Reaction to PMI Cert Test 3

[elizabeth]

I just took my exam yesterday and would like to hear people's reactions to the test experience.

I was surprised how unpleasant the test was, even though I was warned. I was prepared for lengthy questions with lots of irrelevant material, and I was somewhat prepared for them putting many of the time-consuming questions up front, which gives you an unrealistic idea of how you're doing on the clock.

But I guess I didn't know how to prepare for unclear Q&A's which others also mentioned. It doesn't seem like more studying would have helped, as I was getting about 100% on the practice exams. My Cert score was more like 80%, and I couldn't even tell how I was doing. Some stuff was easy, but some Q&A's just seemed so poorly written. It was like being tested on how well I could get inside somebody's head, instead of my knowledge, judgement, or experience. I actually got so burnt on the psychological thing that I after I ran through the test once, I exited, rather than reviewing until my full 4 hours were up. My eyes and my brain were cooked. I think it would have been better if I'd taken a nice long break after each hour instead.

But, I AM happy it's over! I was getting tired of lugging that study material around!

 

[pivan]

Congratulations elizabeth !!!

'Couple of questions.

First. Since I have scheduled my exam for Sept. 10..(Yikes!! Next Monday) I am curious to know how you used the information from RMC class that you took? I am basing my studying on their recommendations and using their text as a primary study resource. The PMBOK is way to light and doesnt really go into detail.

Second, other then hourly breaks, what would you do different in preparing for the exam?

Anyway, you are through it all and a certified PMP.

Thanks,
pivan

In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?

Just do it!!

 

[elizabeth]

Pivan, best of luck! Let us know how it goes! Most of what was in RM's class was taken from the book, although she certainly did stress certain items, having us jot notes, highlight, and use memory aids to reinforce certain concepts. She also returned repeatedly to (see front of book) "PMIisms", PMI's way of looking at things. This is exactly what I needed to understand the questions that I DID get, and what I usually felt was missing on the ones I didn't get. I read the book through twice, took the tests, did the exercises and played the games. I am not good with memorizing so I spent an disproportionate amount of time on certain items to be sure I had them cold, like earned value, quality, network diagrams/critical path, and project selection methods (BCR, IRR, present value, etc.). I think the 2 questions that required copying a network diagram and calculating the critical path, then recalculating them all if a couple of tasks changed, took the longest to actually get through, but at least they were straight forward.

If I had to choose one Q&A that would have helped me answer the ones I had most trouble with, I'd phrase it like this:
Q: What is the preferred order of alternatives/actions when there is a change is scope, budget, or schedule?
A: Assess impact, meet with team, assess alternatives, crash or fast track, negotiate for corresponding changes to resources, time, money or scope, go to management, go to customer, overtime, say "No."

There might have been add'l choices on the test. I used this as my preferred order, but I don't feel confident it's correct. A big element is that the nature of the problem can rule out certain alternatives, such as fast tracking not being an appropriate response to a budget cut. And, is negotiation a possibility when the constraints are in the contract? It is certainly possible in the real world, but I don't know if PMI has a stance on this. If you can confidently figure out this Q&A (and it's permutations) in your study material, you won't have nearly the trouble that I had.

Thanks for the feedback, it's SO good to remember it was easily worth it to become
"elizabeth, pmp", a.k.a., grand poohbah of pm!

 

[LeoAssetMan]

I took my PMP exam in the beginning of June. I agree it was a nightmare. The exam had nothing to do with the experience or knowledge. It's a pure quality to provide the expected answer. In my life I went through multiple project management trainings, developed custom methodology based on Waterfall approach, provided project management training to personnel, went through PMI-MN chapter 2 months PMP preparation classes, and studied really hard for 3 months.

After all this stuff even if I passed the exam it still was a nightmare. However I can give you some general recommendations.

I didn't attend RMC classes, however I used RMC book. Book is excellent. Alert !!!!! Even if the book is very good it is TOO EASY !

Also I used book from ESI. It is also very good but much more harder than RMC.

So here my 2 cents. If you can digest those 2 books and can demostrate 85% right answers non-stop (exam simulation) then you have a big chance to pass the exam.

Good Luck !

 

[pivan]

HI...well... I passed the PMP exam today.
Socred a 155 or about 75 % and was finished in a little under 3 hours.

The RMC Exam Prep was invaluable as was a decade or two of experience.

The exam venue was pleasent, being an old target shooter I took comfort in the earplugs provided. Meditated in the morning. Took a break midway.

On the sample exam I scored an 89% two days before taking the exam. So I agree with Leo "If you can digest those 2 books and can demostrate 85% right answers non-stop (exam simulation) then you have a big chance to pass the exam.

At completion I really thought I had not done that well as a lot of the questions I didn't recognize from the RMC book or PMBOK...just used common sense to answer. Wish I would have known earned value a lot better.

