Read only access for POS Integration (Aloha, Micros, Symphony, POSitouch)

[ScottN79]

Hi everyone! I'm a new user here that found quite a few good posts about POS data access in this forum and it seems pretty active too, so here I am posting!

I'm creating a custom rewards type product for hospitality environments that will need near real-time data updates (30 seconds to 1 minute intervals) based on ticket changes made and then data transferred to my server.

I've found a company called Omnivore that integrates with these POS systems, although requires additional license fees (Aloha Connect, Transaction Services Licensed) for each location depending on the POS system, which will turn potential sales of my product away quickly. Plus Omnivore's feature set is much more than I actually need for my product because I will only need read-only access to old and real-time ticket information.

Aloha:
I've read on here that real-time data is very difficult because it doesn't do a DBF dump until end of day? Are there ways to access the data before end-of-day via ODBC connection?

Micros:
Seems pretty easy to access data with ODBC connection, so I'm not too worried about this other than the database user/password being different from custom,custom. I'm sure contacting the vendor this could be easily obtained for our needs

Symphony:
I've read that version 1 didn't have any way to extract data, but version 2 does via XML services of some sorts. Any more information on this?

POSitouch:
I don't know much about this POS but seems they use an SQL database as well and may be just as easy as Micros.

Cloud based POS systems: I'd like to discuss integration with some popular cloud based POS integrations (Harbor Touch, etc) to receive web hooks of ticket information to my server, but I have no contacts into these companies and my emails and calls are never returned...

Thanks everyone and I'm excited to have a good conversation on the new POS sytems and older ones to make read-only access possible for us!

-Scott

 

[PosGuyUS]

POSitouch is probably the easiest one here. Data can be read in a number of ways, DBF/Excel, XML, through a direct interface using the credit/gift channels and probably a few others. Some methods do require licensing but most don't. The easiest is probably XML. You would need to sign an NDA with them but then they will help you get started at no charge.
Harbor Touch is not cloud based as far as I know, I think it is a stripped down version of Dinerware. Aloha probably won't be very helpful, they don't seem to care to integrate unless you have 200 sites looking for it. Micros might be the same these days.
I would suggest you contact the developers directly. Do you already have customers?

 

[ScottN79]

Thanks for replying PosGuyUS!

I have currently developed a POS agent for the POS platform named Restaurant Manager. I have a lab setup for Micros RES 5 and have peeked into the database via DBF viewer, but no further. Do you know of any documents that outline the database schema and relationships?

I have 2 clients (1 of them a restaurant group that could bring 5 more locations for us) that would love to use my integration but they are using Aloha... go figure that they're the hardest to integrate with. I could integrate with Aloha but not real-time integration by reading in EOD flat files... wish there was some way to get current ticket information from them.

POSitouch is not a platform that I've seen anywhere, but it's good to know that it would be easy to integrate with it.

I know nothing much about Harbor Touch other than one of my clients uses it and it looks like iPad terminals and no BOH server, so I assumed most of the data storage is cloud based? I know they do 3rd party stuff but again my emails are not returned.

 

[TobeThor]

Sorry I am not a programmer or an expert in database files BUT many of the POS systems our clients use offer the ability to get detailed guest check information via a serial port on the POS or back office computer, that data is commonly exported as the transaction is rung up (is that real-time?) and used for data integration into surveillance systems so that the camera system can show the menu items purchased on the camera systems main console screen.... so rather than query a database, could you just take the same data the camera systems import to get what you need? If you can you don't need anybodys permission to collect data sent via a serial port.

 

[TobeThor]

IMHO: As for integration with NCR and Oracle, I'd advise you to put your time, effort and money into the smaller POS companies and build a customer base. I don't think either of them will give you the time of day because both prefer to offer (and/or limit) applications that are under their umbrella (they own it) and they have a clear way to charge recurring fees for it.

 

[PosGuyUS]

I think the problem with doing serial data would be you need cables or software on each terminal to collect the data. You have more of a chance to miss something due to a break in the cable or software on one terminal not running. Most modern POS systems can do some kind of real time polling. You might run a program every few minutes or run on demand.
The new guys out there will tell you that their systems are modern and the others are legacy but that's really just BS, most of them do nothing new in fact, many don't have what the experienced systems have. I don't think Harbortouch is using IPads, it's probably a Windows 8 tablet style terminal.

I would suggest you try and use live XML data output, I think most of the POS systems can do that. Then you just have to adjust your software for each others' specs. Before you waste your time integrating to a POS, I would ask the software company how many installs they have out there and base your time spent on who has more. Some of these guys have less than 1000 installs done. Mind you many exaggerate the truth a lot.

