Suggestions on types of backup 2

[Xaqte]

I currently have one W2000 application server and am currently doing a poor method of backup. The only method of backup that I'm using is copying the application folder over the LAN onto another pc. I want a method of backup for the entire OS and all files/applications that reside inside. The only problem is my boss... He has limited me on ideas for this. He wants no internal, just external. He doesn't want RAID or tape backup. He is also not interested in copying an image off the server's HD onto another. I'm totally in the dark here... any suggestions would be helpful.
Thanks,
X

p.s. - Server specs: P4 1.8Ghz, 512 pc2100, 80gig HD

 

[SteveTheGeek]

It sounds like your boss is more in the dark than you are. No RAID/tape for cost reasons, I assume? In that case, I'd suggest using Win2k's native backup application (Start-Programs-Accessories-SystemTools-Backup) to do a full backup to the other PC.

How much would it cost to replace the data you're backing up to the other PC, if the building were to burn down?
-Steve

 

[gwichman]

first off, if this is a server of any significance that would disrupt daily operations there, you really should RAID the disks on it as a minimum. If losing a disk or corruption occurs to the point of bringing down the server (virus, user error, or plain old failure), I hope your boss is willing to accept the implications. How long will it take to replace a power supply? do you even know? How about something more serious like a motherboard? drive? How long before that box is back up and running or a replacement purchased? Is that downtime acceptable? Imagine having to buy a replacement box, install the OS and applications, configure the server back to original specs, and still you have completely lost whatever data was on there. How long would that take? How would that disrupt operations? What costs are associated with that? Sounds like you guys are willing to accept that type of downtime.

RAID is cheap and protects you from the loss of a disk and the implications losing one would have. Mirroring your disks is cheap insurance for any production server, but certainly IS NOT A PROPER BACKUP. A cheap hardware raid controller and 2nd drive is rarely so expensive as to be prohibitive. A variety of common occurances can occur that RAID will not protect you from though (as mentioned above). Again this includes data corruption due to hardware/software failure or viruses, data corruption or deletion due to user error, a simply power failure (your box UPS'd properly?), or outright hardware failure (raid controller dies and corrupts your data in the process).

Your boss has effectively castrated you for offering a proper backup solution. No tapes? Would he be more comfortablle if you purchased a disk based backup solution applicance? they are essentially a computer with RAIDed drives that you can backup to daily and include software. Still not much different then the above suggestion and certainly more expensive..

MOST people if their data is important to them will at least attach an external or internal cheap tape drive and back their data up that way.. anyways good luck. Sounds like what you really need to do is sell a proper backup solution to your boss. explain to him the implications of what his decisions would have. perhaps there aren't any.

 

[digitalmaster]

All the answers are right...however as a cheaper method carry on backing up your data to another system (assuming files are closed) and use a removable HDD carrier to get the disk off site (which is the important part).

Hard disks are cheap and pretty robust...the Kingston removable bays can be purchased with a Peli carry case.

Whilst it would be nice to backup the whole server, it probably would not be the end of the world if you had to reload W2K server and your applications?

 

[oppie007]

Here is what I would do. Assuming that the machine to be backed
up can be taken offline. (Backup should take less than an hour).

1) Buy Norton System Works Pro 2003 for about $18 (check
Pricewatch). Be sure to get a 1 year license and not the
90 day version. Get the Pro version for the Ghost software.

2) Buy an external USB 2.0 to IDE drive housing for about $50.
If you prefer, get a Firewire version.

3) Salvage an old hard disk from an unused machine or
buy a new one for $70. You can also buy a 60 gig drive
already mounted in a USB box for about $120.

4) If your machine does not already have USB 2.0 ports, then
add it via a PCI card. USB 1.1 works but is way too slow
at 17 minutes/gig.

Ghost 2003 can write to USB 1.1 and 2.0 external drives.
However, it can have trouble if there is more than one USB
in the same computer. Thus, adding a USB 2.0 card to a
machine that has USB 1.1 might not work unless you can
disable the USB 1.1. Using Firewire might get around this.

5) Carefully read about using Ghost here:

http://ghost.radified.com/

You will make an image file - compression will make the
final image size about half the size of your source
machine's used disk space. Your milage may vary.
Use these switches:
-z means use low compression (or use more compression)
-fdsp preserve signature (so on a restore, the operating
system does not think it a new drive.)
-SPLIT=2000 max size file before starting a new file
-auto automatically name each new file

Experiment with the -clone switch to make the process more
automatic.

A few years ago, Ghost had a lot of limitations when backing
up NTFS drives, but almost all of those restrictions are
gone now. If you read that something does not work with NTFS,
try it anyway. It will probably work just fine.

6) For redundancy, take the USB external disk to another PC and
copy the image file(s) off. One such copy should be off site.

7) If it works for you, put GOBACK on the machine (part of
Norton System Works). Some people have had trouble with
Goback, but it works great for me. Make sure you are
running the latest version as there have been important
bug fixes. It will allow you to roll the whole machine back
to a known working version in minutes. Upgrade to the
Pro version and you can also restore individual files.

8) Also get Fileback

http://www.fileback-pc.com/

or
Second Copy

http://www.centered.com/

These will make multi-generational copies of
your most important files. About $30.
Set them up to backup all files since the date of
your last Ghost backup.

The USB/Ghost solution is portable and can be used to make an
image of any machine in your home or office. Ghost runs from
a floppy.

Both Ghost and Goback have versions that are meant for
businesses which do a lot of this sort of thing.

Be forewarned, I have not used Ghost with an external USB hard
drive. However, I have ordered all this stuff and will be trying
it sometime in the next few weeks.

I have used Ghost to backup to a hard drive that was mounted
in a removable tray (Mobile Rack Tray & Frame cost about $17).
Works great.

You can combine external USB and Mobile trays. Making it a
snap to use multiple drives for cycling off site storage and
for save sets that go over one disk full. NewEgg has them for
about $77+$11 per tray (search for Kingwin and Vipower). Another
possibility is to get an external DVD writer (USB or Firewire).
Ghost supports these too. Check the Symantec/Norton site for
compatible devices. You might also want to check out the
Maxtor Personal Storage 5000LE. It has a one button push
backup to an external USB drive all in one package.

http://storage.ziffdavis.com/article2/0,3973,799121,00.asp

This can all be done for under $200.

- Rob

 

[Xaqte]

Just to respond back on what my solution was...
We purchased Casper XP

http://www.fssdev.com/products/casperxp/

Very reasonable price for a quick disk copy to another drive. This wasn't a bad choice was it?
X

 

[Rols]

Why does everyone want a perfect solution for free????

 

[jutetrea]

Hey Oppie,
I haven't used Ghost since around '99 or '00, so I'm figuring its made some changes.

Can any of your above procedure be scheduled or does the server have to be taken fully offlie manually?

Has ghost improved to the point where its good for making general machine images again? We used to use it for making a CD image of dell machines, but after about 8 months we decided not to update the image (new machines that were coming out had too many differences)

thanks,
JT

 

[Xaqte]

Casper XP can be scheduled, check my link above

 

[mike34]

There is actually a product out there that I prefer to Ghost-namely Acronis True Image. It can be downloaded for $50 at acronis.com.