Two Possible Job Offers

[rasETL]

Here's the scenario

I currently work as a consultant at a Company 180 miles from home. That requires me to stay there during the week, which is hard on the family. I have been working there for 18 months. The work and pay is great.

Recently, they told me my contract would probably not be extended beyond the end of October. However, they have made a formal job offer to become an employee. I have been sitting on it for a week, but they would now like an answer in three days.

Wouldn't you know it, earlier this week I get a call from a Company 20 minutes from home. They have an open position which is the same as the position offered by the other Company. I have a phone interview this afternoon.

Question: if I accept the offer from the Company I am currently working at, which would have me start as an employee October 18th, does that "lock" me in if the other Company also makes me an offer? Legally, I don't think so, but ethically, I'm not sure.

I'd like this job change to be my last change - in other words I'd like to retire from wherever I end up. I'm looking at probably 9-10 years.

The main problem is the travel considerations - my family would not move to the new location for 4 years minimum due to schooling of my kids.

I welcome your thoughts on the matter.

 

[Nortellian]

do what's right for you and your family.

 

[zemp]

Family first. You can change your job and your boss but not who your kids are.

zemp

 

[LFI]

Well, people leave jobs all the time for ones with better pay or benefits or location, etc. I don't see why you would be locked in.

However, if you feel bad about telling your current employer yes, but then taking an offer somewhere else, that's another thing.

I would NOT recommend you're telling your current employer about your plans. Rather, take the current job, then IF you get the one closer to home, tell your current employer: "I wish this job [with current employer] was close to my house, because I don't want to leave. For the sake of my family, however, I need to take this job I have been offered that is 20 minutes from home. I hope I can leave here on good terms."

...or, if you're a good negotiator and this past 18 months has proven that your family can handle the stress: "I just received an offer to do the same work for the same pay [if this is true], but only 20 minutes from my house. I feel that, for my family's sake, I should take it, but I don't really want to leave here. I feel like I'm already part of the team here and I like this team. I can't deny the convenience of working close to home though. Is there anything you can say that will make me stay?"

Implication: "Make me an offer!" Maybe the great pay will become UNBELIEVABLE pay!

I am no such negotiator myself, however, so I cannot vouch for the effectiveness of the second approach. Also, I am a family man and vote with the others: Family First.

Good luck! There are worse positions to be in than to have two job offers!

--Dave

 

[chiph]

Once you accept an offer from either company, you are at least morally committed to them. "Legally committed": depends on the labor laws in your area.

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[LFI]

Chip H.,

I agree with you to a degree, but I don't see it as a "serious" moral commitment, by comparison to say, the moral commitment we make when we marry to not cheat on our spouse. The moral commitment we make to our spouses never expires (except in divorce or death... or mutual agreement), but there must be an expiration to the moral commitment to our employer... otherwise it would never be considered moral to leave one job for another.

So how long does a person have to work at a job to fulfill that moral commitment?

--Dave

 

[Thadeus]

Having been in many ethics courses, I see no ethical issue with you accepting a position at your current situation and then entertaining any new offers as they come in. If that is three weeks hence, then so be it.
Companies hire at will and release at will... Unless they have offered you an internal contract with them (promised you two years at x dollars) then you are also at will.

You have to look out for you and you alone.
The company will be looking out for itself.

 

[LFI]

To add to what Thadeus posted...

You might feel that you have a certain relationship with your boss and a desire to be loyal to him/her. The feeling may even be mutual. But the "Company" is a different animal. Unfortunately, many are the bosses who have been informed that they must fire someone they didn't want to fire.

You have to look out for you and you alone.
The company will be looking out for itself.

True.

--Dave

 

[DrJavaJoe]

Let's say you were retiring in November and they knew it, you don't think they would want to keep you around for that next month, it's not like they have to train you, they are just changing your status to employee. Nothing new is happening in October, the contract between you and them is just being renegotiated and probably in there favor. So let's say you get the new job two days before the old contract is up and before you are to begin as an employee, I would think that they would still want their 2 weeks notice if not more. They want to know in 3 days because they need to start looking for a replacement incase you are not interested. If you can put off that search and stick around a little longer then good for you.

Two strings walk into a bar. The first string says to the bartender: 'Bartender, I'll have a beer. u.5n$x5t?*&4ru!2[sACC~ErJ'. The second string says: 'Pardon my friend, he isn't NULL terminated'.

 

[smedvid]

As mentioned, companies hire at will and fire at will... Do what is right for u. Don't live to work, rather work to live and enjoy life, as someone once put it. Personally, I would accept the job offer and then continue to enterain other offers. I'm sure mentioning that there is a hardship with the commute is more than sufficient justification to depart a company. good luck.

Steve Medvid
"IT Consultant & Web Master"

http://www.saveourfarm.com

Chester County, PA Residents
Please Show Your Support...