But hey...I passed....think a might teach a course in project management as it pertains to software develpoment at one of the local schools here.

Thanks and Regards,
pivan mba, pmp In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?

Just do it!!

 

[elizabeth]

Congrats, Pivan, PMP! I uploaded a file to the PMP cert group at yahoogroups that helped me get the Earned Value stuff cold, in case you want to check it out for the class you teach. It's mostly from RM but I organized it in a way I found easier to work with. Memorization isn't my strong point, so I tried to show the logical relationships between the measures, to reduce the amount I had to rely on memorization.

 

[jbaugh]

pivan,

I was wondering if you could take a break during the exam. ¿Did you have to prearrange this with the proctor or just get up and stretch, get coffee, unload coffee, etc.?

Scheduled for the RMC Exam Prep class in Phoenix in November and plan to take the exam the following week at a Prometric site here in Tucson. I couldn't swing an earlier class due to other commitments, so that timeframe will have to do. My qualification for the exam is good until Dec. 31, so timeliness is not an issue.

Have been hitting the PMBOK on a regular basis, as well as studying the prep materials from RM. With that, the PMI classes, the RMC prep class and my PM background, I am hoping for the best. As a veteran of the IT cert process, while all cert tests really are P/F, I don't believe in minimalism and certainly want to excel on the PMP exam.

I also teach for a local community college, have developed a Digital Communication course for them, and am considering trying to start a PM course after I earn my PMP. Let me know how that process works for you. I received eval copies of a couple of PM books, one on theory (lecture) and one on MS Project (lab) from Course Technology. If this is something you would like to review, let me know [1.520.586.5111] and I will have my CT rep contact you.

Thanks,

Joe

 

[elizabeth]

It may be different at each site, but I was able to sign out and back in at any time. In fact I was dismayed to realize I was not in a restricted area during the breaks and could easily have gone to my car and reviewed my notes!

 

[pivan]

Hi Joe:
This was my first time taking an exam at a test center, i.e. outside of a school room or hall. And my first computer test.

Yes, you can take breaks during the exam, the 4 hour counter keeps ticking. I checked with the proctor prior to the test to make sure I understood the rules of engagement correctly. When you take a break, you have to sign out, and then back in.

Follow the PMI letter verbatum as to what ID to bring and the do's and don'ts etc. You have 15 minutes to take a self tutuorial on how to use the computer exam. I took the time to walk throughout. It relaxed me, and I got centered on the environment. I did use the ear plugs, I was amazed at the ambient noise, there were about 20 other people taking various exams in the same room.

I followed the RMC study suggestions, pretty much to the letter, I used the Exam Prep book for studying. In the context of this exam the PMBOK is pretty much worthless.. IMHO. I got an 89% on my second pass of the RMC sample test and figured I was good to go.

I'll be in touch with you on the course books. I am putting together a curriculum to submit to Dean at the end of month.

thanks and G'Luck,
pivan If not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?

Just do it!!

 

[Gegg]

What is the RMC? I have been successful in PM for 10 years. But I found out during Lotus/Domino certification that it doesn't matter what you know it only matters what the book tells you you know. Very Domino sales centered.
I was going to buy PMI study material, but should I take a class?

Please help...what about a MPM is who has taken that?

Rich
info@i3consulting.com

http://www.i3consulting.com

MOTTO: Satisfy all clients, make money, have fun!

Profile: Fast growing Legacy DOS AREV HRIS firm. Expanding to the web and beyond.

 

[elizabeth]

Rich, RMC is Rita Mulcahy, a PMP (PMI certified Proj. Mgmt. Professional) and trainer who has a popular PMP prep class that is based on her PMP prep book. I thought the class was good and most if not all info in the class is in her book. Maybe you have a typo here - can't understand your question "what about a MPM is who has taken that?"

 

[Gegg]

MPM is a Masters in Project Management. Offered by Universities. Where is Rita located? Also, was the exam mostly questions based on the PMBOK or real-life what works.
...
I was reading in PMP Certification prep book by Michael Newell that exceeding stakeholder expectations is worse than meeting them...this is not true in industry.

What would you recommend I do? I think I am effective because I am easily liked, work hard & smart, organized and can talk people into most anything, not because I know all that much about project management or pert/gant charts

Thanks for the help.

Rich
info@i3consulting.com

http://www.i3consulting.com

MOTTO: Satisfy all clients, make money, have fun!

Profile: Fast growing Legacy DOS AREV HRIS firm. Expanding to the web and beyond.

 

[elizabeth]

Rich,

There are many answers to your questions in the other threads in this forum, why don't you browse them and see... And if you have questions unrelated to the already-posted threads please start a new thread, it helps everyone.

