"Sleepy Sets" & Firmware Questions

[TelNetSystems]

I have been following the posts about the flex boards in MLX sets oxidizing and causing the sleepy sets problem. I have torn apart four "sleepy sets", and I found one obviously oxidized flex board and three flex boards that appear to be replacement boards in good condition. I also have the Merlin Legend R7 V10 ugrade card with instructions that say the following about a firmware upgrade on the card, "008 MLX, Current FW App. Vintage: 3.0, Fixes 'sleepy sets' - LEDs temporarily go off and buttons do not respond on MLX sets., QPPCN Covering Current FV App. Vintage Change: 1090B Sup 2." Yahoo! searches for "QPPCN 1090B" and "QPPCN 1090" return nothing. The Avaya web site lists PCNs only for the Magix system. The Avaya support web site search function also returns no results for 1090B. Are there TWO possible causes of the "sleepy sets" problem, older firmware versions and oxidized flex boards? Where can I find QPPCNs for the Legend system?

I also have two questions about firmware. 1) The firmware version seems to have two components: FW Vintage & App. Vintage, which I think stand for Firmware Vintage and Application Vintage. What is the difference between these two? 2) I read in an earlier post in this forum that Avaya dealers can copy maintenance upgrades onto a PCMCIA card you provide for a minor charge. Does this mean firmware upgrades only, or do version upgrades work this way also? I have a "used backup card" I purhcased that turned out to be a reformatted R7 V10 upgrade card. Could I send it to an Avaya dealer and have the current Legend or Magix firmware and software versions copied onto it?

 

[longnite36]

TelNetSystems,
Did you pull CAT-5 or CAT-3 at the site you installed this system? I am having the same problems with my system. I have replaced everything and yes, I even did the upgrade thing from eBay. I have CAT-5 pulled for my system and I am beginning to suspect it. I am going to do a test on this theory and I will post my findings within the next few days.

John

 

[GroundWire]

Are you having the sleepy sets problem on all of your MLX sets, or just some? Are they 28D's and MLX-10[D]'s ??

If you're having that problem on every single station, I'd say that was suspicious. If you're having that problem on a large number of phones that have been around awhile, I would definately recommend you rip open a MLX-10 and look at the flex board.

The oxidization is amazingly easy to spot, once you've looked at a clean board. It's like looking at a nice shiny ISA or PCI card (the copper card-edge fingers), as opposed to something that has a massive carbon build-up. (Think fireworks and sparklers, and you'd probably have the right concept)

I might have to take some detail pictures on replacing flex boards.

- Joel

 

[drewmich]

David & John,

Here is the info on the firmware upgrades of any Legend or Magix module.

The Legend 008MLX mods or any others that are U models or upgradeable ... after upgrading ... just note the firmware number, then check the firmaware on the non-upgradeable mods to see if they have that upgraded firmware number. Normally the mods with U - upgradeable flash memory chips on their mainboards are the newer release of that model - but it doesn't always hold true.

You can use older release/version flash upgrade cards to upgrade modules - than the R-V that that the processor is running at as the upgrade process doesn't really care what the processor is when you're upgrading just modules. But not all Legend and Magix flash upgrade cards carry the additionaly flash programming for upgrading modules also. I was incorrect in my last post when I stated the the latest magix release R3.07 had the module upgrades on it. Actually it is the magix R3.04A card that has those upgrades which are the very latest available from Avaya. Not all mods are included and you may have to go back to an older Magix or Legend release card to get the upgrade firmware number you need.

Regarding the sleepy sets, it is a combination of the firmware from Legend R6.0 and older programming that needs updated and the flex membranes that are the main problems. Wiring can always be a problem but there shouldn't be any problems created by either Cat 3 or Cat 5 or 5E cable.

The easiest way to test a mod that you think needs its firmware upgraded - that has sleepy port problems etc - always test all the ports on the module to see if the problem is reproduced on all (8) ports for say an 008MLX. If only a few are doing it then it normally is just a flex replacement issue. You also can have port hardware problems iwith mods that sometimes might lead you think it is the set that is the problem, but not often!

There are numerous reasons that the fine silver traces on the flex membranes corrode - high humidity or other airborne corrosive issue in the environment, high heat, fluid spills that generate corrosion etc. Some can be cleaned, but for $15.00 or so, why not just change the flex membrane. All the MLX phones have flex membranes that can go bad, but as a loose rule, the AT&T sets go bad earlier than the Lucent logo sets - just because of their age. We always try to buy just the Lucent Logo sets, and when we buy the AT&T sets - we always replace the flex membranes so we can "sleep better at night." Nothing more frustrating than those customer or dealer calls with defective MLX sets - and it occurs on ALL models. The Partner MLS sets have the same type problems and some older Definity sets too.

Regarding firmware upgrades - the issue is just basic programming changes - bug fixes etc. Kinda like Microsoft or Sun or any software programmer needing to make periodic upgrades to their base software as problems are discovered with unique combinations of setups etc or even just when new features are added. As a rule in our repair lab, we upgrade every mod that comes in for repair or that we buy surplus for resale. It would be like selling a customer a Windows 98 PC without applying the SE - 2nd Edition upgrade or other patches. Just gotta cover the bases.

Andrew Roach
President - Drew Telecom Group, Inc.
Lucent/Avaya Voice Mail-Component-Transtalk Repair Specialists
Lucent/Avaya Telecom Brokers/Resellers
drew@triton.net
269-685-5400 - voice
269-685-5500 - fax

 

[longnite36]

Ok fellows. I Brought up a whole different system on my bench for testing all of the possible causes for sleepy sets.

I pulled ALL of the phones that I had that ever when to "sleep" on my installed system. I plug each one of these phones into the test sytem on the bench, using brand new, factory made, 3'CAT-5 cables.

The sytem has been runing for about 30 days now. I would randomly use the extentions. NONE OF THE PHONES HAVE GONE TO SLEEP!

Now comes the strange part. I went to change one of my analog phones, (the old Merlins), to an MLX 28D on my installed system. I made the proper changes at the KSU. The MLX phone started doing all sorts of things. I tested my wiring with a Ideal Link cable tester. The cable had been chewed on by a rat. The analog phone was working fine at that location, (I re-varified this by putting the analog phone back on that same wiring and it came back up).

I replace the chewed cable with fresh cable. Put all of the MLX sets back at their ententions, as well as adding the MLX where the old analog set had been. Everything is still running fine and I haven't had anymore sleeping problems.

Recommendations to try while attempting to solve this problem:
1) Follow some of the other test that are posted above.

2) It really wouldn't hurt to test ALL of the wiring before taking the phone apart. The phones are quite easy to take apart and clean the flex board, (I used a pencile eraser to remove the flex board).

This is my expierence with this problem. Yours may be different. I hope this at least helps somebody to not have to go through the headaches that I did.

Good Luck,

John