Getting the Sack 5

[Qube]

It looks like I am going to be getting fired from my current position as IT Manager for a small firm. I know this because I have seen a document which is an advert for my position. So I am in doubt that it is going to happen.

What I want to ask is where do I stand on telling people the administrator password and other such things?

Do I have to co-operate?

There will be no hand over with the new person starting so it is not like he will ask me.

Any advice on this matter would be of great help.

Thanks in advance

 

[ChrisHunt]

I don't think you can refuse to divulge such things if they ask you for them. Since they don't appear to be taking any initiative to tell you what they're doing, you could reciprocate by not telling them anything unless they think to ask for it. There must be lots of things that you'd only realise that you needed once you started doing the job. Charge them a hefty consultancy fee to come back and tell them those things.

Having said that, you have to balance your natural desire to get your own back with your need for a decent reference from them. If you're confident of getting a job elsewhere (or you reckon they will give you a lousy reference anyway) you can afford to be bloody minded, otherwise you'll have to bite your lip and play safe.

-- Chris Hunt

http://www.mcgonagall-online.org.uk

http://www.napitalia.org.uk

http://www.leicesteryha.org.uk

 

[MakeItSo]

the administrator password and other such things

Yes and No:
Yes, tell them the Admin password(s) to administer server / company pcs, since this is something which does not belong to your personal achievements.

No: Do not give them advice on something you needed to learn yourself unless they ask you for it. And even then try to balance:
Is it something they should know themselves and which they can find out - e.g. by asking one in tek-tips ;-), or is it some company-internal specialty.
The first: if you're fired, your not your follow-up's consultant. He ought to be better in your job ´than you were, so let him prove it.
The latter: That is something he cannot know from his education/personal wit. Tell him, it might also serve you as you are still needed although the new one is here.

Do not give more assistance than absolutely needed.

 

[BabyJeffy]

You know, I keep asking myself if you have the "wrong end of the stick" on this one. Just because you saw an advert for (what you believe to be) your job, doesn't mean you are about to be fired. There are many reasons why they may be advertising such a role.

On being fired though - do you have to co-operate? Sure... why wouldn't you? I would be hesitant in writing long lists of things for the next guy to refer to... but passwords for the admin/root accounts are something you should have in the fire-safe anyway - right? If a request sounds unreasonable to you, then run it by a legal/union rep or something.

Jeff

 

[edfair]

In the long run, it is in your best interest to pass on to your boss any specific knowledge you have regarding the company. Includes the passwords, documentation of layouts, problem issues, and status of ongoing projects.

Small companies can have funny dynamics. So you may, or may not, be replaced. If you are, it may not be a problem with you, it can be a host of other problems. I watched my last employer go out of business 14 months after firing me, and I ended up cleaning up their local office and shipping or scrapping their equipment as it closed down. Management made some political choices and paid the price.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[Spirit]

I am with Edfair here. You can be as loyal as you like to a firm but a firm will never be loyal to you. So when the cookie crumbles all you can do is your professional best.

Without knowing why you are about to be sacked (how did you find this document? Which in its self could be a sackable offence.) then its hard to say what to do.

However, no matter what the circumstances I have left jobs under I have always maintained my professionalism at the end of the day that and my honesty is all I have. Its easy to say that being British with a trusty stiff upper lip tho'

Lets think about it for a minute you mess with this company and word gets out? Not going to look good for the next job?

But if you really want to only give the info they ask for and volunteer nothing. Personally I wouldn't but its your choice.

Iain

 

[CajunCenturion]

No matter what happens, be professional. You cooperate, at a minimum, to the extend that you give them what is theirs. It is not your password, it is the administrator's password. Think of it this way. You are wearing the administrator's hat right now, and the password belongs to the hat. When you give back, (or they take back) the hat, the password should stay with the hat.

Your personal reputation is one thing that you will take with you no matter where you go. Regardless if, or why, you end up leaving that company, what they say about you will contribute to your reputation. Again, be professional, and don't burn any bridges.

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[SemperFiDownUnda]

Once agian I agree with Cajun. Even though you might feel good for putting them in a jam if you refuse to give them the passwords then you might find yourself on the other end of a legal battle that you would loose. Essentially you would be extorting them. Don't get the temptation to destroy any work etc as this is also probably an offence.

Make sure they have access to all the tools they should. Be professional because though there can be legal issues with what they can and can not say if a future employer calls them I don't think they would hesitate to say something like "We are in legal proceedings with him/her to obtain company information which he/she is withholding from us and can not comment further on his employment here at this firm"

I'd spend more energy at this point in time looking at positive future career opertunities then with negative thoughts about leaving.

Hope I've been helpful,
Wayne Francis

If you want to get the best response to a question, please check out FAQ222-2244 first

 

[chiph]

Like Cajun says -- the passwords belong to them.

Your responsibilities should end with giving them what's theirs. If they want you to train a replacement (assuming that's what's in the works), then you do it on the clock, either still as a permanent employee, or as a consultant afterwards (charge going rate, don't try and gouge them).

