I have a quick question. Is there a difference between the Hercules 3D Prophet All-In-Wonder 9800SE, and the Radeon ATI 9800SE? I heard alot about these how you can use a driver that will open up 4 more pipelines making basically like the 9800Pro except a heck of alot cheaper. Does anyone know anything about these?
Tek-Tips is the largest IT community on the Internet today!
Members share and learn making Tek-Tips Forums the best source of peer-reviewed technical information on the Internet!
-
Congratulations strongm on being selected by the Tek-Tips community for having the most helpful posts in the forums last week. Way to Go!
Is there a difference between these video cards?
- Thread starter Palynth
- Start date
TheGoatMan
Vendor
The all-in-wonder comes as a package. With a remote and other fun stuff I believe. Also I'm pretty sure that the 9800 that comes in the All-in-wonder is a pro. And opening up the pipelines aren't as simple as installing a driver.
TheGoatMan
Vendor
Your post doesn't answer his question. His question was whats the difference. Your posts says that it sucks.
Did you read all .
And looked at the web links .
To get them compared ,you have to look at
two weblinks since the 9800Se-AIW isn't compared
with the plain 9800SE in the first link.
This one compares
Radeon 9800SE-AIW , Radeon 9600 Pro , Radeon 9600XT
And this one compares
Radeon 9500 , Radeon 9800SE , Radeon 9600XT , Radeon 9800XT
So after looking at this last one one should know
where 9800SE-AIW places itself in the perfomance list
both with 4 / 8 pipelines .
And i've never said it sucks.
Look at the video card test and make up your own mind.
And looked at the web links .
To get them compared ,you have to look at
two weblinks since the 9800Se-AIW isn't compared
with the plain 9800SE in the first link.
This one compares
Radeon 9800SE-AIW , Radeon 9600 Pro , Radeon 9600XT
And this one compares
Radeon 9500 , Radeon 9800SE , Radeon 9600XT , Radeon 9800XT
So after looking at this last one one should know
where 9800SE-AIW places itself in the perfomance list
both with 4 / 8 pipelines .
And i've never said it sucks.
Look at the video card test and make up your own mind.
- Thread starter
- #6
From one of Syar2003's links I got this. Author: Ryszard
Given a wafer of say 50 R350 cores, a random selection of those (maybe 10% say) will be tested for defects. Should all the tested cores check out fine, that wafer of cores is marked as fine and all the cores are then used to produce full Radeon 9800 Pro products. Should any of the random test sample fail the testing, the wafer is to be discarded completely (if all selected cores fail initial testing), or used in 9800SE products with 4 pipelines disabled. The second scenario is more desirable, since it means that ATI get to make use of cores that may be slightly defective, but not entirely so.
It also has the statistical advantage that some cores on the defective wafer may be perfectly fine, with all 8 pixel pipelines able to work correctly, essentially giving rise to fully working R350 cores sold as cut down 9800SE's. With final QA testing done by the board manufacturer, after it purchases packaged wafers from ATI (produced by TSMC), any completely defective cores are discarded at that point in production (a statistically small amount). This lets fully working R350 cores slip through the cracks as 9800SE's, which are then sold accordingly, at an attractive price point befitting a mid-range entrant, to consumers.
We then have the softmod scenario, where fully working cores can then have their 4 'defective' pixel pipes enabled by the card driver, giving you free performance.
I am guessing that if you get the 9800SE- AIW, you could get lucky and get one that can have the 4 other pipes enabled? That is only if you get lucky though. Making it a 9800PRO. Did I read that Right?
Given a wafer of say 50 R350 cores, a random selection of those (maybe 10% say) will be tested for defects. Should all the tested cores check out fine, that wafer of cores is marked as fine and all the cores are then used to produce full Radeon 9800 Pro products. Should any of the random test sample fail the testing, the wafer is to be discarded completely (if all selected cores fail initial testing), or used in 9800SE products with 4 pipelines disabled. The second scenario is more desirable, since it means that ATI get to make use of cores that may be slightly defective, but not entirely so.
