Random Outbound Echo

[razillian]

I've read a couple of posts here about phone echo with an IP406 and 4606 phones, but nothing has seemed to help with our problem. So here's a run down...

We have an IP406 running ver. 2.0 (18) with about 40 4606 IP phones on the network. The network switches are all Cisco 3550s (4 of them) tied together with gig ports. Network traffic is not a problem, I have only ever see the network spike at 10mb. The phones all have been upgrade to the latest firmware as well. We have a 24 channel PRI coming in for our lines.

The echoing we are experiencing is only ever on calls out of the office, never phone to phone. It is completely random as to when or on what phone it happens on. For instance I had a normal 8-5 day without any echo on my phone, but at 7 PM when I was the only person here, I got echo on my phone. I have tried all the various compressions to see if it would correct the problem. I editted all the lines on the trunk to drop the db level down to various rates (-1db, -2db, -3db), echo still present. The calls are very clear, it is just OUR voices echo back and it seems like only we hear it.

It also seems like this echo problem started when we had the firmware upgrade from 1.4 (not sure what version we went to at that point, but as I noted above we are now at 2.0 (18) with the same problem).

Any help or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

 

[razillian]

A little update incase this helps or makes any sense to anyone, because it certainly doesn't to me...

I logged the bandwidth usage on the Cisco 3550 that connects to the IP406 today on a timeline. I also had our receptionist record the times calls came in and whether there was echo or not. Now here is the odd thing, it seems that we get echo when there is little bandwidth going across the switch, but no echo when it goes above around 3mps. I would certainly expect the opposite result, so this has me even more baffled.

Once again, any suggestions would be greatly welcomed.

 

[daffymd]

Is there any way you can go back to 1.4 or did you upgrade to resolve another problem / obtain a new feature?

If you could downgrade it would certainly point you towards either the IP Office code or the network switches.

 

[IPOJedi]

You could download to 1.4(27) or hang on for 2.0(20) due any minute due to some iffy programming in 2.0(18)....toy downgrade just place all teh bin file from the 1.4(27) in the manager directory and use the upgrade wizard!

 

[razillian]

I had tried downgrading a few weeks back, but ran into a few problems with the upgrade wizard. Long story short, it was a 4AM kind of night with me winding up loading 2.0(18) back on it out of frustration. I'll give 2.0(20) a try when it is released and if that does not work I'll shoot for downgrading again (this time without the problems).

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

[crashtest1000]

We have two clients with a similar issue.

We have done a lot of investigation into the problem and have not found a solution yet however the problem is with Avaya Tier 4 if that’s any help.

Can you make sure you problem is posted with Avaya so we get some action.

 

[razillian]

Just an update for those experiencing the same problem. We've downgraded to 1.4(27) with the same problem. But looking through previous emails to our vendor we were originally at 1.3. So no clue there.

Avaya has acknowledged an echo cancellation problem with version 2.0 and should be releasing a patch sometime soon. In the mean time we have also discovered that our T1 line coming in is some sort of HDSL line, meaning it is coming in hot (too loud for the Avaya system). The standard db settings for this kind of line should be -3db Tx and -7db Rx on the phone system. One more thing to note is that while you set the Rx levels to -7db to drop it down, the Transmit level is reversed, so it should be set to 3db instead of -3db (gotta wonder why that is).

I hope this might help someone else. I made the db changes today and am waiting to hear if there is any echo from our users.

 

[VanZenden]

razillian,

Can you tell me where can I set db setting?

Tnx

 

[Morrack]

It's in the individual channels on the Line form. You can use shift-click to select them all at once, then right click and hit edit. Save you changing them one at a time.

 

[razillian]

In Manager select "Line" on the left hand side.. Select the line you want to change the db settings for on the right hand side and it should list all the channels once you open that section up. Highlight all the channels (or select individual ones) and right-click to bring up the popup menu. Select "Edit" and you should be there.

FYI, the db changes did not make the echo any better or worse for us. If it wasn't for some of the bad publicity I have heard already I am tempted to pull this system and through in a Cisco solution, but I guess that comes with its own set of problems.

 

[Morrack]

Razillian, are you using headsets with your 4606 phones? There is an issue with echo when using headsets on 4606 phones - you have to use a special cord.

 

[razillian]

We have a headset attached to the receptionists phone, but it is not used. All the rest are standard 4606 phones.

 

[crashtest1000]

Hi Razillian

Have just started tested a new version of 2.0 with increase echo buffer on a 403.

Basically we are trying to compensate for situations where the caller you are talking to has excessive echo outside the specifications of H323.

The good news is the initial testing is all good and we noticed a 80 to 90% improvement in call quality basically a call with echo so bad it was difficult to hear turned into a call will very minimal echo if not 0 echo.

Have you logged the case with Avaya FSG or your Avaya supplier.

Will keep you posted.

 

[Morrack]

What release is that, crashtest?

 

[gbwall63]

crashtest1000,

I'm _very_interested_ in getting more information on the "new version of 2.0 with increase echo buffer on a 403".

I am having the same problem that razillian descbibes on similar hardware. I've tried all of the same things he and others have suggested but I still have a very strong local echo on some calls.

Was the "new version of 2.0" program changes including in the 2.1 GA release in early June?

If not, is there a subsequent GA release that includes a fix for this problem?

Thanks