You should be professional in everything -- word always gets around, and you wouldn't want a bit of satisfying revenge to get in the way of securing a new job.

If/when the day comes, they may escort you off premises. Don't be upset when this happens -- they're just doing what the troll in HR read in an airline magazine (or saw in the movie Office Space). You might want to start taking home any knick-knacks.

(But don't take this opportunity to load up on ballpoints or staple removers! Theft is still theft!)

Chip H.


If you want to get the best response to a question, please check out FAQ222-2244 first

 

[Qube]

Thanks for the all the advice.

I found the document whilst doing a test restore of a user account from backup tape. Which is part of my job.

If they are that stupid to save the file on the network god help them.

It is for my position as there is only 1 IT position in the company, and they would have told me if they were adding more staff.

The sneaky thing about it is that they do not have any grounds to sack to, but becuase i have not been here a year yet they can just give me 1 months notice without a reason. I found that out from someone I know who works in employment law.

Would it be ok to foramt my PC before I go as long as any work that belongs to the compnay is stored on the network? saves me going through and making sure i removed anything else.

 

[CajunCenturion]

Is it your PC or the company's PC? If it's your PC, why reformat it, as I assume you're going to take with you? If it's the company's PC, why reformat it, as what's on it that doesn't belong?

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[Qube]

It is a company pc. Wanted to format it to remove anything I might have missed deleting. Things like favorites, cookies, temp files, personal files etc

All of the companies files are on the network so they would not be harmed.

 

[chiph]

Qube -
I would just leave the PC. Sure, you can remove your favorites and browsing history. But I wouldn't delete any emails or make an effort to clean up the OS for the next user .. just walk away. If you do format the drive, that just raises suspicions.

Chip H.


If you want to get the best response to a question, please check out FAQ222-2244 first

 

[Zelandakh]

It is a worrying waiting game.

Don't assume they are doing this for any stupid reason. Assume it is to replace you with someone with a different skillset and that you are still great. Treat them with respect without rolling over and playing dead.

By all means give them the passwords. It is for their systems. Cooperate. Just don't volunteer too much.

If they offer you one month and don't escort you off the premises, ask for gardening leave on the grounds of the break down of communication.

Then if they flounder, tough luck...

 

[edfair]

You may find that you have developed a social disease and nobody will want to associate with you. This can be part of the process. Don't get upset if it happens, it isn't your fault.
You can't imagine the pressure that managers can exert to isolate you. In one of my previous changes I later found out that a vice president of a 130,000 person company directed local managers how to handle my leaving and how my fellow employees were to interact with me. And most did as they were instructed.

Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.

 

[Grenage]

Indeed.

You may believe that you are going to be let go, perhaps convinced, but this does not mean you are correct. We all hear stories about people that are adamant they are going to be sacked and do as much damage or cause as much fuss as possible; only to find out that they got completely the wrong end of the stick.

Regardless of whether you are let go or not and however just/unjust it may appear, you have no real right to cause the the company that kind of greif.

regarding: "If they are that stupid to save the file on the network god help them"

Where else to put such a file? In an IT staff position you will usually be able to access confidential files with ease, regardless of permissions. This obviously does not give you the right to open the documents, people's salaries and business plans are not your concern.

That said, I can appreciate your feelings and position. The only real advice I can offer is to view it as their loss rather than your own, carry on work as you would normally until you are told (if you are at all).

 

[Qube]

I am not looking to cause damage, just wanted to know about the password situation etc.

If they don't *ask* for the passwords before I leave do I have to tell them? I most likely will just wonder where I stand on this?

I am just unhappy about the way the hole thing is being handled, it is all very underhand.

I understand the point about getting the wrong end of the stick. But I think it is pretty black and white. I will post on here when it finally happens which will be before april.

 

[Grenage]

I'm sure although as CajunCenturion says, be proffesional. The last thing you want is a very sour departure from the company, especially when you are looking for a new job and they give them a call.

Should it ever happen, of course.

 

[chiph]

If they forget to ask for the passwords, best to volunteer them. In any case, you should have a sealed "What to do if I get hit by a bus" envelope with that info in it. Just hand it over on the way out. You'll seem very professional that way.

Grenage made a good point -- maybe you're not being let go -- did you check the date/time on the file? Maybe it's from when you got hired. It might also be that they interview a dozen people, none of which they like better than you.

Or, if they're especially devious, maybe you were intended to see that file in order to provoke you.

You could go on and on like this and all you'd succeed in doing is raising your blood pressure. I'd make some plans, but otherwise continue acting normally.

Chip H.


If you want to get the best response to a question, please check out FAQ222-2244 first

 

[harebrain]

Don't get the temptation to destroy any work etc as this is also probably an offence.

With respect to:

- Destroying work
- Deleting files
- Formatting disks

Don't do it: these could be crimes. Forget any ideas you might have about retribution; leave that to the gods. (They're generally better at it, anyway.)

As for the wrong end of the stick, consider that companies will advertise positions for purposes other than hiring. For example, it could be an attempt to gather salary information. Suppose that's the case here: you've put yourself through hell for nothing.