LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK..... Erik Rudnick, CCIE No. 9545
mailto:erik@kuriosity.com
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HOW COULD THIS BE CONSIDERED ETHICAL
- Thread starter ccie9545
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cian
Technical User
- Oct 11, 2001
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Bloody unfair! And definitly unethical in my opinion!
PanIP was only formed 1 month before the first lawsuit. They are obviously out to screw the little boys before they build courage to fight the big boys!
How the heck did they get those patents in the first place? Surely some court must invalidate these patents? Surely some government official must be able to intervene, a lot of jobs could be lost if it continues!
É
:: ::
PanIP was only formed 1 month before the first lawsuit. They are obviously out to screw the little boys before they build courage to fight the big boys!
How the heck did they get those patents in the first place? Surely some court must invalidate these patents? Surely some government official must be able to intervene, a lot of jobs could be lost if it continues!
É
:: ::
CajunCenturion
Programmer
Its not ethical. Its a situation where you've got a shrewd attorney who was able to obtain a patent based on technology that the patent office did not fully understand.
Now, they are suing little guys, ones who would rather settle, then to expend the amount of money required to challenge the patent.
The best news is that a number of these folks have pooled their resources to fight back. Once the patent is challenged in court (at least IMHO), I think the results will be similar to the AA case. The plaintiff would lose and likely have the patents invalidated. I certainly hope so anyway.
Again its not ethical, its pure greed. Good Luck
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As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
Now, they are suing little guys, ones who would rather settle, then to expend the amount of money required to challenge the patent.
The best news is that a number of these folks have pooled their resources to fight back. Once the patent is challenged in court (at least IMHO), I think the results will be similar to the AA case. The plaintiff would lose and likely have the patents invalidated. I certainly hope so anyway.
Again its not ethical, its pure greed. Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein
Expect to see lots of that. Amazon and the one click is similar.
This is both unethical and mischievous. Gary Haran
This is both unethical and mischievous. Gary Haran
iSeriesCodePoet
Programmer
...I am going to patent the letter 't'. For every usage, I expect .0001 US dollars. I will be a millionare in a week!!!!!
Mike Wills
IBM iSeries (AS/400) Programmer
![[pc2]](/data/assets/smilies/pc2.gif "[pc2] [pc2]")
Mike WillsIBM iSeries (AS/400) Programmer
MasterRacker
New member
Koldark, forget it. That's too easy. Here's an actual patent:
This kid can theoretically collect royalties from anyone who swings side to side instead of front to back on a swing.
(TGML was messing up the link so you'll have to cut and paste into a browser)
Jeff
No matter how bad it is, it can always get worse ....
This kid can theoretically collect royalties from anyone who swings side to side instead of front to back on a swing.
(TGML was messing up the link so you'll have to cut and paste into a browser)
Jeff
No matter how bad it is, it can always get worse ....
Hm... do you think someone is pulling your leg there?
i.e. someone with sufficient resources has patented this PURELY to show how absurd the US patent office is becoming?
Curious to know if the UK patent office issues similar patents... anyone know?
i.e. someone with sufficient resources has patented this PURELY to show how absurd the US patent office is becoming?
Curious to know if the UK patent office issues similar patents... anyone know?
iSeriesCodePoet
Programmer
What the H#$* is wrong with the patenting office? I think they need to audit the office's proceedures. Mike Wills
IBM iSeries (AS/400) Programmer
IBM iSeries (AS/400) Programmer
I thought that you couldn't patent an idea once it became public territory? There was an article written in the early 90's by a friend of mine that spoke at great length about the web being used as a commercial enterprise, about content and sales being customized to the individual user, and on and on. In fact that article pretty much covered both of the patents as did many many more since then. It sounds as if this is another attempt at squeezing undeserved money out of a highly unethical loophole/situation.
Maybe we could get him together with this woman:
because there is a lot in common here.
Personally, I know I will be writing letter very shortly to both W3C and IEEE to ask what their take on it is. I think this guy has crossed well over the line, and while he may not be the first one, I'd hate to be the next one to find a bill in my mailbox for using a patented idea before it was patented.
-Tarwn --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
For my next trick I will pull a hat out of a rabbit (if you think thats bad you should see how the pigeon feels...)
Maybe we could get him together with this woman:
because there is a lot in common here.
Personally, I know I will be writing letter very shortly to both W3C and IEEE to ask what their take on it is. I think this guy has crossed well over the line, and while he may not be the first one, I'd hate to be the next one to find a bill in my mailbox for using a patented idea before it was patented.
-Tarwn --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---
For my next trick I will pull a hat out of a rabbit (if you think thats bad you should see how the pigeon feels...)