RMC=rmcproject.com

As to your question about being a good PM already, so why bother to increase your PM skills... In general, the same reason any other good professional benefits from professional education in their field. For a specific example, if you have the people skills to talk a programmer into working overtime to deliver on schedule, the world is worse off than if you pre-identified the critical path and that person got to have dinner with her husband and kids.

Besides, the PM stuff isn't hard to learn, it's useful, and it helps the profession to create a standard, even if it's a little primitive in the first few iterations.

 

[pivan]

Greg

"" was reading in PMP Certification prep book by Michael Newell that exceeding stakeholder expectations is worse than meeting them...this is not true in industry.""

You might want to explore this a little further to understand the full implication of Newell's (albeit a bit melodramatic) statement.

If you still need more elucidation you might want to start a thread on it. It would be and interesting one.

Regards,
pivan If not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?

Just do it!!

 

[Gegg]

"the world is worse off than if you pre-identified the critical path and that person got to have dinner with her husband and kids" you are right! Planning and identifying risks, critical path and accurate time estimates are the key.

I meant, that I can convince/prove to most stakeholders/project staff of the win-win path I have chosen and execute it.

I guess my concern is that I am functional and without PMP certification. I just get the job done. There are many who have such certification and can't plan a project to get out of a cardboard box.

I was Lotus/Domino ceritified long before I could actually use Lotus/Domino in a valuable fashion.

Thanks again...are you the patron saint of PM?

Rich
info@i3consulting.com

http://www.i3consulting.com

MOTTO: Satisfy all clients, make money, have fun!

Profile: Fast growing Legacy DOS AREV HRIS firm. Expanding to the web and beyond.

 

[elizabeth]

I agree completely about good PMs without cert, and bad PMs with it. You can see that posted anywhere about any cert and it's been true about all formal credentials throughout history. Still, would you choose a dentist who seems good, but didn't have a formal education, if you could get one that seemed good, and did? It's easier on everyone if we create standards. Having a common professional body, terminology and standard practices helps bad and good PMs get better. On top of that, as a bad PM can make life hell for their project team, it helps even more people.

I evangelize for the PM profession because it is in its infancy as far as growth. We need to help each other get PM recognized as a profession rather than a task, and "save the world" from some of the fallout of bad PMs, and bad projects. I encourage you to look into PMI and to spread the word if you agree. Let's go beyond what works for us to what works for everyone.

 

[Gegg]

I agree...

I think I will study the materials...
"Preparing for the Project Management Professional (PMP) Certification Exam" by Michael W Newell, PMP, ENP and hope that it combined with experience will help me pass. If not I will than take a class.

what do you think? What else would be key?

Rich

Thanks....

Rich
info@i3consulting.com

http://www.i3consulting.com

MOTTO: Satisfy all clients, make money, have fun!

Profile: Fast growing Legacy DOS AREV HRIS firm. Expanding to the web and beyond.

 

[elizabeth]

Never heard of it. In this forum there are other threads with book recommendations. Also there is a yahoo group for PM with recommendations. Or please post a new thread in this forum if you'd like to start a new topic. This thread is about reactions to the exam, not advice for the exam. Staying on topic helps everyone USE the existing threads to avoid asking questions other people have already taken time to respond to. Hey, you've got me evangelizing again. Guess you're just one of those people who likes to do things your own way! X-)

 

[e1]

Hi, I have been a once a month lurker here since July. Glad to know that there is a really active PM group here.

Let me share my PMP experience.

I have general management dan IT experience of more than 2 decades. Never been a full time professional PM.

To study for PMI exam my approach was:
1) setup a study group. From 1 person, the group now has more than 105 members. I learnt a lot from others in this group. It is a global group with people from Africa, Asia, Europe and of course the majority is from North America

2)collect as many reading materials as I can: in the end I have 12 kilograms of materials (almost 30 pounds): the most useful are: ESI notes and sample exams, my company's internal PM notes for PMs, textbook on PM (Mantell) and ESI on-line course.

3) I do not attend any PM prep class at all.

4) based on recommendations by other PMCert members, I get a hold of Rita's book 3 days before the exam. frankly I found it too simplistic. It has some errors in definition (e.g critical path ). The exam sample though are the nearest to PMI's own. I went through Rita's exam and noted my poorest result (in Procurement - only 65%) and the balance I manage to get 90-100% at the first try.

5) I also browsed Newell's book that I bought from Amazon. It did not have a chapter on Intergration Management and did not use it.

6) I only read PMBOK in the beginning and found it too boring and dry. So, in the end I only passt it once in the first 2 months and then 1 week before the exam, when I feel guilty not reading it

It took me 2 months to study during weekends and vacation (1 week). All the advise I received was to know PMBOK cold.. in the end I passed very well (90%) not memorizing any Input/Output at all. I try to study the Methodology and Techniques. That's all. In the end memorizing will kill me, I am adverse to that - so I avoided that. But most PMP definitely have different opinion

so my advise: know yr strength and weakness. Do it in yr own style. Don't become a follower...