 

[chiph]

but I don't see it as a "serious" moral commitment, by comparison to say, the moral commitment we make when we marry to not cheat on our spouse.

Not that serious, sure!

But it does touch on the areas of being honest, and being respectful of other people's time. If you get hired by a company, and 3 days later leave for greener pastures, you've just wasted a lot of people's time: the HR person who gave you the parking pass, told you about the 401(k) plan, etc The coworkers who took time out from their jobs to train you on what you would be doing. The manager who made plans around your being available to do work. The IT person who ordered & set up your computer & phone.

While loyalty to any company only goes so far, you shouldn't forget that a company is made up of people, and they will remember you long after you're gone. Breaking an offer, or leaving after only a few days, should be regarded as burning one of your career bridges.

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[rasETL]

chiph ... you have a good point.

BTW... just got off the phone interview. I have had at least 6 of these the past two years, and I would rate this one the best, by far. My past experiences line up almost exactly with what they are looking for in this position.

Given chiph's comments, I guess I will have to hope this either turns around fast or they really drag their heels. However, the interviewer said they were looking to select candidates for in-house interviews "in the next few weeks".

Sounds like "timing" is going to be an issue.

 

[chiph]

Glad the interview went well. Hope you get the job!

I'm not sure what to tell you about the timing problem.

A lot depends on what your feel is on the various companies involved. You want to be honest with them, but you don't want to come across as appearing to leverage one company against another (a bidding war). Probably just tell them that you need to get an answer by a certain date.

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[Thadeus]

I'm sorry, I still feel that it is not morally wrong to take the offer with company A and then turn around and accept an offer from company B one week later. It would be different if you accepted the job 'knowing' you would be leaving, but you are accepting the job and 'entertaining' other offers.
I have been hired and subsequently layed-off after I was courted away from a stable company. The lay-off was an economic thing and 750 employees were let go en-masse. When I was hired the company outlook was presented rather rosy (leader in the industry, fortune 50 clientele, etc.)They didn't apologize for wasting a portion of my career. They didn't offer to get me another position. They are not concerned with any bridges they burned.

It is my opinion that you would not be going into this with a dishonest intent... I would repeat the more fundamental question that has already been posed: When you get a job, how long is an acceptable period of time before you can look to get a better one? I opine that you should never stop looking for a better position.

~Thadeus

 

[chiph]

Shortest period of time that I've been employed is 38 days. It was obvious by that point that the company:
(a) didn't know what to do with me
(b) couldn't afford me.

It truly was a mutual separation when we went our separate ways. I still keep in touch with them.

Shortest period of time I've seen someone employed at a company where I've worked: 10 days. This was during the dot-com boom, and they seriously overrepresented themselves and their skills.

But, to answer your question: Either 5 days (it's obvious that you'd rather work somewhere else), or 6 weeks (gave it a try, and it wasn't for you).

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[ecobb]

Shortest period of time I've seen someone employed at a company where I've worked: 10 days.

At my previous company, I saw a guy start work on Monday, and quit on Friday (5 days) becuase he got another job offer. I also saw a guy start one day and got fired by lunch the next day!



Hope This Helps!

Ecobb

"My work is a game, a very serious game." - M.C. Escher

 

[SQLSister]

Hey we had a guy who was phone interviewed for a satellite office in NC on a military base. He reported his first day, took one look at the office space (which is usually pretty bad on a base - heck the desks were older than he was) and quit on the spot.

Questions about posting. See faq183-874

 

[sha76]

We had someone call up late Friday to say they'd not be starting on the Monday, can't get much shorter than that!

"Your rock is eroding wrong." -Dogbert

 

[ocie]

I apoligize if I'm seen as hijacking this thread, but I have a related question to jobs and ethics:

I see myself in a limited term job, where we are running at a deficit. I feel it is only a matter of time before I am let go. So, I am being proactive about it. I am actually on the cusp of switching careers altogether.

As I prepare myself for switching careers, I am gathering my application materials together.

Should I inform my supervisor now that I am seeking other employment, or wait until I require a reference check to inform him?

Would I be 'sneaking around' by pursuing the other possibility? Keeping in mind of course, that I am doing so on my own time.

 

[Stella740pl]

ocie,

For the future, start a new thread for a new question. It's related but, so are many other threads around here. Now,

Should I inform my supervisor now that I am seeking other employment...
No! You might be let go sooner than you find anything. Wait till you got an offer in writing, accept it, then tell your supervisor 2 weeks before your expected last day, or if your contract requires a different notice term, act accordingly.

Would I be 'sneaking around' by pursuing the other possibility?
That's how people are changing jobs. You don't have to report what you are doing in your spare time. Act for your own good. If your company were to going to fire you not because of money issues, how long in advance they would tell you that they are seeking a replacement for you? You got the idea.

Besides, you mentioned you are on a limited term. Is it a contract? Look it up in advance, to avoid possible problems. Act accordingly.

Stella