I am working for a company as a administrator. I handle all communications for 4 major locations w/systems and 9 minor locations. I have no help. I am on call 24/7. I do not get paid any extra for time spent over 40 hours a week. I am on salary and make less than $30,000. I have about 4 months to have 2 years in this job. Any suggestions.
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Dead End Career
- Thread starter USAT
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What is the position of your supervisor on this? It sounds to me like you are very underpaid. List your duties and compare that the job desctiptions given on the major salary survey sites. Use that and your location to get an idea of your market worth. Keep in mind that some surveys are overblown and that every situation is unique. You should get a idea though.
With some of that infomation you could make a case at your next review if mgmt. is open to discussion. Be careful though. In bad environments people have been let go simply for asking. If your management is reasonable they should at least be open to discussion and you might have a chance to make some progress. If they are not open to discussion, you may want to look into opportunies elsewhere.
There are links to salray surveys elsewhere in this forum, but your best starting point is probably a Google search on "Salary Survey".
Jeff
I haven't lost my mind - I know it's backed up on tape somewhere ....
With some of that infomation you could make a case at your next review if mgmt. is open to discussion. Be careful though. In bad environments people have been let go simply for asking. If your management is reasonable they should at least be open to discussion and you might have a chance to make some progress. If they are not open to discussion, you may want to look into opportunies elsewhere.
There are links to salray surveys elsewhere in this forum, but your best starting point is probably a Google search on "Salary Survey".
Jeff
I haven't lost my mind - I know it's backed up on tape somewhere ....
- Thread starter
- #3
I have been kind of worried about asking, because they have let quite a few people go lately due to cost of operation. I am afraid if I mention it, I might be next. I guess I need to take a look at other job possibilities. I have looked at salary surveys for my area and $36,000 is the lowest on the pay scale. I do not even make the lowest on the payscale. I guess it is time to start looking at other options. Thank you.
I agree with Jeff.
I thought sweat shops like this only existed in manufacturing.
It could be argued that the best thing to happen to you would to be let go (although it will not feel like it if this happens).
TO give you piece of mind. The few times I have been asked to leave a company, I have ended up with a two to six week unpaid vacation and ended up getting a position with better conditions, more opportunities, and usually more money and benefits. So in the long run it worked out well for me.
In the mean time, you might want to think about where you would like to take your career. Start taking classes, thinkng about getting a cert (As a frustrated Boy Scout wannabe in my younger days, I am a great believer in certifications, like merit badges ).
Being in management / administration is risky because you are required to hone soft skills at the expense of hard skills. So one cuts are made, those with the soft skills are usually the first ones to go.
G' Luck
pivan
In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?
Just do it!!
I thought sweat shops like this only existed in manufacturing.
It could be argued that the best thing to happen to you would to be let go (although it will not feel like it if this happens).
TO give you piece of mind. The few times I have been asked to leave a company, I have ended up with a two to six week unpaid vacation and ended up getting a position with better conditions, more opportunities, and usually more money and benefits. So in the long run it worked out well for me.
In the mean time, you might want to think about where you would like to take your career. Start taking classes, thinkng about getting a cert (As a frustrated Boy Scout wannabe in my younger days, I am a great believer in certifications, like merit badges ).
Being in management / administration is risky because you are required to hone soft skills at the expense of hard skills. So one cuts are made, those with the soft skills are usually the first ones to go.
G' Luck
pivan
In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?
Just do it!!
- Thread starter
- #5
Thank you for the encouragement in this area. I am going to look at this as a chance to make a positive move, either within the company or with another company. pivan this pep talk was part of what I needed. I kind of felt this way, but needed someone else to say the same thing. Thanks. Here I go.
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WHY do people think they're underpaid??
WHY do people think they do special work??
WHY do people think they do more then their colleges??
WHY do people think they'r important in their work??
WHY do people think they know so much??
WHERE's that piece of commitment to the company we all have????
only after two years of experience????
WAKE UP!!!
$30000 IS OVER AVERAGE!!
If you don't like your work, go work in a factory and screw a nut on a Chrysler. THAT's important and responsible work too.
Greetings,
Allen Mc Pherson
Sr. DataBaseAdministrator (Large Bank)
WHY do people think they do special work??
WHY do people think they do more then their colleges??
WHY do people think they'r important in their work??
WHY do people think they know so much??
WHERE's that piece of commitment to the company we all have????
only after two years of experience????
WAKE UP!!!
$30000 IS OVER AVERAGE!!
If you don't like your work, go work in a factory and screw a nut on a Chrysler. THAT's important and responsible work too.
Greetings,
Allen Mc Pherson
Sr. DataBaseAdministrator (Large Bank)
MasterRacker
New member
Of course it is, but it doesn't require the same skill set and years of hard work to acquire the knowledge necessary to do it. The reaponsibility level and stress are not the same either. Just about any job is important. It takes all of them to run a society. The difference is that some jobs really are "special". Not just anyone can do them even with training and not everyone is even capable of being trained on some fields. (I could study all I wanted but never be someone you would want to trust as a surgeon.)
Compensation has to reach certain levels to attract those that can do certain types of work. And then within a certain field, those who measurably outperform their collegues deserve more.
