JDE versions and platforms 2

[Mukul1]

Hi!
My company wishes to go in for JDE. What i'm unsure about, and need to get informed on, is... what are the versions of JDE like oneworld... what all platforms and databases does JDE run on... and what all are the modules which the versions have. Could any forum member direct me to a useful link or provide me with all this information?
Thanks in advance
Mukul

 

[monkeylizard]

http://www.jdedwards.com

should be able to answer all of your questions....

Basically, there are two different JDE Products: World and OneWorld. World is designed for an AS/400 environment and OneWorld is made for a Client/Server environment.

I'm not familiar with World, but here's the skinny on OneWorld.

Platforms: RS6000, HP9000, AS/400, and Wintel/NT
Databases: DB2, Oracle, MS-SQL Server

As for versions, the naming convention works like this:

B7332
The 'B' is for OneWorld. World versions all start with 'A'

7.3.3 is the current base release.

The 2 is for 'Cummulative Upgrade 2' Currently, you can run base code (B733), cum. update 1 (B7331), cum. update 2(B7332) or Cum Upgrade 3, which is called XE (if they had followed their own naming convention, it would have been called B7.3.3.3)

JDEdwards is going to begin phasing out support of B7332 in favor of XE. If you are doing a new implementation, don't worry about the naming of the old versions, just get XE.

OneWorld Requires at LEAST two servers (*). One will function as the Enterprise Server. This can be any of the platforms listed above. The second is a Deployment Server used for Object Management, Upgrades, etc. This one MUST be a Windows NT server.

* NOTE: Some consulting firms offer what is called a Combo Box. This effectively makes one server work as both the Enterprise and Deployment servers. Needless to say, this requires that you use the Wintel/NT platform for your Enterprise box as well. This will save some $ on the front end, but in my experience, if you have to try to save $ on the front-end you have no business implementing an ERP solution. JDEdwards does NOT recommend or support Combo boxes. We have one and now use it solely for its Deployment Server Role with a seperate nmachine for the Enterprise box. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[adstew]

MonkeyLizard,

Out of curiosity, what platform would you recommend for the Enterprise box? Our company currently has JDE on an AS\400 system (not sure of version information, using all character-based displays and emulation software for our PC's. I envision having JDE run only in graphical form on PC's. What are our options? Also, do you believe JDE has an easy conversion program to get the data from the AS\400 platform into a PC-based platform version of their software?

 

[Guest_imported]

Never ever listen to JDEdwards recomendations go to a platform like Unix with ORACLE. RS 6000 with ORACLE. its the best , or Sun with ORACLE.
But DO NOT get into JDEdwards recomendations , u will regret if u do.

Regards ...
X JDE salesman

 

[imtiyaz]

hi,
we are going for one world Xe implementation. the information i would like to get is somewhat similar to the one asked by mukul. but i request for detail answer.
1) Hardware requirement for for 50 users.
our consultant is recommending 2GHz of PIII with 512MB SDRAM, 50GB HDD, windows 2000 advanced server, oracle8i, C++ compiler professional. the problem is he is not guranting whether this setup will work.
Can any body HELP?
thanks,
imtiyaz

 

[Tavio]

imitiyaz,

The configuration you mention is possible, but you should get some gaurantee it will work for you other than capacity. Never go down a path you have no understanding of unless you are bringing on some serious specifically trained with JDE knowledge staff to handle it and then they should set up your configuration with no problem. Have you checked with JDE or talked to clients they have using particular platforms? This is a good place to start. In the end it all depends. I have worked on several different configurations and have worked on 10 One World pre Xe and 5 Xe implementations to date and all different. Unlike, the previous post trashing JDE they can have good recommendations as well as bad ones you need to look at the options and the background of the person making the recommendation and what you have in expertise and knowledge at your site and use those to help guide you to the right choice. Hope this helps. Take care.

T

 

[imtiyaz]

Thanks Tavio,
We have discussed with JDE people & other consultants also. Most of the recommendation are not similar. We had asked with server people like IBM, Dell, HP etc. they all are changing there configuration (consequently the rate) when ever we are calling them for negotation.
If you could provide me type of hardware configuration used in Xe implementation of yours, it would be of great help.
imtiyaz

 

[monkeylizard]

Going to open this one back up again...

Adstew, AS/400 can be used for World (which is what you are using if you have terminal emulators on the PCs) or for OneWorld. With OneWorld, the users have a GUI at the PC level. You also have to have an NT server to use for upgrades and "package builds". These are just program installs that update the PCs. Requires some hefty processing power though. A Package build has a lot of C++ compiling to do. Unfortunately, this server will sit idle 95% of the time.

