iceman2654
Programmer
Do any of you out there think it is possible to make an operating system that can handle BOTH windows linux/unix without problems or emulation. Or just combine them both into one neat package?
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melding OS's
- Thread starter iceman2654
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sleipnir214
Programmer
It's certainly doable. The trick will be abstracting system calls so that a single library provides the interfaces both realms of applications will require.
It's the adjective "neat" that will be interesting.
Want the best answers? Ask the best questions!
TANSTAAFL!!
It's the adjective "neat" that will be interesting.
Want the best answers? Ask the best questions!
TANSTAAFL!!
infinitelo
Programmer
- Mar 7, 2001
- 319
.Net is supposed to allow this. I havent been keeping trak of the Mono project (project to port the .net framwork to lynux) as well as i should but it is interesting. Of course if the heat comes off of M$ from the DOJ longhorn will have an incompatible framework.
if it is to be it's up to me
if it is to be it's up to me
- Thread starter
- #4
iceman2654
Programmer
cool. now i guess the next question is...will microsoft allow that?
thanks for da info slephir and infinitelo
thanks for da info slephir and infinitelo
infinitelo
Programmer
- Mar 7, 2001
- 319
Once executables are cross platform its up to hardware venders weather lynux will make it or not. Once a lynux distro is up and running, there is little difference in novice user experiance in learning to run programs. Hardware, and business packages are the speed bumps for open source developers.
if it is to be it's up to me
if it is to be it's up to me
Microsoft has always intended .NET to be cross platform.
If they don't supply implementations for other platforms besides Windows that's because they don't have the expertise in-house to create those implementations (and possibly because for them the target market is too small to make the investment).
It of course remains to be seen how many OS vendors will implement a .NET layer on their OSs.
I expect Solaris to have one in the not too distant future, and as stated the Mono project (in which I think IBM is big) is working on providing one for Linux (which will probably gal the hardcore Linux people as it's something from the Big Enemy).
It's the same situation as with Java back in the mid-1990s.
The JVM specs were open for everyone to write JVMs for different platforms but it took a while for OS authors to make them available and get them certified.
If they don't supply implementations for other platforms besides Windows that's because they don't have the expertise in-house to create those implementations (and possibly because for them the target market is too small to make the investment).
It of course remains to be seen how many OS vendors will implement a .NET layer on their OSs.
I expect Solaris to have one in the not too distant future, and as stated the Mono project (in which I think IBM is big) is working on providing one for Linux (which will probably gal the hardcore Linux people as it's something from the Big Enemy).
It's the same situation as with Java back in the mid-1990s.
The JVM specs were open for everyone to write JVMs for different platforms but it took a while for OS authors to make them available and get them certified.
- Thread starter
- #7
iceman2654
Programmer
ahh i c....and is the dot net thing coz they're under antitrust fire?
jwenting: except of course for the BSD CLR that was created by MS and anded out all around.
The fact of the matter is that MS has provided the information needed to create more .Net languages and run times for other OS's, but they have no interest in actually creating run times for other languages. The idea being that if a customer decides to use .Net than they can either trust a non-MS implementation on another OS or they can use MS Windows. I don't see anything wrong with this, they provide the info needed to create your own run time for whatever OS you want as well as an example for BSD (FreeBSD I think, but probably portable) but would prefer their customers to use their own OS. Not the first or last company that has done this.
-T
[sub]01000111 01101111 01110100 00100000 01000011 01101111 01100110 01100110 01100101 01100101 00111111[/sub]
The never-completed website:
The fact of the matter is that MS has provided the information needed to create more .Net languages and run times for other OS's, but they have no interest in actually creating run times for other languages. The idea being that if a customer decides to use .Net than they can either trust a non-MS implementation on another OS or they can use MS Windows. I don't see anything wrong with this, they provide the info needed to create your own run time for whatever OS you want as well as an example for BSD (FreeBSD I think, but probably portable) but would prefer their customers to use their own OS. Not the first or last company that has done this.
-T
[sub]01000111 01101111 01110100 00100000 01000011 01101111 01100110 01100110 01100101 01100101 00111111[/sub]
The never-completed website:
dilettante
MIS
I thought the original question was about some future "UniOS." Are we really discussing the hoary old Java chestnut "write once, run anywhere" with a .Net spin on it?
If so, has anybody seen any decent non-trivial applications like this - either JRE or CLR based? They must exist by now, I just don't know of any.
For that matter .Net's coming up on 4 years old now. Anyone seen any .Net desktop applications for sale yet? So far it seems like there's little besides some things in ASP.Net and some developer tools.
If so, has anybody seen any decent non-trivial applications like this - either JRE or CLR based? They must exist by now, I just don't know of any.
For that matter .Net's coming up on 4 years old now. Anyone seen any .Net desktop applications for sale yet? So far it seems like there's little besides some things in ASP.Net and some developer tools.
