Need help on finding the top plate

[raven1]

I've spent the few hours trying to find the location to drill down to install cat5 cable in a office.I drilled once thinking I had the right spot But no such luck.
I go into the office and see a 4 port electricity outlet so I assume I look for 4 220 cables going into the top plate 8 ft from the door frame.Right? Ok so I go up and I see the only 4 cables going down in the general area I want.To make a long story short....I'm friggen lost up there,I drilled the wrong spot. I think that the 4 220s go down to a double light switch .IS it possible to 4 220s for a double light switch?
Are there any tips out there how I might find the location I want?


Thank you
S

 

[smah]

Those could be going to the double light switch - 1 in and 1 out of each switch. The best advice I can give is to use what you have available. Overhead lights are the best because from the living area, you can find the box in the attic in the exact same place. Also, another point to think about - if you're working on an inside wall, there's a room on each side of the wall. Sometimes it might be beneficial to take you reference location from a room you're not planning to work in. Walk the attic, while you vision the space below. Look for clues to find closet locations and things like that. Try not to use an outside wall to find your location - the roof line may mess you up more than you realize.

Multiple electical wires going down, can be used to locate a wall - use a string and a couple of nails to lay out the 'wall' in the attic. Then use electical wires going down into the adjacent wall to find a second wall. Run your string for this wall, now you'll have a corner to get your bearings from.

It's all kind of general, depending on the construction. The basic rule is to use whatever references you have available.

 

[InnoTech]

I reply to the other post you had but here it goes again.

i would use a toner and probe to find you cable or location. the tone shoule go through sheetrock and thin wood if the battery is strong enough. good luck! "Jack of all trades. Master of none."

 

[jeffbouldin]

Are the studs metal or wood?

The best way to learn how to fish walls is to visit construction sites. Study how the walls are put together before the sheetrock is up. Then visualize this when you are in the attic. Newer construction is mostly done the same way, older houses can be more difficult.

In your case, measure the distance from an ajoining wall to your outlet. Go into the attic, move the insulation and find the top plate of a wall(you will see where the sheetrock meets the 2x4), follow it till you have the junction of the wall you need to be in and the ajoining wall, measure the distance and mark it. Keep in mind that the sheetrock is usually 1/2 to 5/8 of an inch thick, however if you are in the same channel of the wall your hole is in you don't have to be exact. If you are positive about the placement of your outlet cut your hole for it first. Drill a 3/4 inch hole in the top plate and you should see light. Cutting the hole first will also let you figure how far you are from any studs, one of the most common mistakes is cutting your outlet and dropping the wire on the wrong side of the stud.

As for the outlet most of the time you will only have one or two wires going down the wall( unless it is coming through the wall from another outlet). Rarely will you have a wire for each outlet in one plate, they are usually fed from the same source.

Spend some time studying new construction, if your company prewires houses or offices get on those crews. It will help you understand what you are doing on retrofits.

Remember measure twice, cut once.

 

[franklin97355]

If all else fails drill a small hole at the junction of the wall and ceiling (1/4" or less.) then push a wire up through the hole and find this in the attic. after you get the wires in place patch the drilled hole.

 

[raven1]

Thanks smah I wil try that.
InterNETtech...I have no cable dropped yet as I want to be sure I have the right location. But thanks for that advice I never thought about that!!

 

[fs483]

If your building is using wood studs, chances are you have cross-studs (braces) around at the middle height between the ceiling and the floor. When I wired my house, I had great difficulty running wires down my walls and unfortunately I don't have an attic and have a finished basement. You can try having someone lightly tap the ceiling of the wall you are planning to put a drop in and try to listen from the attic. It can't be that hard locating the correct wall ! Try from the basement or crawl space. Maybe you can find the electrical wires from there !

bootleg

 

[daronwilson]

Very good suggestions, if you don't see the layour of the wall when you are up in the attic, I second the wire idea. I drill a 1/16" hole and push a piece of solid steel tie wire up the hole. Then I measure from the wire to the wall, climb in the attic and find the wire, measure and drill. It takes a tiny little dab of stuff to patch that little hole, no damage done.

If you are bringing the cable up from below and you can't find it, assuming you have carpeted floor to deal with I just drive a finish nail through the floor. A nail set and a few taps and the nail is set below the carpet and flush with the subfloor. Then I go below and spot it, do the measuring, and drill.

Truely it is a bonus to have grown up in the construction field, it is MUCH easier if you have some vision of how this stuff is built and what the mechanics are.

Good Luck! It is only my opinion, based on my experience and education...I am always willing to learn, educate me!
Daron J. Wilson, RCDD
daron.wilson@lhmorris.com

 

[fs483]

I usually try to put in (wires, pull cords, piping) when I have renovations or have open walls and ceilings. It saved me a lot of work a couple of times. I also try to take pictures, make diagrams when the walls are open...

bootleg

 

[skip555]

if you do a lot of this sort of thing check out this product


WIRE BITS
The wire bit is a .047" spring wire 36" long that can be cut (at an angle) any length to make it the smallest "reference" bit.

Applications: Its primary application is to be used as a reference point to measure from when having to drill in a specific wall cavity (i.e. drilling down through top plate in wall with stapled bat insulation, up from basement in wall with blown-in cellulose or Styrofoam insulation). The hole created is so small that it will remain unnoticeable, even on a ceiling.
For use in drill chucks that "fully close".


from this site

http://www.lsdinc.com/lsdinccgi/sea...txt&template=templatekk.html&output_number=15

 

[raven1]

ok ,I think it is all coming together.I was so focused on using electrical outlets for reference points I got lost.

I know now that there is a vent right above the location I want the cable so theres a hint!Also,the sheetrockwall! duh! I was going to go from another wall but wasn't sure where it started and ended.Well I'm going to assume that the sheetrock will take a turn when the wall ends.Am I right?
I guess it would help if I had a assistant also but hey...this site and all the advice I got from everyone really kicks!!!

Thanks so much!
Sher

 

[raven1]

DOH! I just learned that I will not be able to see the wall from upside because the ceiling are put up first! there by...covering up the sheetrock.

Good news though! Maintenance is going to give me a hand.
Thanks all!

 

[daronwilson]

Hmm, must have been a remodel or something, normally the wall is framed up, ceiling sheet rock is hung, then the wall sheet rock.

It may be confusing in the attic because you will see extra 2x4 nailer boards on the top plate, just scabbed out on the side of it or maybe a 2x6 on the top plate. THis is used to nail the sheetrock up to.

Anyway, good luck!
It is only my opinion, based on my experience and education...I am always willing to learn, educate me!
Daron J. Wilson, RCDD
daron.wilson@lhmorris.com

 

[raven1]

DOH! I just learned that I will not be able to see the wall from upside because the ceiling are put up first! there by...covering up the sheetrock.

Good news though! Maintenance is going to give me a hand.
Thanks all!