Redrico, NEVER is a strong word to use. JDE's recommendations for Terminal Servers for example are usually spot-on.

Imtiyaz, the setup sounds OK (needs to be at least dual processors though. Get the XEON processors if possible) but you'll need more than 512MB on the RAM. Run the Enterprise box at at least 2 GB, pref. 4GB+. The deployment server needs 50-75% as much as the Enterprise so 1 to 3GB. Either way, make sure the system has PLENTY of room to increase the RAM at a later date. You'll need it.

On a side note, I don't reccomend doing what we did by using an NT server for the Enterprise server and MSSQL for the database. We did it out of $$$ concerns, but if you can do it at all, use Unix/Oracle. I say this because we now have our entire business dependent on one of the flakiest OS platforms ever made. NT is quite user friendly, but is not as stable as an AS/400 or a Unix system. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[JavaBill]

I'm curious to know if anyone is running OneWorld with at least 300-400 users, and what your experiences are with scaling the servers properly. Our database server platform has not been chosen yet, but all three possiblities have been discussed.

 

[monkeylizard]

Only have about 75 users here (20 of them using Citrix). 300-400 users will create a decent amount of Disk I/O so keep that in mind. Unix/Oracle will be more stable and faster, but NT/SQL or NT/Oracle will be easier to find consultants for I think.

I can not stress this enough...get as much RAM as possible. If your Enterprise server won't grow to at LEAST 8Gigs, then the box is too small. I just upgraded mine from 2GB to 4GB. It's nice to know I have 4GB more to go before I max it out. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[monkeylizard]

Note: JDE OneWorld is vary Disk I/O intensive. Processor wise, it's pretty lean especially on the Enterprise server. Deployment Server will hammer the processors at 90-100% during package builds, but that's not an every day thing. I currently have dual P-III 500 Xeon's in both my Enterprise and my Deployment boxes and my IBM Director software always shows Processor useage in the very low range (except in package builds). RAM was the problem until a recent upgrade. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[JavaBill]

Thanks! Actually, we are currently running and older version of Oracle apps on Oracle database, so we have significant resources in house as far as Unix/Oracle database server is concerned. Migrating to JDE means a whole new architecture. Maybe it's not this simple, but with JDE products, Enterprise Server seems to mean what I call database server, and Deployment Server seems to mean what I call applications server. If corporate takes over the Enterprise server stuff they may select MS-SQL Server or DB2, but if we choose, we may prefer to stay in the Unix/Oracle arena. As far as the Deployment server is concerned, apparently it must be an NT box or Citrix box!? From what you said, with 300+ users there is probably no chance we should have less than 8GB RAM, although I'm wondering what would happen if we had multiple Deployment servers. And then there is the thin/thick client thing - what happens to the desktop configuraton? I'll check back next week to see if you are so kind as to post again to this thread. Thanks again! Bill

 

[monkeylizard]

Bill, I'm not sure what you mean about Citrix on the Deployment Server...as for database/application server, I think you're off base there too.

Yes, Enterprise will be the primary database server, but it doesn't have to be. I suppose you could use a seperate Database server, but it would need to be a fiber-channel type setup or you'll kill yourself on Network I/O between the Databases and Enterprise.

OneWorld allows you to define where different programs (or applications within OneWorld) will do their processing. You can have the apps process locally on the user's workstation (FULL install at the desktop) or process on the Enterprise server. At this point Enterprise is also your central processor. Many of the apps HAVE to run on Enterprise. This is where the RAM starts getting used. If you're thinking of a box with 8GB, then the processors will surely be capable of handling JDE processing.

***BTW - My RAM reccomendations are for NT systems. Unix/OS400 are much more efficient and wouldn't need as much.

Deployment server is used for software updates. JDEdwards releases Electronic Software Updates(ESU's) and Service packas regularly and these have to be installed on the Deployment server. Deployment functions as the repository for all of the base code and all of the objects, along with all of the System settings and many other parts of the JDEdwards core. When a Package (JDE install or update) is uilt, it builds itself from the data on the deployment server. When the package is deployed (or installed) on the workstation, Enterprise server, or Citrix server, it overwrites the settings that were there before.

Follow the logic here...It's VERY easy to get these parts out of whack if you follow me. Changes made to a workstation that are not copied to the Deployment server will be lost when a new package that affects the changed object is applied to the workstation. Likewise for the Enterprise server.

The Combo Server that I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread works like this...

Big heafty box partitioned into 3 drives. C: is NT System, D: is Deployment, E: is Enterprise.

