Dress Codes for work

[BJCooperIT]

As a consultant I have sometimes encountered difficulty adhering to my consulting firm's dress code. My company wants me to appear professional at all times. This means no jeans or sneakers, preferably business suits and dress shoes.

This can be a problem at a client site that is casual. My case in point is my current contract. I sit at a desk that is right in the middle of a laboratory. The people here have a standard to wear pants and long sleeve tops. This translates to jeans/slacks along with simple shirts, mostly older clothes so that the loss of an article of clothing is not a big deal if a chemical is spilled.

Enter me. Suit jacket, silk top, dress slacks, jewelry, perfume, etc. Eyebrows are raised and the first thought they have is "Who is she trying to impress?" Thereafter follows resentment. If I need to have these folks on my side it is a bad start. Some consulting firms allow you the option of dressing at the level of your clients, but some do not. Has anyone else encountered this problem?
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[sleipnir214]

algernonsidney:

Don't get your knickers in a twist. You weren't the butt of the joke -- your specific use of masculine pronouns just gave me a opening to insert a little humor.


I'm confused by the second sentence in your post, so let me see if I understand everything. Repeated prostitution references are in, humor is out. Right? Want the best answers? Ask the best questions:

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[devious05]

algernonsidney:
Actually, I wasn't using the wrong gender of pronoun. It is considered standard to use the male if one does not know.

Does anyone else consider that just a little bit sexist?
I have not come across that standard anywhere, especially not in todays society.

 

[BJCooperIT]

"Does anyone else consider that just a little bit sexist?"

Yes, I agree it is somewhat sexist in this day and age. I hope this is not the standard because it would be a step backwards from the "He/She" days. But having been in this business for over 30 years, I have come to expect it and try not to be insulted. IMHO it is better to be gender non-specific when unsure. For example, I would have said:

I know very little about BJCooper, and I was not intending to make a judgment. This person is in an obviously difficult situation.

Oh, by the way...I actually wore tennis shoes to work! I could get used to this.


(select * from life where brain is not null)
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[sleipnir214]

<sarcasm>
Paraphrases from two lines from two movies (extra points for those who know both movies' titles):

I'm shocked! SHOCKED!! To discover that tennis shoes are being worn here!

-and-

How are going to keep her down on the farm after she's seen Paree?
</sarcasm>


If you want to see some consternation, you should come to my office when I wear my kilt to work.

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[BJCooperIT]

Just the thought!

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[flapeyre]

Just my $.02..

When the masculine pronouns are used, I assume the person referred to is a male. I tend to used neutral collective pronouns (&quot;they&quot when the person's sex is unclear from the context. That wasn't always the case; I remember when the male pronouns were used (especially when referring to children).

However, it is sometimes better to be (a little) grammatically incorrect than politically incorrect. So I yield to the logic of the situation; once you get stung, you give the beehive a wide berth.

OK, now that that's over with..

I have worked on all scales of the dress code spectrum. I worked for that very large company (in)famous for requiring its male employees to wear white shirts and ties (that requirement did not, as of 1990, exist; it only required a &quot;businesslike appearence&quot; I worked as a programmer in an office located in a warehouse - I never had public contact, but was still expected to dress up (even in 90+ F degree summer weather, with 90%+ humidity). I was glad they moved the office about 10 minutes from the house (the warehouse was a 50 minute commute), and at the same time, they went casual. Unfortunately, I was laid off severl months later. My current job is casual (but no jeans or tennis shoes - we don't have &quot;casual days&quot; when those can be worn ).

We have a consultant who has been here on a semi-permanent basis for several years. He tends to dress up just a little from the rest of us (dress shirt with open collar vs. golf/Polo shirts for the rest of us). The other places he consults require a tie, and he keeps one in the car.





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--Leonardo da Vinci

 

[DaPi]

&quot;Suit jacket, silk top, dress slacks, jewelry, perfume, etc&quot; to me, an average lascivious male, this sounds great!

I'm not a consultant, but after 2 take-overs in 3 years I've had a lot of experience of having to plunge into unknown waters. &quot;Smart but BORING&quot; is my standard for a first meeting (I've a suit that I reserve for meeting top management and going to funerals) - from there you can go either way when you have the temperature of the water.

Obviously you will have to compromise - e.g. in summer I don't wear jacket & tie to come to work, but keep one of each at the office just in case (don't know how that translates into feminine attire).

DaPi - no silver bullet

 

[palbano]

&quot;Suit jacket, silk top, dress slacks, jewelry, perfume, etc&quot;

I would have been in this thread a long time ago if i'd known what was going on in here. LOL BJCooperIT, you have a picture of that on a web site we can see?

-pete

 

[BJCooperIT]

Sorry, my personal web-site has pictures of:

My 4 kids - ages 19-23, including twins
My 3 dogs - a rescued greyhound & two lab mixes

but not me!

OK...sigh...back to the subject of dress codes:
Does anyone have a strong opinion on uniforms for IT staff? There are a lot of pros and cons that I can think of...

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[sleipnir214]

BJCooperIT:
Good answer!



Uniforms?

