.NET or J2EE 4

[jwdcfdeveloper]

Im at a crossroad in my career. I want to start getting deeper into either .NET or J2EE. I have 5 years of development experience. As my name indicates, most of it is Cold Fusion. I have some academic experience with Java, but I recently took a C# class and enjoyed it. I'm curious about whether I should go deeper down the MS path with .NET or go the J2EE route?

My concern with .NET is will it become so exclusive when Longhorn comes out (I hear you will need a waaayyy more powerful computer to run it than what's currently available) that most business will not be able to afford it. While on the other hand, the Java market is so segmented it seems ridiculous (everyone wants Java, JSP, Servlets, etc, but some want Websphere experience, others Weblogic, others Apache, etc.). I feel I could pickup either technology realatively quickly, but I know that I can't become an expert in everything, so I'm looking for the best thing.


Thanks

 

[onpnt]

jwdcfdeveloper No, I don't believe you are understanding it correctly

A well rounded good programmer in "General" is better then a inexperienced programmer.

Programming isn't syntax or frameworks. those are all just aspects to programming. If someone is experienced and seasoned in programming then they will more then likely be a far better candidate to pick up any language or jump into any system far quicker tehn a inexperienced programmer.

Personally have not cared for the title such as
.NET Programmer
J2EE Programmer
C# Programmer
RPG Programmer
etc......

It's Programmer. I would feel very incomplete if I only knew how to program in java or VB or C# etc...

___________________________________________________________________

_{onpnt.com
SELECT * FROM programmers WHERE clue > 0
(0 row(s) affected) -->faq333-3811}

 

[EBGreen]

I agree. This is what I was trying to express as well.

[red]"... isn't sanity really just a one trick pony anyway?! I mean, all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you are good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit!" - The Tick[/red]

 

[jwdcfdeveloper]

I see onput. That makes sense. However, I am noticing in a lot of the C# jobs here in Chicago, I notice that they tend to want someone who has Java experience too. If not Java than almost always C++.

 

[Stella740pl]

jwdcfdeveloper,

The way I understand that, it goes both ways. A skilled C# programmer could be preferred to a mediocre J2EE in a place doing heavy J2EE development.

The accent here should be on skilled, not on a particular development tool.

As SQLSister said, a person who has mastered the complexity of one or the other is more valuable than someone who only knows the basics in both.

Not that it is so easy to switch to a new language, but it's easier for a person who knows complex issues to learn a new syntax, than to a person who knows some basic syntax to learn the complex concepts.

 

[onpnt]

I'm also in the Chicago area and have noticed a increase in .NET development (as it was more then likely going to)

Java requirements are also increasing greatly. I've seen quite a bit of this due to WebSphere.

As for C# and Java in the same line -- that's just odd. But some camps run more then one technology and the needs are there.

Just don't sell yourself short on thinking there is only one language to learn and or master. You need to master programming before feeling like you're on top of the situation. Maybe going deep into WebSphere or .NET period would be the best course of action for you.



___________________________________________________________________

_{onpnt.com
SELECT * FROM programmers WHERE clue > 0
(0 row(s) affected) -->faq333-3811}

 

[RiverGuy]

One reason they want Java or C++ experience as well is probably because C# has not been around that long.

Programming isn't syntax or frameworks. those are all just aspects to programming

I totally agree. That said, it is hard to guauge one proficiency versus another of a different language. For example X-job may be hard to do in Java, but easy in .Net. Does this mean someone who can do it in Java is more skilled than someone in .Net in proportion? But Y-job may be easy in Java, yet hard in .Net.

But as far as learning the frameworks goes.....frameworks are not equivalent. Knowing how to work with all of the Java libraries doesn't mean one will be able to become a master at .Net over someone who has learned half of the .Net framework.

The bottom line is that no one will master enterprise programming by just learning it and working on their own time. It will take experience and growth in an enterprise, real-world environment. Therefore, LEARNING a little bit of both provides a growth-base for two paths. Which language is mastered will depend on how the career manifests itself.

 

[chiph]

The other reason why they want Java or C++ as a secondary skill is they may be porting existing applications to .NET.