Good side is less $$ up front...only one server to buy. Bad side...well, too much to list here. We now have a Combo box that is only used for deployments (i.e. the E: drive is not used) and we have a seperate Enterprise server. In time, we want to start using the E: Enterprise side of Combo again for a test environment purpose. That way , we can screw it up and none of the users care. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[JavaBill]

Deployment: I had the applications server part of the funtionality on the Enterprise server confused with the Deployment server. That Deployment server sounds like a neat idea - to have a management and control point for the whole installation.

Enterprise: This is the piece that has the applications and the database, right? The applications need to be on an NT box, but the database could be on a different box. We have a Hitatchi SAN that fiber connects our major servers. The database could end up on NT/MS-SQL or mainframe/DB2 or Unix/Oracle.

I really appreciate the heads-up on RAM and fiber to the database server. Hopefully we won't under-spec the thing and get burned later on. There has been mention of placing the Enterprise server (or at least the database part) at the corporate datacenter a few hundred miles away from our 300+ users at this office. Frankly, this bandwidth thing has me more than a little concerned. We need to understand this much better before we decide on an architecture.

Last, but not least, software development/customization tools: any thoughts there? At the very least, I gather that many JDE shops go to a third party report writer. JDE seems to have its own proprietary scripting language - what is it used for? Are the apps/customizatons primarily written in C++/VB/Java? How about Web integration to JDE (OneWorld) apps?

Thanks so very much,
Bill

 

[monkeylizard]

OK Bill, let's see what I can give you. JDE hammers the database (at least an NT/SQL setup does). I would not recommend remote databasing unless you've got a monster connection between your sites.

The Enterprise server can be Unix, NT, or and AS/400. The database would then be Oracle/SQL for Unix/NT or DB2 for AS/400. Honestly, I've never heard anyone mention that they use a database server seperate from the Enterprise server, but I seem to recall that JDEdwards does support that configuration. JDE just looks at pointers (ODBC in NT) to find the database. It doesn't realy care where it's located.

The only systems that have to be NT/2000 are the Deployment server and the workstations with FULL installs. I recommend STRONGLY that you avoid installing OneWorld on any Windows 9x workstations. Use Citrix for your older PCs or replace them if you can. Although JDE supports the client on Win9x, nobody I know of has been very succesful at it.

JDE is primarily written in C++ and is pretty easy to modify. However, take note of yesterday's post and be sure to have a good system of tracking object changes or you'll lose your customizations and have to re-do the code changes.

Report Writer is the proprietary report generator in OneWorld. I don't use it, so I don't know how good it is. Seems to be pretty good once you learn it, but we had to send a few of our accountants to a JDEdwards center in Atlanta for training on it. speaking of training, don't even think about this project unless you have some training money in it too. I highly recommend the following from JDE.

CNC Foundations
System Administration
Deploying Modifications
Security Workshop (I think this is part of Sys Admin class now)

More info on costs and training center locations can be found on the JDE website. Sometimes it's hard to stay awake and most of the stuff is way over a beginner's head, but it will all make sense in time.

As for web, we don't use that either, but I hear that the Java server piece of this works fairly well. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-

 

[JavaBill]

First let me say thanks, how much I appreciate your efforts!

I got an e-mail today: It seems that JDE folks will be in here later this week for a demo. The timing of this dialog couldn't be better. It's not that I don't trust sales people, it's just that I tend to be much more emprical that they do. On the adjenda is a session on the architecture and toolset, and I look forward to being able to ask some more intelligent (read: less stupid) questions than I otherwise would have. I'll check back at this forum as I learn more.

Bill

 

[Dasgupta]

Anyone please let me know what are the difficulties in continuing using JDEworld as it is? Depending on the kind of AS400 u are using, a number of users can work simulteniously. And I think JDE world is robust enough.
Using DB2/400 at the back is also very secure.
If you can implement seamless interfacing of AS400 with other existing Windows based PC applications, then u can run JDE world as it is and save $ s.
Please let me know what are the other problems.

Dasgupta

 

[JavaBill]

We run Oracle on HP and are quite pleased over a period of time with performance and stability as well as database tools and support. I have also worked with Oracle on Sun - also quite good. Don't know first hand about IBM platforms. As far as specs for an HP/Oracle server for your situation, we have found our HP and Oracle reps valuable resources in figuring that out, as we are in the process of upgrading our database infrastructure.

 

[Guest_imported]

I have a question, JDE One World works through a Web Browser in the client side. Is it neccesary to get configurated any Web Server on the enterprise server, or the app in the Enterprise Server works for itself as Web Server???

Thx

 

[monkeylizard]

To use OneWorld via a Web interface, you need to be runnning a OneWorld JAS (JAVA Application Server). I think the ENTERPRISE server can function as this, but most setups just use another box. Monkeylizard
-Isaiah 35-