Flaky mouse questions?

[Nocandu]

Hi

I have some long time mouse issues.

I always blamed it on my old computer but I get the same thing on my new one.

I have 3 USB mice, a Razer DeathAdder (my favorite Mouse), a Logited G3 and a Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 4.0.

I have switched back and forth trying to get this solved with no luck.

After a period of time using the computer the mouse just slows down and get flaky. The cursor jumps around or won't respond.

I have to exit what ever I'm doing and open the mouse software, change any setting, click apply and then it will go back to normal.

As I said I had this for years on my old Dell XPS and I have it on my new Falcon Northwest computer which is powerful enough to run anything.

Any one have any idea why this is happening.
Is there some configuration option that I'm missing.

Mike

 

[Nocandu]

Thanks for the help guys.

Tomorrow I'll uninstall everything mouse related and start over from scratch.

We'll see what happens.

As I said before this is a new computer and I started seeing the problem with the first mouse that I used.

I'll only reinstall the Deathadder and see if I see an improvement.

Thanks again... I'll get back to you when I have some results.

Well it just did it as I'm writing this.
Now it seems to have stopped, for a few seconds the cursor wouldn't move at all then it was erratic, now it's OK again.

Mike

 

[BadBigBen]

other things that pop into memory, that may cause erratic mouse cursor movement...

1. broken cable. there may be a kinked cable in the usb cable of each mouse...

2. mouse-pad has kinks and the laser/IR diode can not read correctly and thus resets itself to a point of origin, either top left side or top left bottom...

3. also some of the mouse-pads are no good when it comes to LASER optics, and others when it boils down to being InfraRed... meaning some mice work well on one type of pad and others not...



Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

 

[goombawaho]

I've never heard of EMF affecting wired mice. Does someone have a link to this phenomenon??? Even wireless mice I wouldn't think would be affected due to the close proximity of the receiver/transmitter.

 

[Nocandu]

Hi

My mouse got really flaky this morning so...

I uninstalled everything mouse related.
Drivers software etc. for all my mice.

I went into Device Manager and uninstalled everything.
USB hubs, HID controllers mice etc.

I switched back to my G3 mouse.

I went back to using a mouse pad instead of the top of my desk.

I went into the registry and removed all entries related to the Deathadder mouse.

I reinstalled the G3 software and changed the mouse to another USB port.

Now in device manager I see Logitech G3 laser mouse listed under mice, instead of HID pointing device as it was before.

Under Human Interface Devices I have 7 entries 3 for HID compiant devices and 4 for USB input devices. All of then show driver # 6.1.7600.16385. I no longer see my mouse listed here.

Right now it seems to be working OK.

We'll see what happens, when ever I switch mice it seems to work OK for a while, that's why I have been switching back and forth.

Mike

 

[webrabbit]

Do you have a USB hub on your systems? I was having multiple problems with USB devices, and finally tracked it down to either the hub or its extension cable. The symptoms were simular to yours: the devices would work at first, then get flaky. If I rebooted or simply unplugged and reconnected the device, it would be ok for a whie. I replaced the hub and extension cable and the problems went away.

In particular, the problems were not just in the devices connected through the hub, but even those connected directly to other ports. I suspect that the hub or cable had an intermittant short which caused errors on all USB prots.

 

[BadBigBen]

Radio frequency (RF) and electromagnetic (EM) interference are problems that commonly plague USB cables. Ordinary USB cables can't reject this interference because of improper shielding and poor internal construction. This may lead to loss of bandwidth, and slower, inaccurate signal transfer.

source:

http://www.monstercable.com/productdisplay.asp?pin=1429

The external metallic sheath is typically connected to system ground, thus dissipating any potentially damaging static charges (rather than via delicate electronic components). This enclosure design also means that there is a (moderate) degree of protection from electromagnetic interference afforded to the USB signal while it travels through the mated connector pair (this is the only location when the otherwise twisted data pair must travel a distance in parallel).

source:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus#Durability

Common Indication of EMI Problems
• Phidgets and other USB devices disconnect/reconnect. In your application, this will show
up as detach/attach events.
• USB devices have to be unplugged/replugged to start functioning again.
• USB devices have to be plugged into a different USB port to continue functioning.
• In extreme cases, the computer has to be restarted, as the USB bus is non-functional.
• Operating systems are very conservative with their handling of USB devices. If a problem is
suspected, the device will reset.
• Analog Inputs and digital inputs show up particularily noisy.

