Death of my CD Burner?

[LFI]

Pardon me if there's a better forum for this. I didn't know if this was considered a peripheral question or a Windows-based question, etc. Due to the potential for being an OS-question, I have asked a similarly worded Q on the Windows XP Professional forum.

I'm a sound designer for local theatre companies here and I'm used to using Windows Media Player (V.10, Windows XP Pro) to rip tracks off CDs and make MP3's out of them. All has been going swimmingly for a long time.

All of the sudden, the MP3's started having a LOT of static in them, repeating regularly through the recording like: Cha-Cha-Cha-Cha...

I tried cleaning the disc (I have some solution and a hand-crank-style cleaner from Radio Shack) and the CD-drive (using a CD that has these tiny little brushed on them). Neither seemed to work.

Is this the sign of the imminent death of that drive or is there something I'm missing? I looked for Media Player updates and XP Pro updates and I'm current on all of that.

Any ideas on what might be causing this? I'm prepared to believe that my efforts to clean the disc and the drive were both unsatisfactory and that I need a better cleaner or a new drive. Is there a surefire way to clean those things or to measure their cleanliness?

It might bear noting that the CDs sound absolutely fine in my car, but once I play them back on my computer, I'm beginning to think I can hear the cha-cha-cha in the playback. It might not be consistent and it's certainly faint. This implies "dirt" to me, but I want to see what y'all had to say about it.

Thanks!

Dave


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O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[BadBigBen]

Could be, dirt, or could be drive on it's way out...

or more likely it has some sort of Protection scheme (if you are talking about a Commercial CD)...

Ben

"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."

 

[LFI]

Well, most of the CDs I've tried this on are older, so I don't think they have protection on them. They sound fine in my car, so I don't think it's that they're scratched up... but maybe there's a difference in what we hear on the audible scale and the actually copying of 0's and 1's when making an MP3 that makes scratches stand out.

It's just weird that this just started happening and it happened on two discs in a row. If I wasn't so tired last night, I would have tested further (and will continue to do so this weekend).

Thanks for the input. If you recommend any particular brand of CD or Drive cleaner, I'd love to hear'em!

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[Cindy1]

Have you tested your speakers on another device? It's probably your drive so I think your going to have to suck it up and buy a new one. If you live in the Boston area I will install it he he he (for a fee).

Cindy

 

[LFI]

I suppose it could just be the speakers. Maybe I blew them out or something.

Thanks for the idea!

The troubleshooting continues...

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[firewolfrl]

Ok first...Need your system specs???


Second... Your burning problem could be unrelated to the CDRW burner issue. this could be a chipset issue or sound card issue.

you may get pissed if you change the optical drive and find you still have the same symptoms...LOL ...Test ...test...test.

What is new in your system...new software...new hardware...new USB device????

Are the MP3's making this noise when being played from the hard drive?(not the made CD) Do .wav files make that noise too?
Do the burned CD's make this noise in another computer?
Try burning software such as AudioGrabber and Nero to make the MP3's and put them on disk.

The Nvidia 2 chipset had issues and related symptoms that you discribe. SoundBlaster Live/Audigy cards can confict with chipsets too.


good luck

 

[BadBigBen]

...also make sure that DMA is turned on for the Burner (Device Manager, Primary or secondary IDE Chanel)...

Ben

"If it works don't fix it! If it doesn't use a sledgehammer..."

 

[LFI]

This is all great stuff, thanks! firewolfrl, I will definitely heed your advice to test further before I jump to replacing the drive. I'm just back from the weekend and I'm going to dive into this issue tonight. BadBigBen and Cindy1, I made a list of your recommendations too.

I'll post my trouble-shooting path and the eventual solution when I know it (assuming I find it).

Thanks again for taking the time.

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[LFI]

Status:

I am not through with my complete round of testing, but here is an update:

(1) Tried ripping from one of MY CDs (as opposed to library CD) and rip was fine. Trial size: just 1 track.
(2) Tried ripping from library CD and got Cha-Cha-Cha
(3) Realized I have been using CD cleaner wrong <blush> and Cha-Cha-Cha may have become cha-cha-cha. Hard to tell.
(4) Upgraded to Windows Media Play, V. 10 on laptop and ALL rips there are fine!

So, there's more testing to go, but now I'm wondering if that tiny metallic strip along the top of library CDs (that keeps you from walking out with them without checking them out) is affecting the drive somehow.

I haven't ruled out anything you all have suggested. It's just slow-going because of time commitments. Hopefully I'll be able to determine for sure what the matter is with my desktop computer. When I do, I'll post it here.