 

[Guest_imported]

Hello there, I've just come back from successfully achieving my PMP, and would enjoy seeing some of my experiences possibly assist a future test-taker. The posts in this forum from people like Elizabeth and Pivan were extremely helpful in my studying process, so adding to the growing info. base is the very least I can do in addition to saying THANK YOU!

Before I start, it may help you to know a little bit about the kind of studier/test taker that I am. In that light, if you're anything like me, then this may be good advice; but if you're nothing like me, then my approach and habits might be the worst thing for you, so keep this in mind! About me:
* believe that over-prepardness is the most desired state to be in when it comes to exams. The result of this is that I LOVE it when I find the questions easy, and dislike it when I find the questions challenging (I'm of the view that the challenging part should come in the real world of PM, and not in the testing cubicle).
* have a logical approach to all exams. How this relates to multiple choice is that I feel somewhat euphoric when the 'right' answer is the result of two objective processes: 1) I think that it IS the right answer, and 2)none of the other choices COULD be right. When I am able to, almost simutaneously 'arrive' at the right answer through these 2 processes, I choose an answer. I admire and wholly respect some of my friends who trust their 'gut' more on how they feel or what makes 'sense', but this is my approach and it works for me.
* I am fairly decisive and want to pick the right answer quickly so I can achieve closure and move on to the next answer; I dislike leaving questions unanswered, and would rather answer them and know I will have to review it and possible change it, then leave it blank. It just bothers me. I don't know why. Perhaps I'm a bit mental.

If any of this resonates within your soul, then here are my tips for you!
1. Get RMC's book for the outstanding explainations of PM terms/processes, areas to understand, and the all-important PMIisms. Do the sample exams, but do not rely on them as being an accurate representation of the degree of difficulty of the quality of the questions you'll be asked.
2. Get a hold of J. Leroy Ward's PMP Exam Practice Test and Study Guide. The new one (4th edition) actually has a sample 200 question exam at the back, which is nice, since the real exam will put (for example) an HR type of question next to a Scope type of question (while the RMC exams and even Ward's chapter-by-chapter exams will thrust at you 20-40 questions on the same topic). Being able to jump out of one process and into another is something you'll have to do, so you might as well get used to it!
3. Memorize appendix G of PMBOK. There are benefits to memorization beyond the obvious; once you know all 39 processes (I think its 39...), you'll know the entire frame of the exam. Everything that you'll be asked will, in some fashion, relate back to those processes, even if the question derives from a non-PMBOK source. Just being able to get your head around this will help you get some kind of grasp of what is involved, in what order, and most importantly, what ISN'T involved (for example, it is very nice to know for a FACT that PM Quality Mgt. includes Planning, Assurance and Control, and NOTHING else; so if you have the term 'QUALITY IDENTIFICATION" swimming in your head, you know it is not a wholly separate process, but falls somewhere under the 3 headings).
4. Memorize the RMC chart that takes the major components of a project and puts them in the right PM phase (initiate/plan/execute/control/quality). It it again helpful to know where things fit.
5. Memorize the PMBOK grid that throws all of the PM processes into their correct phases. This will compliment #4 and complete it; RMC's version is (in her own words) for the 'real world', so you'll find terms like 'kick-off meeting' under 'Planning', but you WON'T find the term 'source selection' anywhere; that is where the PMBOK chart comes in, because it tells you it is a part of ''Executing'. You don't know how the exam will ask the question: in a 'real world' way, or in a PMBOK way. So just know them both!
6. Follow RMC's advice when it comes to PMIisms. From what I've understood, PMI is quite comfortable with actively defining what PM is, and to do that it is highlighting some ideals of PM. I do not criticize the PMI for doing this, and I respect their attempt to ensure that, in time, all PMs who go through a PMI certification path (all those 20-somethings who will grow up in a PMI world) really do absorb the value of kickoff meetings, analyzing issues before acting, and using the WBS for everything possible. Caught in the middle of that process, inevitably, are people who have been PMing for a while and really don't see any of this stuff in reality. All PMs that I know realize, with a kind of knowing smile, the HYPER-political context in which we work, and the simple impossibility in many cases of letting a team member handle their own relationship with their functional manager, asking a key stakeholder/sponsor who has zero understanding of the complexities of PM to 'wait a few days while you go and perform some performance evaluations of the desired scope change'.... and so on. So those PMIisms will let you know:
1) there is a movement here to create HIGHER standards than exist right now and
2) the exam in many cases blatently reminds you of this, by asking you questions and asking you to answer as a perfect/ideal PM, and not as the political machine you are often FORCED to be given the volume of needs that affect or INFECT your PM experience!

And I think that should do it! I'm sorry this is so long, but I wanted to be as helpful as possible! Good luck with your studying!

Jay, PMP