source:

http://www.phidgets.com/documentation/Tutorials/Addressing_EMI_Issues_Tutorial.pdf

5.2 USB Cables and Connectors
When sending full speed signaling, USB cables rely on the shielding integrity of the cable and connector
shield. Field tests with 65% braid show no measurable leakage through the shield. However, the shield
must be carefully terminated to the connector. Most shielding failures can be traced to improper
termination of the cable shield to the connector or connector shell to the receptacle. Full speed USB cables
are specified to have a woven or spirally wound copper shield. Such a shield can be crimped to the
connector shell yielding 3600 shield coverage at the connector. The use of a foil shield with a drain wire is
not recommended due to the series inductance of the drain wire and the tendency of foil to crack with
cable flexing. Low speed USB cables are not required to have shielding or to maintain a specified
impedance.
USB receptacles should maintain high quality shielding and a low RF impedance between the receptacle
shell and the mating connector on the cable. This may be accomplished by means of multiple wiping
contacts on the inside of the receptacle’s shell. A minimum of four contact points is recommended. A high
degree of shielding may be achieved by enclosing the sides, top, and back of the connector with a metal
Draft 7
shell. The shell should be provided with a low impedance connection to signal ground and, in cases where
a metal chassis is present, a means of accepting a metal EMI gasket clip.

source:

http://www.ti.com/sc/docs/apps/msp/intrface/usb/emitest.pdf

Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

 

[Nocandu]

Hi again.

Well since yesterday it seems to be working OK so far.
That isn't a sure thing, I have had periods when it would go for a while after switching mice before.

The radio interference thing may be an issue it's hard to tell.

I have my HD TV, Satellite box, Wireless Router, Tuner, computer etc are all in the same 10 square foot area.

I have two external USB hard drives, USB key board, USB Mouse, USB scanner, and USB printer all plugged directly into the computer no external hub. I also have HDMI cables running to the TV from the computer. Add to that speaker cables speaker power supply etc and there are wires every where.

I keep wondering about the wireless router which sits right behind my monitor but I've never heard of anyone having problems with interference from them. But if it starts acting up again I could try and move it farther from the computer.

Mike

 

[goombawaho]

You gotta have a grudge to post that many references. Still, I bet this is quite a rare phenomenon for most people in normal environments. Plus, the first link is for a manufacturer of "fancy" cables, so you KNOW they want to sell some of their cables.

There's such a thing as real world probability of seeing a certain condition/situation vs. theoretical possibilities. That's what I'm referring to - how likely is it that you would ever encounter this problem in a normal environment?

 

[tf1]

If you have a flat screen monitor and/or flat screen TV, then forget about EMI of RFI interference from them. They don't radiate either.

If it is RFI/EMI, then you need to be looking for 600,000 volt overhead pylons or high current underground cables VERY close by. Even a mobile phone mast on your roof provides less interference that a wireless network.

A microwave the other side of the wall might be more likely!

I still put my dollar on an application, game or utility with a memory leak.


Regards: Terry

 

[goombawaho]

^^^^ That's what I was thinking of if the OP's environment actually had a lot of EMI - something unusual and especially potent as opposed to a normal environment with radio/tv/cell phone/wifi waves bouncing around.

Those are just about EVERYWHERE

 

[tf1]

We'll all need plates in our heads to act as Faraday cages soon.


Regards: Terry

 

[BadBigBen]

Goom, naw 4 refs are by no means a grudge... ;-)

how likely is it that you would ever encounter this problem in a normal environment?

it is very unlikely, and it had had happened to me... I live in a 1 room flat, on one wall is all the equipment including the TV... the TV was a CRT model, old and beat up, and every time I switched it on, my PC went haywire, needless to say it has now been replaced by a TFT model...

the only problem I have now, is that once in a while when my 'handy' (also called a cellphone) rings it screws with the sound from the PC to the TV, even with shielded cables...



but it does sound more and more like a compatibility problem, at the moment...




Ben
"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."
How to ask a question, when posting them to a professional forum.
Only ask questions with yes/no answers if you want "yes" or "no"

 

[goombawaho]

Ok, wow. I meant that you must have a grudge against EMI - sounds like you do for a good reason. You're body must be practically baking in waves of various wavelengths.

 

[Nocandu]

Hi again.

So far so good, I have had only an occasional glitch but no sustained problem since reinstalling everything.

I did uninstall my Logitech mouse and reinstall my Razor with the latest drivers and software.

Funny that the Razor mouse always shows up under USB devices instead of under mouse in Device Manage.

Mike