Who pays for them? Will the company pay to clean them, or will I have to pay out of pocket and deduct cleaning expenses from my taxes later? Who pays to replace worn items, the employer or the employee? Will I have to change from my civvies to the uniform if I have to go on a call after-hours?

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[palbano]

Uniforms, yeah how about orange jump suits?

Now that would be a serious moral booster LOL

-pete

 

[KornGeek]

My personal opinion of what IT staff should wear is go for comfortable. Shield these people away from customers, let them dress in T-Shirts and jeans, and stay out of their way. The comfortable clothing becomes almost a necessity when they work insane hours.

I know there are many good reasons for expecting more professional dress, but the above is my personal opinion of how it should be.

 

[BJCooperIT]

I only ask because my husband wears uniforms (in a blue-collar capacity) and it puts everyone on a level playing field, so to speak. Everyone looks neat and professional, and no one looks out of place.

palbano
In some environments black and white horizontal stripes might be more appropriate!

sleipnir214
&quot;Who pays for them? Will the company pay to clean them, or will I have to pay out of pocket and deduct cleaning expenses from my taxes later? Who pays to replace worn items, the employer or the employee? Will I have to change from my civvies to the uniform if I have to go on a call after-hours?&quot;
I imagine who would pay would depend on where you work. My husband's former employer provided his uniforms and it worked great. He was on 24/7 call and after hours wore whatever he had on which was OK as long as he had his badge. His current employer provides shirts and he prefers to wear jeans with them. I imagine if we bought work pants we could take it as a tax deduction as long as we could document it was a requirement of the job.

Where I used to live in Virginia there was much controversy over uniforms in public schools. My kids hated the idea but, personally I would have welcomed it. No more whiney requests for designer jeans and $100 sneakers! Seems to me the idea has merit for work as white-collar work as well.

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[KornGeek]

I'm sorry, I interpreted the word &quot;uniforms&quot; way too loosely.

Because of the individualistic nature of most people in the IT industry, I don't think uniforms would ever go over well.

Then again, I've been wrong before. (Once or twice, but that's all I'll admit to.)

 

[sleipnir214]

I dunno, I kinda liked the Army can't-see-me suit -- it was durable, comfortable, and had enough pockets for my purposes. But there's a difference between uniformity and regimentation.


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[DonQuichote]

BJCooperIT,

I don't think a uniform would work in your case, as you will probably have to visit many different companies and environments. From the clean laboratories to machine workshops. Or even outdoor environments, like construction sites. I think there are not that much uniforms that &quot;suit&quot; them all.

Best regards

 

[manarth]

to go back a week:
devious05 (TechnicalUser) Apr 13, 2003
algernonsidney:
Actually, I wasn't using the wrong gender of pronoun. It is considered standard to use the male if one does not know.

Does anyone else consider that just a little bit sexist?
I have not come across that standard anywhere, especially not in todays society.


sorry - I know I'm a bit off-topic, but here's my 2 cents (to sense? non-cents?) as usual feel free to fly the flag if I'm too off kilter...

In most languages which use gendered nouns (French, Spanish, German...) where there is both male and female, the male gender is assumed. Likewise, if the gender is unknown, the male is assumed.
However, this is purely the grammer rules of the languages - is it sexist? answers on a post card to: forum717...

As for the dress codes, what if the dress code insists females wear skirts/dresses and males wear trousers? If a guy met the dress code - but it was the female's dress code, how much action could the company take I wonder?


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[CajunCenturion]

The standard of using the male gender by default is old and no longer in vogue. By today's standards, it is considered sexist, and is not politically correct. It can be awkward sometimes, but it can't hurt to take the time to be sensitive to the feelings of others. Most won't notice either way, but why risk offending anyone without good reason. As we all aware, perception is far more important than reality, why would someone want to be perceived as sexist and/or insensitive, especially if weren't true.

BTW: I was going to use the old phrase &quot;Perception is 90% of reality&quot;, but I can't find an appropriate reference, and certainly don't want to be guilty of one of my own pet peeves.

With respect to the dress code, I think any action that the company took would be shot down, because IMHO, the dress code itself would be considered discriminatory since it has different and separate rules for males and females.

For the most part, you find dress codes identified in a non gender specific way. Formal, Semi-Formal, Business Casual, Casual, etc.

Good Luck
--------------
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[jtb]

Personally, I find the mention of words like &quot;racist&quot;, &quot;sexist&quot;, &quot;homophobe&quot;, and other emotional pejoratives to be red herrings strewn about by those who can't perform according to their job description. At least in the United States. YMMV.

I am not denying that coal miners needed a union 100 years ago or that there are injustices left to correct.

Granted that such problems have existed, do exist, and will continue to exist around the world. For example, Saudi women by law cannot drive. Non-Ndebele people are discouraged from owning farms in Zimbabwe, holding passports, or complaining about their &quot;rights&quot; being taken away.

However, I think that given the number of typos and misspelled words in these forums, giving each other the benefit of the doubt would be of more benefit in the long run.

Please note: If you work with me and use those &quot;angry words&quot; about a coworker, your own work better be sans pareil and well-documented--or you'll be looking to complain about coworkers at your next posting... We do not tolerate troublemakers who can't pull their own weight.



JTB
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[sleipnir214]

jtb:
Dude, did you post in the wrong thread?

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