Thanks again!

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[firewolfrl]

Just so you know ripping from a library CD is illegal in the fact you don't own it. you can make legal copies of your OWN Cd. But, the way the world is nowdays you can rip and burn anything and the Movie & Music Industry go after you. its too bad the laws out there are not to protect you from the Movie & Music Industry.

My advice ...buy the CD you want to record or don't post in a public forum that you are recording a CD that you don't own....LOL....just reword what you got to say.

 

[cdogg]

...but now I'm wondering if that tiny metallic strip along the top of library CDs...is affecting the drive somehow.

Yes, actually it can have a big impact. An audio CD is played at roughly 1.5x. At this speed, the metallic strip probably doesn't do any harm. On the other hand, when you rip a CD, it can easily get to 16x and beyond. The slightest uneven weight distribution across the CD will throw it off balance during rotation.

I'm not sure how this would directly impact the ripping process, but certainly could cause damage or destruction to the CD. I don't see what other difference there would be between your CD's and library CD's.

However, on that note, I wouldn't think it's a good ethic to try to rip music from a library CD that you don't own...

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884

 

[LFI]

Just so there's no misunderstanding...

The first time I experienced my Cha-Cha-Cha problem was with a CD that is part of a sound library that I purchased and have the rights to use in my theatrical sound designs. Once I experienced the problem, I began grabbing different CDs to see if the problem was across the board or not. I lost sight of the origin of my problem as the Cha-Cha-Cha-ing grew worse and I posted here. I guess those metallic strips might contribute, but they cannot be the sole problem since the problem first arose on my personal CD. The one track that I ripped successfully yesterday may have been a fluke. I think the problem is intermittant (more evidence, I think, for dirt moving on and off of the lens). I did try blasting compressed air into the drive, but to no avail. I might have to open up and give it all a good air-cleaning.

In sum, I was only ripping the library CDs as part of my trouble-shooting process. I focused on them yesterday because it just so happened that a personal disc I tried tested fine and a library CD tested poorly. As I mentioned, I did very few tests yesterday.

Anyway, thanks for giving me a chance to clear that up. I am in the same camp you are on that. I have several friends who are musicians and, as a result, I'm actually acutely sensitive to this topic.

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[cdogg]

Good deal.

As for the "intermittent" part, do you know if it occurs at the exact same spot every time you play back a track that experiences this problem?

It is my understanding that the utility would error out or make multiple attempts to re-read a spot on the CD that was having issues during the rip process.

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884

 

[LFI]

Actually, I don't think it does. Let me double check that, but I'm pretty sure it sounds a little different each time.

What I really need is to sit down and trouble-shoot for a couple of hours and try a bunch of different things (I've created a list of test-cases to try). These past few days, I don't seem to be able to even GET TO my computer until very late at night and, then, I'm pretty tired, so maybe, in addition to doing some regular surfing and reading e-mails, I'll try one or two things. Not the best way to solve my problem.

Here is my trouble-shooting list (not necessarily "in order"):

Speakers:
- Do previous rips/recordings make this sound now (where they didn't before)?
- Test speakers on another device (transfer "bad" MP3 and speakers to my laptop... maybe it's not the MP3 afterall!)
Software:
- Try ExactAudioCopy, AudioGrabber, and Nero to see if they make better rips
- Make sure DMA is turned on
Sound Medium:
- Try a bunch of CDs to see if the problem is "across the board"
- Investigate: does it occur at the same spot on the same tracks each time, or does the Cha-Cha-Cha seem more random?
Physical:
- Open'er up and clean out any/all dust
Hardware:
- last: replace drive (CD burner)

In addition:
Recording Format:
- Investigate flac formats (probably not directly attributable to this situation, but made it onto the list anyway)

Thanks for your interest. If you can think of other tests I should try/things I should investigate, feel free to let me know. I'll let you know what I discover!

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!

 

[cdogg]

OK, well I can tell you that if the skipping/pause doesn't occur in the same place every time in the file, then the ripping process is not the problem. Instead, you have a playback issue, in which case I would troubleshoot the playback software and system resources.

~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884

 

[firewolfrl]

does the noise happen if you play the mp3 disk on any other computer?

 

[LFI]

Alas, I had to go to rehearsal last night and I didn't get back until it was quite late. Too tired then to test.

I have not tried to transfer one of these affected MP3's to another computer yet. I'll add that to my testing process.

No rehearsal tonight. Perhaps I will conquer this issue finally (after watching "Lost"!).

Dave


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
O Time, Strength, Cash, and Patience!