Another theory is that the organization is large enough to support both languages & frameworks, and they want someone they could move to the "other side" easily if need be.

Chip H.


____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[jtb]

onpnt, I do need to disabuse you of one notion... in online apps,

SELECT *

is never acceptable... potentially requires hundreds or thosands of packets that may not be displayed on the screen (in our case, it actually generated enough traffic to slow down some webpages by 25 seconds or more)... always build screenfuls... proper planning, etc...

JTB
Have Certs, Will Travel
"A knight without armour in a [cyber] land."

 

[onpnt]

umm..ok..thanks jtb

I guess I'll have to rethink my attempt at humor in the sig as it is really an inefficient use of humor resources

___________________________________________________________________

_{onpnt.com
SELECT * FROM programmers WHERE clue > 0
(0 row(s) affected) -->faq333-3811}

 

[sedj]

onpnt :

Yes, please do change your signature - I know every time I read it, my brain locks up trying to process thousands of unrequired humour fields.

Perhaps you should try to identify the precise humour field from your humour table - maybe something like
"select Have_I_Any_Humour from programmers where clue > 0".

jtb :

Is "select *" OK in offline apps then ?
And who is "Will Travel" ? Is he a dead cert ?

--------------------------------------------------
Free Database Connection Pooling Software

http://www.primrose.org.uk

 

[chiph]

sedj -
Don't forget that to take into account the differences between US and UK humor (humour!), the "Have_I_Any_Humour" column needs to be a foreign key.

Chip H.
;-)

____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first

 

[sedj]

--------------------------------------------------
Free Database Connection Pooling Software

http://www.primrose.org.uk

 

[Terpsfan]

I looked at a salary survey on Computerjobs.com and this might be interesting reading for just about anyone. According to this, .NET jobs are paying a little lower than J2EE. It's by no means a scientific survey, however I find this to be free from vendor bias. It's not run by Sun or Microsoft.

Microsoft claims that .NET MCSD's average 82k a year but this is hard to validate.

http://www.ticker.computerjobs.com/content/ticker.aspx?type=0&jcid=106

 

[DreXor]

little follow up note so some of the points made in this thread..

knowing something doesn't particularly mean you know how to use it. take a spring fresh college grad chicken, what do they REALLY know about how to use the language they've learned? they know it though.

just like ok it's a screwdriver, most people know hold it and turn it, others know you can pry, chisel, gouge, scrape, engrave, scratch, stab, poke, flip, push, etc etc.

personally i know one programming language, BARELY, i know enough of it to get what needs to be done, done. i've programmed for almost 14 years with this little sespool of knowledge. but the one thing i'm extremely good at is looking for information, i learned a long time ago it's more important to remember why something is done, not particularly how it is done. for that reason, i've had some very well paid jobs (95k/yr programming was one of them).

personally i'd rather have someone self taught that dabbles very well in a language than someone gifted in the skill of correction.

"THIS is the way to do this" only achieved in repeating the same process over and over again, it's us stupid people that go, "hey, lets stick our finger in here instead", that end up taking someone's job and re-writing the manual.

i agree with onpnt, with a little twist. a programmer may not know any language, or coding method. Programming is a state of mind, the ability to take something grand and break it into it's absolute smallest steps, and in the process, being able to denote: someone may try and fall off the edge here, lets put a handrail,sign,fence, or blinking plastic cow with a siren, there.

as for what language to learn, learn what you like, learn what's comfortable, and learn what makes sense to you. yeah, one or the other might pay better, BUT, in the end will the money be worth the headache of having to do something you dislike all the time?

just my $0.02, keep the change.

DreX
aKa - Robert

 

[RiverGuy]

If you are deciding between 2 items on a menu that you have never had before....how do you know which tastes better? You may examine the ingredients and make an educated decision. But it comes down to the fact that you have to try both to make a decision.

Likewise, if the decision is based on which item has fewer carbs/fewer calories, etc., then the choice is easier.

What I am saying is that if your goal is to make the most money you can, or advance to the highest position, then do an educated survey. If it is for enjoyment and happiness, then try both and go with which you like best.

But on another point, each inidvidual employer will have their own levels of compensation/work environment independant of programming language.