If you could do it over again, would you? 1

[MattGreer]

If you have received a BS degree or higher in Computer Science or I/T, would you do it again given your current state of advancement/job/overall happiness?

Please mention what degree level you attained.

Thanks!!


Matt

 

[MattGreer]

Woah woah guys, take a step back here...

As far as money goes, the fact is even though someone might start a couple years after you, if their salary is greater they will catch up and pass you eventually (in total savings, assuming you never spend a dime). The prof in college showed us how the starting salaries of a BS ChemEngr versus a PhD would "generally" go. While a PhD would start earning money several years after a BS, they would pass them up in just a few years after they started working.

Regardless, this thread wasn't really *intended* to be a degreed vs non-degreed discussion. As in my first post, I wanted to find out of people with college degrees were happy with where they were and whether or not they'd do it again.

In retrospect, I suppose inherent to that would be a comparison of the job potential between folks that are self-taught versus the college folks. But of course, not at the risk of insulting each other.

Please don't let this thread dissolve into an argument.

Would it be safe to assume that someone with a degree would have greater opportunities for advancement vs. a person without? Not knowing the IT world, it might be different from what I know here.

Thanks!!


Matt

 

[willir]

Way-t'a go Leslie. You tell'm girl!

Matt per your query. Many of us in this forum have been around to have seen considerable change - our lives, the IT business, recession(s), boom and bust economy.

My perspective is that any education - "paper" or "hard knocks" is not wasted, albeit some skills are more marketable than others.

When hiring, I value "transferable" skills or "soft" skills. Skills learned from other walks-of-life that are useful for my current needs. A peice of paper is nice -- Hmmm - top marks, okay, you are probably smart, work hard and finish what you start. X number of years in the business with multiple platforms -- Hmmm - probably have good trouble shooting skills, now the bigger picture on hardware and software, etc. Just finished a technical diploma -- hmmm - you have current knowledge to the specific technology. All have their good points. Behind the résumé, is the person, their attitude and how they use their skill set.

...Moving on - Doing it over again...
Me personally. I went through Univesity. Even got a masters degree in science. I worked hard, I enjoyed my work, and did fairly well . But in terms of marketability, the degree had a limited application (one of those recession period things )

It was then I learned that I was more than just a little bit good with computers. So I went the diploma route. Did really well. Anytime I have been job hunting, I tend to get several offers.

But it was not just my technical skills that made me fairly good in IT. During my MSc, I learned some really, really important things that helped me excel in other areas. These are things that are not taught in a diploma program. How to evaluate a situation and determine the problem. How to determine the skills or technology to resolve the problem. How to analyze, etc. These same skills I learned during my MSc were extremely helpful in other area.

Your question, "would you do it again?". I guess my only regret was that it took so long to realize my strength lay in IT. If I had started off in IT, I would probably have obtained my MSc (and maybe PHd) in IT instead of pursuing in a parallel direction elsewhere. I would probably being making twice my current salary.

Am I sad about this? Definitely not!

Life is what you live getting from here to there...

 

[keyser456]

I think we can all agree there are no guarantees in life. What works for one person may not work for another. Many a successful person have never finished high school (Einstein, Henry Ford, Rockefeller, Abraham Lincoln), let alone college (Does the name Bill Gates ring a bell?). All joking aside, I do have respect for college educations and for the people who take the time to earn their degrees. I was merely trying to provide the other side of the argument since ONLY people who had their degree were responding. When someone took a shot at me, I responded. I never wanted to start a flaming session and I think we are all, alumni or not, intelligent enough to see each other's point.

Oh yeah. For the record, I worked 20 hours a week for the first 2 years attending full time and worked full time for the last 3, taking only 2 classes per semester. So yes, I wish I could have made better use of my college education. Who knows, maybe someday I will have the time and money to go back.

 

[Stella740pl]

Just for the record:

Albert Einstein (1879-1955), theoretical physicist and Nobel Prize winner had a doctorate, and taught in several Universities, including Princeton. As for the high school ... well, there was a story.

This is from Funk & Wagnalls Standard Reference Encyclopedia, 1959-1967.

...educated at the Technische Hochschule in Zurich, Switzerland, and at the University of Zurich. His childhood was spent mainly in Munich, where his father had established an elctrical business. In 1894, because of financial reverses, his family emigrated from Germany to live with relatives in Milan, Italy. The fifteen-year-old boy was left behind in Munich to finish school, but later in the year he obtained permission to join his family in Milan by deliberately doing poorly in his school work. In the following six month he taught himself calculus and other advanced subjects, and went to Switzerland to continue his formal education... In 1902, ... he obtained a position as patent examiner ... the modest financial security that this post provided enabled him to do research in his spare time and to obtain his doctorate ...

 

[CajunCenturion]

I was merely trying to provide the other side of the argument since ONLY people who had their degree were responding.

