graphics a slightly changed version of windowsXP graphics? they seem very similer to me anyway, and also isnt mr gates owner of a large part of apple these days?
I learned a bit yesterday, today i learned a lot, imagine what i'll learn tomorrow!
I learned a bit yesterday, today i learned a lot, imagine what i'll learn tomorrow!
K9,
On graphical user interface you very wrong. It's the other way around. Windows copied Apple.
And yes MS does own a a chunk of Apple. How much I do not know.
Gary Haran
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On graphical user interface you very wrong. It's the other way around. Windows copied Apple.
And yes MS does own a a chunk of Apple. How much I do not know.
Gary Haran
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