The Sassor worm 1

[sleipnir214]

The author of the original Sassor worm apparently claims to have released it to help his mother's PC repair business.

http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1105-5209099.html?tag=header.newsfeed

My question is:

Do computer technology curricula in your area require computer ethics training, and do you think it would have kept this kid on the straight and narrow?





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[CajunCenturion]

But there is a major difference. Teenagers want to drive, and are willing to go to school to study and do it. They are willing participants.

How many teenagers do you know that want to study ethics?

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[EBGreen]

That is an issue of motivation. Granted motivation will effect efficacy, but just participating in the training must have more effect than no training at all. Shouldn't it?

[blue]"Well, once again my friend, we find that science is a two headed beast. One head is nice, it gives us aspirin and other modern conveniences,...but the other head of science is BAD! Oh, beware the other head of science, Arthur; it bites!!" - The Tick[/blue]

 

[sleipnir214]

I didn't want to take driver's ed in high school, as I had been driving for a year before I took the course. But I was willing to tolerate it in exchange for reduced rates on insurance.


The ones who will benefit the most from IT ethics instruction will the the ones with the greatest chances for doing harm -- those with existing programming skills. And they're the ones taking the class to round out college entrance paperwork.

Make IT ethics a prerequisite for taking the programming class, and students will at least tolerate the course. And may learn something beside. If even by osmosis.

Formal ethical thinking is something that can be learned -- critical thinking skills to assess values on which to base ethical judgements, application of the rules of logic, etc.

<aside type="self-sardonic">
Of course, now I'm arguing for formal instruction in critical thinking and logic as a prerequisite for ethics.
</aside>

These young whelps may never really grok ethical-logical thought until they're adults anyway. But they at least have been exposed to the necessary tools.



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[CajunCenturion]

When you state that it's an issue of motivation, you're simply restating what sleipnir214 has already said.

The kid was more motivated to try to help his mother's business than he was motivated to that which is ethically correct. And no, I don't think any formal training would've changed his motivational priorities.

Please read carefully: Nor do I think that incarceration or civil penalities would change the motivational heirarchy between helping Mom and doing what is right. But the repercussions, both criminal and civil which I am in complete favor of, may very likely put a new entry at the top of the motivational heirarchy, where next time he might ask, "Is it worth the risk?"

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[lionelhill]

I've come in this rather late, so sorry if this has already been said lots before, but do you feel this is really a matter of this character lacking ethics? I'm sure no doctor's son or daughter would go round assaulting people to keep Mum/Dad's surgery nice and full. Which makes me wonder if people sometimes underestimate the damage their virus will cause? I'd personally, gladly sentence a typical virus-writer to community service until they've done enough to repay the damage (how many thousand years might that take?) But maybe I'm vindictive.

 

[chiph]

So far as ethics, it really comes down to one of them:
Does that belong to you?

If it does, do what you want to with it. If it doesn't (as in the Internet and all the computers connected to it), then don't touch it.

Because this young adult didn't understand that principle, he felt there was nothing wrong with infecting other people's property with a virus.

Chip H.


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[EBGreen]

Or he knew it was wrong and didn't care. I'd say that is more likely.

[blue]"Well, once again my friend, we find that science is a two headed beast. One head is nice, it gives us aspirin and other modern conveniences,...but the other head of science is BAD! Oh, beware the other head of science, Arthur; it bites!!" - The Tick[/blue]

 

[bluedragon2]

A question,

How many believe he really did this to help mom and dad, or was that just a quick thinking plea for leniency.

If this and the netsky is his doing, and the competition with other virus writers, I think this is just another script kiddie trying to make a name for himself with his peers.

The worst punishment you could probably give someone like this is taking away technology from them. I also agree with the community service and such.

As far as teaching ethics at that level... I think a little bit of ethics should be taught in every class especially relating to IT. You will more then likely get a bigger dose of it in college where it is more likely to sink in. But, in the before college years, some sort of ethics should be taught in everyday classes.




[Blue]Blue[/Blue] [Dragon]

If I wasn't Blue, I would just be a Dragon...

 

[Dollie]

bluedragon2,

It's just speculation that he did this to help his mom's PC help business. A magazine in Norway (I believe) printed this as opinion, not as fact, but the media has picked up on it and it spread just as fast as Sasser did.

I agree with teaching ethics in schools, but the basis of ethics is common sense, and teaching that starts at home.

Just my $0.02.

Dollie

 

[sleipnir214]

<facetious>
If common sense were truly common, we'd have a one-word nomenclature for the phenomenon.
</facetious>


In terms of everyday person-to-person interactions, you're right -- ethics is common sense. But when you start dealing with ethics as it applies to IT, a little theory would come in very handy.



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[Dimandja]

Over two decades ago, I worked at an outfit called The Source. The job was purely experimental and lots of fun: we and Compuserve had the first truly public computer networks.

I also experienced hackers and their viruses for the first time at The Source. In fact we had to educate the FBI investigators in what hacking really meant.