 

[MenulinkMan]

Aloha does generate polling files every so often - I think my sites grind every 30 minutes. But to view and edit real time data, you would have to pay a fee to NCR, get all the integration done, and any site that wants to use it requires Aloha Connect.

If you are curious and you can get ahold of an Aloha system, the grind program is located in the %iberdir%/bin/ folder, and the grind files are in the %iberdir%/data/ folder. Look for GND*.dbf files. You can call grind manually, but it takes a few seconds to generate data, and won't exactly show you what is on a check real time ( that i've seen, I haven't looked for it though ).

 

[ScottN79]

many of the POS systems our clients use offer the ability to get detailed guest check information via a serial port on the POS or back office computer

This is an interesting way to look at it. But like what PosGuyUS said, you would need an additional system to read the data from the cables, or if there is some virtual COM driver that will create a COM port for the POS to write to and another COM port for my software to read from, it might be simpler. But if that software needs to run on all of the terminals and not just the BOH, it could be a nightmare scenario to make sure all data is captured.

I would suggest you try and use live XML data output, I think most of the POS systems can do that.

This would be ideal over a database query, but I wouldn't know where to start to get that enabled and what POS systems do this.

I don't think Harbortouch is using IPads, it's probably a Windows 8 tablet style terminal.

This may very well be the case. I'd love to learn more about this POS system because one of my clients uses it and I'd like to get integration for them and also for supporting that POS in the future.

Aloha does generate polling files every so often - I think my sites grind every 30 minutes.

This option looks promising. Can this Grind interval be changed to say 1 minute or max 5 minutes? That would be sufficient in our case for integration. Our award system will allow guests to use their earned points almost immediately on-location, so having an "almost" immediate way to access ticket data is very important. I do have access to an Aloha system and I can inspect it at will and try some things. If you have any more information regarding this Grind operation, please share any docs/links so I can read up on it more.

 

[MenulinkMan]

NCR doesn't recommend running grind any more than every 30 according to a former reseller.

Running grind will just run a grind
Running grind.exe /date 20151019 will run a grind for yesterday (YYYYMMDD)

If you run a grind for a previous day, you will find the gnd files in the dated sub - %iberdir%/YYYYMMDD/

 

[ScottN79]

Thanks for the info on grind.

Do you know of any risks involved with processing grind on an faster interval?

How long does a typical "grind" take to complete?

Thanks for your help!

 

[MenulinkMan]

I've seen grind take between a few seconds up to 20 seconds or so to run - mainly all depends on how busy the site is. Grind will update log files as it runs, so you can end up with some increasingly larger log files. I have never tried it lower than 30 minutes per.

If you do have a test system that is not a live site, ring in some sales, then trigger grind. Open %iberdir%/data and %iberdir%/tmp and check the files that got edited to see what you have to read. You can safely ignore trying to view the trans.log as it is encrypted and you won't be able to view it. If you accidentally lock the trans.log or delete it, you can/will crash the POS.

 

[ScottN79]

You can safely ignore trying to view the trans.log as it is encrypted and you won't be able to view it. If you accidentally lock the trans.log or delete it, you can/will crash the POS.

I only have access to a site that is live.. I will not be touching this file at all as I've already read that it's encrypted and something you don't want to touch.

Grind will update log files as it runs, so you can end up with some increasingly larger log files.

Are you speaking of the trans.log or some other log files? Does Aloha do any auto purging of older log files to avoid running out of disk space? I would hope so..

 

[MenulinkMan]

I"m running Aloha 12.3.30 and just kicked off %iberdir%/bin/grind.exe
Files that had their time stamp changed:
DEBOUT.g01 in the tmp folder.
All the GND files, Adjtime.dbf, EODGRIND, teamserv.dbf, and wageedit.dbf in the /data/ folder.

I've had a crash when there were so many dated subs, the HD was filled up in the middle of the day due to GND files and debout's. Aloha does remove logs every so often.

 

[MenulinkMan]

I was mistaken - Its recommended to not run grind more than every 15 minutes - not 30. I have my system set for every 15.

 

[ScottN79]

Its recommended to not run grind more than every 15 minutes - not 30

That is much better.

I went to the live site yesterday and ran grind. It ran in about 5 seconds and I saw the files it updated.

I took a copy of their backups to look into the DBF files more. Do you know of any documents out there that explain the schema relationships and definitions?

Thanks again