Do think that's because the question was directed at ONLY those people who have degrees?

Yes, I would do it over again. But then I got my BS in Mathematics, BS in Computer Science and post-graduate degree in Software Engineering a few years before the PC even existed. Back then; if you did not have a degree in a scientific discipline, you wouldn't get past the receptionist. It has been a fairly recent lowering of the bar due to several factors. Having the degree in today's environment can be detrimental because employers know that they get what they pay for, and at this point in time, are willing to settle for what they pay for, partly because they don’t know any better. I don't think that will last forever, as the labor pool will subside, with most leaving IT to follow the money. It will cycle back, and the education/qualifications bar will come back up. I doubt it will reach those levels of 60’s and 70’s because the industry has lost its professional status, and has become commoditized. But employers will still begin to see the long-term soft costs of poorly prepared individuals; companies will stop relying on individuals who get the job done, but don’t know any better. Companies will start to put pressure on the IT staff to better utilize what they have. Efficiency will become a necessity. Companies will return to looking for well rounded people to better fit into their corporate cultures. It’s a normal business cycle, with ups and downs.

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[keyser456]

Do think that's because the question was directed at ONLY those people who have degrees?

Who here would be humble enough to admit if it weren't worth it? OF COURSE anyone who's spent thousands of dollars and years of their life is going to say they would do it again. That would be like asking someone who just paid 250 grand for a Lamborghini if it was worth it. Would they say no, even if it weren't? Why not rename the title of the post: "Make yourself feel better about the time and money you spent in college." That's all this thread would have been without someone presenting an alternative.

 

[CajunCenturion]

Why are you so cynical? To really think that your fellow IT professionals would be so dishonest?

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[MattGreer]

Keyser, I don't agree with you on that statement. Sometimes I wish I'd studied something different in college, and I know I'm not the only one. It's not the money I paid, it's the realization of what this career is actually like, versus what it seemed to be during my time in college. Plus, a lot of people study things based on the influence of outside sources as opposed to what they REALLY enjoy. Thus, when they finally get their degree in XXX, after a while they wish they could go back and study something they really enjoyed.

I think people, in retrospect, might be willing to admit that they paid a lot of money for a degree that the ended up not liking, so in retrospect, they wish they had gotten a different degree in a different field of study. That, essentially, is what this thread is about. Or at least what I meant it to be about. For the degreed folks in IT, would they go back and do it again? Or would they rather have pursued a degree in another area?

This isn't a discussion of who's better, this is a discussion more along the lines of "what do you think would have been better... for *you* (if you have an IT-type degree).

It's not about the money, believe it or not.

Thanks!!


Matt

 

[screwloose]

Keyser456, your quote, “"Make yourself feel better about the time and money you spent in college." is reflective of your complete ignorance of an education.

A college experience is more than just attaining a degree, but rather it is a time for a student to grow and learn. It is the first time students have lived independently and a time they have to make decisions for themselves without a parent deciding for them. Many students meet their wife or husband on campus and after graduation begin a family.

In your analogy, a person getting an honorable discharge for completion of military service is just doing it to get a “piece of paper,” without recognizing the fact they did it for other reasons, which may include a sense of duty; or maybe it was just for the money for college; but whatever the reason, they still earned it. Did they waste 3 or 5 years of their lives just to get that “piece of paper?”

Not every individual’s path is right for every other person to follow. But you should not assume that it was a waste of time or money because of what they chose to do, anymore than someone should chastise you because of not earning a degree. Besides, more people DON’T have a college degree than do have one. But those with a college degree for the most part have more opportunities and earn more in their lifetime than someone without a formal higher education.

Why do you think so many people sacrifice so much to get an education? Because it is a chance to have a better life than their parents and/or grandparents may have had. If it is a dream of yours to become a Wall Street investment banker who takes home a bonus of 7 figures annually then you will need to be a earn an MBA from a major institution and have a lot of ambition and drive. Without the degree, ambition, and drive you would not have a chance of getting on staff to fulfill your dreams.

Employers want an educated workforce because an education develops cognitive skills, reasoning, critical thinking, and other needed skills an organization needs to compete.

 

[Onyxpurr]

First of all, although belated, thank you for replying Stella.

I have my BS in CIS from Devry. If I had the chance to do it all over again, absolutely!! Only this time I would try to graduate in 4 years, not 10! lol

I definately think it was well worth it for reasons other than money.

My college experiences opened a myriad of opportunities that I would not have experienced otherwise. I guess this is somewhat apparent by my decision to continue on and get my Master's. Not to say that experience isn't useful, but as someone said, it's not a matter of either/or. I have a degree AND experience.

Also, I have earned the respect from my boss, co-workers, peers and family by doing this and working. I consider it well-worth th time and effort and investment!