It also has the statistical advantage that some cores on the defective wafer may be perfectly fine, with all 8 pixel pipelines able to work correctly, essentially giving rise to fully working R350 cores sold as cut down 9800SE's. With final QA testing done by the board manufacturer, after it purchases packaged wafers from ATI (produced by TSMC), any completely defective cores are discarded at that point in production (a statistically small amount). This lets fully working R350 cores slip through the cracks as 9800SE's, which are then sold accordingly, at an attractive price point befitting a mid-range entrant, to consumers.
We then have the softmod scenario, where fully working cores can then have their 4 'defective' pixel pipes enabled by the card driver, giving you free performance.
I am guessing that if you get the 9800SE- AIW, you could get lucky and get one that can have the 4 other pipes enabled? That is only if you get lucky though. Making it a 9800PRO. Did I read that Right?
TheGoatMan
Vendor
Yeah but doesn't the all-in-wonder come with the 9800 pro?
- Thread starter
- #8
If I'm reading this correctly, is your question actually "Which card is better built to allow me to software upgrade to a 9800 Pro?"
Well there's no difference in the GPU's, so it's the same gamble either way. The safer bet would be a regular 9800 non-pro which they have been falling in price lately, those have all 8 pipelines enabled, then it's just adjusting the memory & core speed.
Well there's no difference in the GPU's, so it's the same gamble either way. The safer bet would be a regular 9800 non-pro which they have been falling in price lately, those have all 8 pipelines enabled, then it's just adjusting the memory & core speed.
- Thread starter
- #10
- Thread starter
- #11
TheGoatMan
Vendor
9600xt or the 5700 ultra. Or swing an extra $50 for a FX5900. That would definitely be better.
Back to your original question for a sec, opening up the additional 4 pipelines is indeed possible with either 9800SE card. However, keep in mind that like CPU's, video cards go through the same die-casting process when they are manufactured. Although all 8 pixel pipelines are there, only the cards with lower quality die-casts are selected to be 9800SE versions. In other words, there is a higher percent-chance that some or all of the additional 4 pipelines are defective. Of course, we're probably only talking like a 5-10% percent chance against you, but you never know.
With that in mind, buying a 9800SE in hopes to open the extra 4 pipelines isn't really the brightest idea. If you've already got one then sure, knock your socks off! You've got nothing to lose. If you haven't bought one yet, then spend the extra $$ for a 9600XT, 9500 Pro, or even the 9700 Pro.
~cdogg
[tab]"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab][tab]- A. Einstein
With that in mind, buying a 9800SE in hopes to open the extra 4 pipelines isn't really the brightest idea. If you've already got one then sure, knock your socks off! You've got nothing to lose. If you haven't bought one yet, then spend the extra $$ for a 9600XT, 9500 Pro, or even the 9700 Pro.
~cdogg
[tab]"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources"
[tab][tab]- A. Einstein
- Thread starter
- #14
Id say go for the 9800se-aiw in my country
is about the same price as 9600-xt .
And looking at performance without modded drivers
it performs "roughly like" the 9600xt in most test .
So if i had to choose between those two i'd get the
9800se-AIW .(it also has the 256bit memory bus)
Look at the extra pipelone opening as a bonus if it works.
(and you have the aiw pack also)
I hear that the best possibility to have working 5-8 pipelines is on the Hercules boards.
is about the same price as 9600-xt .
And looking at performance without modded drivers
it performs "roughly like" the 9600xt in most test .
So if i had to choose between those two i'd get the
9800se-AIW .(it also has the 256bit memory bus)
Look at the extra pipelone opening as a bonus if it works.
(and you have the aiw pack also)
I hear that the best possibility to have working 5-8 pipelines is on the Hercules boards.
- Status
Similar threads
- Question