LesleyW,
Actually, there are a ton of silly patents out there. The "method of swinging" patent that MasterRacker posted above is actually real. I verified it in an online legal database that I have a subscription to. It's patent number 6368227. I could hardly believe it, but it really exists. I can't imagine how someone could be approved of such a patent in Nov of 2000, when you know the idea has existed since the time of the swing!! ~cdogg
"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein
Actually, there are a ton of silly patents out there. The "method of swinging" patent that MasterRacker posted above is actually real. I verified it in an online legal database that I have a subscription to. It's patent number 6368227. I could hardly believe it, but it really exists. I can't imagine how someone could be approved of such a patent in Nov of 2000, when you know the idea has existed since the time of the swing!! ~cdogg
"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein
sleipnir214
Programmer
Some interesting reading on the topic: "Patently Absurd" by James Gleick (
In the opposite direction, I also recommend the science fiction short story "Lobsters", by Charles Stross. The main character, Manfred Macx, is a "venture altruist". He thinks up things to patent, patents them and as many permutations has he can think of, then signs the patent rights over to the Free Infrastructure Foundation so that the ideas can be used by anyone who needs them. Kind of an anti-patent system. ______________________________________________________________________
TANSTAAFL!
In the opposite direction, I also recommend the science fiction short story "Lobsters", by Charles Stross. The main character, Manfred Macx, is a "venture altruist". He thinks up things to patent, patents them and as many permutations has he can think of, then signs the patent rights over to the Free Infrastructure Foundation so that the ideas can be used by anyone who needs them. Kind of an anti-patent system. ______________________________________________________________________
TANSTAAFL!
Gee. . . I wonder how much PanIP, their attorneys for that matter, depend on the internet for business and personal communications...and here we are, a whole community of clever web people who seem to by and large disapprove of what they are doing...mmmh? Oops! I've joined a club that'll have me as a member?
In the UK a patent can only be applied to invention/design/method which is not common knowledge. You cannot apply a patent to - - Holding a mug the opposite side from the handle - - because it's already being done. you'd need to design a mug specifically for this purpose. You cannot back-date a patent, so the fact that these companies have been using this technology since before November 2000 would be sufficent to invalidate the patent. Having said that the patent laws are designed for the big companies.
If you invented a machine which could save thousands of lives but cost 10 pence. Don't patent it. You need to be making hundreds of thousands to make it worthwhile. Otherwise you quite simply wouldn't have the cash to fight big businesses through the legal system.
Patents give little or no protection to the "little people", because the large companies can afford to ignore them. With legal battles taking months to clear up, many inventors give up due to lack of funds.
If you invented a machine which could save thousands of lives but cost 10 pence. Don't patent it. You need to be making hundreds of thousands to make it worthwhile. Otherwise you quite simply wouldn't have the cash to fight big businesses through the legal system.
Patents give little or no protection to the "little people", because the large companies can afford to ignore them. With legal battles taking months to clear up, many inventors give up due to lack of funds.
If I heard right, an italian train pilot has put the royalty on the italian word for "Santa Clause". Can you imagine the nice gifts he gets under the tree?
Daren J. Lahey
Just another computer guy...
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Daren J. Lahey
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These intellectual property companies are common.
Typically it's a group of rich lawyers who buy up
a bunch of patents, or buy small companies with
patents, and then form a company with the *sole*
intent of litigation.
They didn't invent anything, they don't even have
the capacity to invent anything, they're just money-
hungry lawyers hoping to cash in at the expense of
other people.
Obviously this is also a worst-case example,
sometimes the patent holders really get screwed too.
I'd personally like to see a little more protection
for the little guy be built into the system. Our
(USA's) corporations seem to be getting out of
control.
Typically it's a group of rich lawyers who buy up
a bunch of patents, or buy small companies with
patents, and then form a company with the *sole*
intent of litigation.
They didn't invent anything, they don't even have
the capacity to invent anything, they're just money-
hungry lawyers hoping to cash in at the expense of
other people.
Obviously this is also a worst-case example,
sometimes the patent holders really get screwed too.
I'd personally like to see a little more protection
for the little guy be built into the system. Our
(USA's) corporations seem to be getting out of
control.
Quickly scanning the patent (near the bottom)it becomes clear that in the wording this would cover ATM machines, online banking, and sending your in your tax forms by E-mail. It patient seems to have be "designed" to process loans on-line. It's a far stretch to consider purchasing goods on-line to be connected to such vague and broad wording. I think the goverment and all large bank holdings should be notified that the're next to get sued.
I wonder if the US Patent and Trademark Office - Online Shopping Welcome paid their royalties?
PalmStrike
Technical User
I have to say, I am not surprised about anything that happens in the US anymore.
One fellow had a DNA test as a lot of people do and is becoming a matter of course now here in the UK, but this guy found out that his DNA was being tested on, so of course he took it to court, where the highest courts in the land finally came to the decision that his DNA did not belong to him, and he lost the case.
If money is invoved, somebody will try and get it by any means. Unfortunately, it does mean that you have to be a little more carefull with your business plans these days.
IIt seems to be human nature to grind down a someone who has become successfull by practising a compassionate act.
One fellow had a DNA test as a lot of people do and is becoming a matter of course now here in the UK, but this guy found out that his DNA was being tested on, so of course he took it to court, where the highest courts in the land finally came to the decision that his DNA did not belong to him, and he lost the case.
If money is invoved, somebody will try and get it by any means. Unfortunately, it does mean that you have to be a little more carefull with your business plans these days.
IIt seems to be human nature to grind down a someone who has become successfull by practising a compassionate act.
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