There's tons of Java applications out there, many of them enterprise level applications.
Of course most people never see those applications because they run on a server or if they do they don't know and care it's Java under the hood.
I'd call Websphere, Weblogic, etc. etc. non-trivial applications...
All current Microsoft applications make use of .NET in some form. They also include native legacy code but I expect that to decrease over time.
.NET is prevalent in most modern applications for CE handhelds too.
Of course most people never see those applications because they run on a server or if they do they don't know and care it's Java under the hood.
I'd call Websphere, Weblogic, etc. etc. non-trivial applications...
All current Microsoft applications make use of .NET in some form. They also include native legacy code but I expect that to decrease over time.
.NET is prevalent in most modern applications for CE handhelds too.
dilettante
MIS
Well that's why I said "desktop."
I agree, Java has seen some fine penetration in corporate servers near the middle and back ends of applications. But both Java and .Net seem to be giving way to native code on the desktop yet for now.
Maybe handheld devices are really the places where these two technologies are common close to the user. Cell phones, PDAs and the like.
As far as I know there is little (or no) .Net in Office 2003. Even VSTO 1.0 which is somewhat parallel to VBA (which is in Office 2003 applications) is an add-on more in the form of a plug-in.
Windows SharePoint Services (and Portal) are probably the first things of any consequence shipped by Microsoft that actually use .Net, but market penetration is miniscule. That has more to do with customers' lack of understanding of SharePoint than anything else though I suspect.
What are some of these other applications from Microsoft written for the .Net Framework?
I agree, Java has seen some fine penetration in corporate servers near the middle and back ends of applications. But both Java and .Net seem to be giving way to native code on the desktop yet for now.
Maybe handheld devices are really the places where these two technologies are common close to the user. Cell phones, PDAs and the like.
As far as I know there is little (or no) .Net in Office 2003. Even VSTO 1.0 which is somewhat parallel to VBA (which is in Office 2003 applications) is an add-on more in the form of a plug-in.
Windows SharePoint Services (and Portal) are probably the first things of any consequence shipped by Microsoft that actually use .Net, but market penetration is miniscule. That has more to do with customers' lack of understanding of SharePoint than anything else though I suspect.
What are some of these other applications from Microsoft written for the .Net Framework?
Stevehewitt
IS-IT--Management
I work for a very large travel company and we use .net a hell of a lot for pur desktops apps. At least 10,000 workstations across the UK alone have out custom .net app.
Just because you don't know it's .net doesn't mean its not.
I'm a bit a a Access developer as well, and can't understand why there is no CLS shared with .net in VBA. I think it's bloody terrible. I've purcahsed VS2003 and i'm desperate to convert my Access App over, but there is no documentation to go from VBA to .net. Yet if I got a copy of VB6 I could covert to VB6, then covert to VB.net.
Madness!
Thanks,
Steve.
Steve.
Just because you don't know it's .net doesn't mean its not.
I'm a bit a a Access developer as well, and can't understand why there is no CLS shared with .net in VBA. I think it's bloody terrible. I've purcahsed VS2003 and i'm desperate to convert my Access App over, but there is no documentation to go from VBA to .net. Yet if I got a copy of VB6 I could covert to VB6, then covert to VB.net.
Madness!
Thanks,
Steve.
Steve.
Biztalk 2003 has a significant amount of .NET in it (it's at least as large as the framework itself!).
But, due to the price & complexity, it's not something every Joe Developer will be using.
Chip H.
____________________________________________________________________
If you want to get the best response to a question, please read FAQ222-2244 first
"Do any of you out there think it is possible to make an operating system that can handle BOTH windows linux/unix without problems or emulation. Or just combine them both into one neat package?"
Howabout using a middleware? Check this out:
Howabout using a middleware? Check this out:
- Thread starter
- #15
iceman2654
Programmer
meidc, that's a very interesting article....
Unfortunately I doubt Microsoft will release it. It sounds like it's gonna conflict with their company plans
Unfortunately I doubt Microsoft will release it. It sounds like it's gonna conflict with their company plans
dilettante
MIS
Sure doesn't sound like middleware (by any definition I'm aware of). Sounds like yet another emulator like WINE.
Anyone seen anything besides hyperbole on this "David" thing?
I guess others agree: Prem's blog
Anyone seen anything besides hyperbole on this "David" thing?
I guess others agree: Prem's blog
- Thread starter
- #19
The thing with .NET is that it doesn't matter whether it's used or not in an application...
There's a lot of things out there that use it but the users don't need to know or care about it.
Personally when I go out to buy a piece of software I couldn't care less whether it's written in C#, C++, Delphi, Java or CoBOL as long as it does the job.
There's a lot of things out there that use it but the users don't need to know or care about it.
Personally when I go out to buy a piece of software I couldn't care less whether it's written in C#, C++, Delphi, Java or CoBOL as long as it does the job.
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