Extra Work 1

[SpiderBear6]

Hi all,

I have been working for the same IT company for around 7 years now. Recently a relative of mine wanted me to write an app for them (and their company - which is not an IT company in any way). At that stage, I had not done anything in the language I wrote (am writing) the app in or received any training in the language (I still haven't received any training - although they paid for me to sit and pass an exam towards a certification) from the company I am actually employed with. I have started doing a little bit of stuff in the language for my employer and that is basicaly based on my personal studies and the experienced I have gained from doing my relative's app. I agreed to do the app for the relative because I thought it would be a good way to learn the new language. It was.

My problem is that I have since looked at my employment contract with the company I am employed with and found a clause which states that anything I develop or invent (blah blah) as part of my employment is the property of my employer. My employer knows that I am dabbling a bit in the new language on various little projects in my own time.

The app for my relative is drawing to completion and my relative is going to start selling it and I am a bit concerned about my rights and the power my employer has over me. So far I have not been paid anything for writing the app for my relative (basically been a learning experience for me) but in the further if the app starts selling, then I might be getting paid something towards it.

I realise I should talk to a solicitor about the contract and I probably will but I don't want to start any trouble with my employer. Anyone have any words of advice?

Thanks

 

[dwarfthrower]

Did you write the application for your relative on company time or equipment? Or use software that the company had provided to you?

If so you might be in a pickle. Otherwise, If you wrote the app for your relative on your own time, on your own pc using software you paid for. It's not an intellectual property pickle you will face. The company may decide to go after you for 'moonlighting' if that is forbidden.

_{Never be afraid to share your dreams with the world.
There's nothing the world loves more than the taste of really sweet dreams.}

 

[SpiderBear6]

My relative's app was written in my time (but what is my time - I wonder) and my relative's company bought the development software so that it was all legal and about board. I have had other people say that while I am employeed , anything I do whether it is in my own time or not, my employer owns it. But that seems a bit unfair. My relative is not a client of my employer (and will never be). What exactly do you mean by 'moonlighting'? Thanks for replying BTW dwarfthrower. I am really concerned about this.

 

[dwarfthrower]

The company owns the time they pay you for. It's as simple as that. They could no more lay claim to a piece of software that you wrote in your spare time than they could lay claim to your rose bushes or stamp collection. I don't think you have anything to worry about in that respect.

What I would be concerned about is your employer viewing what you've done as working in competition with them. It will depend entirely on what is specified in your contract. But most employers these days try to prevent their employees from directly competing with them. However if there is enough grey area between what you do for your employer and what you did for your relative I wouldn't worry too much about that either.

However, if you're really concerned, have a chat to a solicitor.

_{Never be afraid to share your dreams with the world.
There's nothing the world loves more than the taste of really sweet dreams.}

 

[SpiderBear6]

Thanks dwarfthrower... I feel a little bit safer now... but I will be talking to a solicitor just to be sure.

 

[Krickles]

I am not an attorney, but do feel a company will have a difficult time taking profit from you for a side development project. Most likely this won't even be an issue unless the app really takes off and begins making loads of money. Then, you may run into some legal issues.

Who paid for your cert exam? That may be an issue if it is your current employer and you haven't adequately documented your timeline for learning the language and developing the program.

Back to dwarfthrower's first question: whose equipment was used? If the company's, they own it no matter what efforts you put in 'off the clock.' If it's your system, the ability of the company to claim your creative efforts on the side is almost null.

 

[SpiderBear6]

Thanks for replying Krickles.

"Most likely this won't even be an issue unless the app really takes off and begins making loads of money."
Probably not, but I think the app has the potential to make quite a bit. Not that I am probably going to see much of it.

My employer (not my relative) paid for the cert exam. They never send me on training courses. Whenever I ask to go on one, I get told that the "big man" isn't authorising any at the moment. (Why the top dude of a large company is actually still authorising individual employee training I will never know) When I first joined the company, they were supposed to give me two weeks training a year. That somehow got changed to include on the job training and now they don't seem to want to give their employees any training (unless of course they can't find anything else for them to do and want to make them profitable again)

"That may be an issue if it is your current employer and you haven't adequately documented your timeline for learning the language and developing the program."
The language is the next logical step for me. I'm not sure what you mean by "documented your timeline".

The app was definitely developed on my systemm at home. But how would you prove that?

It's a bit of a grey area and I don't want to bring it up with my employer because they might start to think I am up to something (which I'm not).

 

[dwarfthrower]

"The app was definitely developed on my systemm at home. But how would you prove that?"

Just keep all the source you have on your home machine. The onus would be for the company to somehow prove that the app was developed on their systems. If there were source files etc on their systems then they might have a sniff. If everything is on your home PC there is no way for them to even conceive that the app was developed on their machines.

_{Never be afraid to share your dreams with the world.
There's nothing the world loves more than the taste of really sweet dreams.}

 

[dilettante]

Lots of employers now require "supplemental income" filings from their employees.

Generally this is to ensure there isn't a conflict of interest (working for a competitor), or a contractor they have hired (don't want to pay you twice), or directly for a client (don't want you undermining their contracts).

 

[jimoo]

I have a little different spin. If your company has such an agreement with you, and you value your primary job. I suggest you be honest with them and let them know what you are doing. If they are okay with it, document the new arrangement. Otherwise, your current company could have grounds to terminate you because you violated the agreement.



Jim Osieczonek
Delta Business Group, LLC

http://www.deltabg.com

 

[Krickles]

"documenting your timeline"

Have you kept records of when you have done certain tasks related to your development of this app and your education? Do you keep appointments in a calendar system of any type? Have you noted when you began development, have copies of emails, datetime stamps on initial work you performed?

Information such as this will help prove you performed work on your time.

 

[SpiderBear6]

No Krickles, I haven't documented my timeline because it's all been fairly informal - I haven't been paid a brass razu to doing the development. Sometimes I think my relative is taking advantage of me but I guess I'm the nut who keeps doing the work.