The phenomenon of hacking or spreading viruses was always directly related to the way people and the media reacted to kids and 'nerds' who could do "prodigious feats" with a computer. Never mind that professional, gainly employed programmers very easily and usually inadvertently (such is the business of programming) create various strains of viruses at their work - usually in the form of 'bugs'.

The public at large is still unduly fascinated by these misguided kids - despite many of the outraged outcries at spreading viruses. The kids see this kind of activity as a way of showing off their computing skills to the world - a kind of Robin Hood sick game. But listen to what people are really saying: "Wow, and he is only 14! What a genious!" - that's exactly what these kids want to hear.

What I am saying is that the public at large provides an irresistible captive audience to these people. It's like a drug - they can't just say no. It's also a vicious cycle: we need to educate people about computers and deprive virus makers of the salivating audience.

Dimandja

 

[SemperFiDownUnda]

Because this young adult didn't understand that principle, he felt there was nothing wrong with infecting other people's property with a virus.

I personally don't believe in most cases that even the script kiddies think like this. I remember when I was young, I knew that stealing candy from the shop was wrong. My son has a large bowl in his room where I put loose change and I tell him at different times to take out money from the bowl for doing different things. He's never been told that he isn't allowed to take money from it but he doesn't. He always comes and asks me if he can have a chuppa-chup (like a lolly pop) from the center piece on the coffee table.

How many believe he really did this to help mom and dad, or was that just a quick thinking plea for leniency.

Exactly. Kids aren't stupid. Especially individuals that write these viruses/worms. They are used to problem solving. Working out what needs to be done. They think ahead. These authors don't just stumble into writing a virus code. I wouldn't say they couldn't come up with an excuse why they did it if they got caught.



Hope I've been helpful,
Wayne Francis

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[AnanthaP]

How did he think he could help his mother's business by releasing a virus? Maybe now his mother will put up a poster saying "Sasser was created here".

Dunno. I think it was only an excuse which has been sensationalised by the media and the case sanitised by non-specific laws.

The whole question of when a person is responsible for how he uses computers should be re-examined.

At that age if you aren't selling flowers in Istandbul, you have the liberty to choose the sites you visit and how you use them.

We should be concentrating on profiling the sites and groups where these tools are made able to the script kiddies.

End

 

[monkeylizard]

I'm not real up to speed on virus/worm writing, so here's a question...

If this author is a "script kiddie" (and I don't think he is), how does he get a script/module so quickly after the exploited flaw goes public? I mean, can he get the script that fast or would he have had to write the whole thing himself from scratch?

Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[Dimandja]

can he get the script that fast or would he have had to write the whole thing himself from scratch?

Actually there is a whole cottage industry of sorts that disseminates information, code and strategies on virus/worm writing. The techniques involved are pretty basic and sometimes painfully simple - especially when you have access to a skeleton module.

So, basically, the kid only needed access to a PC and a modem, the rest is widely available on Internet.

Dimandja

 

[avjoshi]

May be, these websites should be target and held accountable for the damages these kids do. I don't know if it will be viewed as holding the gun manufacturers accountable for illegal use of guns. I haven't been to those web sites but I feel what they do it pretty much illegal. Besides, it would be easier to target a few websites than individual user.

Anand

 

[EBGreen]

Who will target them? The US Government? If they are in the US, discussing virus writing techniques would be protected under the First Ammendment.

[blue]"Well, once again my friend, we find that science is a two headed beast. One head is nice, it gives us aspirin and other modern conveniences,...but the other head of science is BAD! Oh, beware the other head of science, Arthur; it bites!!" - The Tick[/blue]

 

[gurner]

I agree with Dimandja answering monkeylizards question, the flaw gets noticed by either the manufacturers who issue a patch and then it is probably backwards engineered or someone spots it and its flaw is circulated within minutes accross various forums.

The script kiddies and hackers e.t.c. are exploiting the fact that the vast majority of home users and a frightening number of corporates as well are woefully bad at patching their OS or updating thier virus checker when a patch/update is realeased.

The scripting/modules required are scarily simple as well, a quick bit of searching the thousands of Freeware Scripting sites and a smidgen of common sense (regarding script modification) being able to combine them e.t.c. and you have a functioning 'Virus'

Gurner

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[lionelhill]

... if people want to play Robin Hood and gun for the big corporations while proving how good they are at programming, why can't they go and try to write a chess program that gives Deep Blue a run for its money, or something like that? Yes, it's horrendously difficult (yup, being the best in the world just aint easy). But it's a lot less destructive and a lot more fun. And if you succeed, it's just as media-worthy.

 

[Dimandja]

Naah...

Much easier to copy and paste a virus program, insert your own name or some nonsense stuff in it, and email it to someone.

The media coverage is guaranteed, and is usually much bigger than writing a mundane chess program. The media will go with the story on the front page of every major newspaper in the world.

This is why I wrote before that the problem is just as much - if not more - the audience, the media... If there is no mass histeria promoted through the media, the allure of making viruses will wane.

Dimandja