In this particicular case, if USAT is competent, s/he is grossly underpaid. In the technical and scientific and artistic fields (at least) people are NOT interchangeable.
Jeff
I haven't lost my mind - I know it's backed up on tape somewhere ....
Compensation has to reach certain levels to attract those that can do certain types of work. And then within a certain field, those who measurably outperform their collegues deserve more.
In this particicular case, if USAT is competent, s/he is grossly underpaid. In the technical and scientific and artistic fields (at least) people are NOT interchangeable.
Jeff
I haven't lost my mind - I know it's backed up on tape somewhere ....
I agree with Jeff as wel as Allen.
Two years of experience is not a lot. If USAD skills are over average, he deserves more. But, in comparison with who??? The problem is that he cannot compare his skills whith someone else. So he might even be payed too much!
My advice:
Take some classes in your profession and after finishing, ask for a raise. Be sure your employer pays the classes.
or
Apply for another job. Your employer don't need to know. If it's better, just leave.
Greetings,
M. BigMag, The Netherlands.
someone@euronet.nl (no kidding!)
Two years of experience is not a lot. If USAD skills are over average, he deserves more. But, in comparison with who??? The problem is that he cannot compare his skills whith someone else. So he might even be payed too much!
My advice:
Take some classes in your profession and after finishing, ask for a raise. Be sure your employer pays the classes.
or
Apply for another job. Your employer don't need to know. If it's better, just leave.
Greetings,
M. BigMag, The Netherlands.
someone@euronet.nl (no kidding!)
Based on what USAT has told us, it's hard to say whether s/he is getting a decent deal or not. While we don't have an exact salary figure ("less than $30,000"
, I will assume that since people tend to go in increments of $5,000 when giving approximate salaries that s/he is making somewhere between $25K and $30K. With LESS than two year's experience, this is probably about what is to be expected. I believe this is the phase we normally label "paying your dues".
Also, the statement "I do not get paid any extra for time spent over 40 hours a week." doesn't strike me as too draconian - YOU'RE ON A SALARY! That's the other side of salaries - you don't get paid less if you miss some time here and there - but you also don't get paid more for extra time here and there. If they mentioned the 24/7 aspect of the job, or even indicated that you might have to spend time outside of "normal" work hours and you accepted the position, you're just going to have to suck it up and learn from the experience.
Don't fall prey to the Tech Institute commercials and news stories about all of the people making $100K+ in the tech industry straight out of college. If it was commonplace, it wouldn't be in the news!
Unless you are under contract, you can always look for a new position. When you are getting ready to accept an offer, you might want to give your employer the opportunity to make a counteroffer - it might get you what you want without giving up seniority, benefits earned via longevity (vesting in 401(k), vacation, etc).
Finally, learn from your experience - you have the most leverage for getting what you want BEFORE you accept the job. After that, about all you have is the threat to leave - which, given the current level of layoffs in our industry, might not be much of a threat!
, I will assume that since people tend to go in increments of $5,000 when giving approximate salaries that s/he is making somewhere between $25K and $30K. With LESS than two year's experience, this is probably about what is to be expected. I believe this is the phase we normally label "paying your dues".Also, the statement "I do not get paid any extra for time spent over 40 hours a week." doesn't strike me as too draconian - YOU'RE ON A SALARY! That's the other side of salaries - you don't get paid less if you miss some time here and there - but you also don't get paid more for extra time here and there. If they mentioned the 24/7 aspect of the job, or even indicated that you might have to spend time outside of "normal" work hours and you accepted the position, you're just going to have to suck it up and learn from the experience.
Don't fall prey to the Tech Institute commercials and news stories about all of the people making $100K+ in the tech industry straight out of college. If it was commonplace, it wouldn't be in the news!
Unless you are under contract, you can always look for a new position. When you are getting ready to accept an offer, you might want to give your employer the opportunity to make a counteroffer - it might get you what you want without giving up seniority, benefits earned via longevity (vesting in 401(k), vacation, etc).
Finally, learn from your experience - you have the most leverage for getting what you want BEFORE you accept the job. After that, about all you have is the threat to leave - which, given the current level of layoffs in our industry, might not be much of a threat!
Gosh, WHY does Allen sound so upset?
USAT just may know what he is worth and wants to be compensated for it appropriately.
Commitment to a company want away (for me at any rate) after three lay-offs during the recession. I signed up for 40 hrs, I work 40 hours, I get paid for 40. I gave up doing the extra time for IT managers that didn't have the leadership skills to lead a parade or plan ahead farther then their coffee break.
We should start taking notes from our union brethern in the auto industry and requesting time and one half when working overtime. double time on sixth day or anything over 12 hours, triple time on seventh day or on holidays. These guys that screw nuts on at Chrysler make around $50,000/year and many a lot more.
Any of you folks up for forming an IT union?
Cheers,
pivan
In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?
Just do it!!
USAT just may know what he is worth and wants to be compensated for it appropriately.
Commitment to a company want away (for me at any rate) after three lay-offs during the recession. I signed up for 40 hrs, I work 40 hours, I get paid for 40. I gave up doing the extra time for IT managers that didn't have the leadership skills to lead a parade or plan ahead farther then their coffee break.
We should start taking notes from our union brethern in the auto industry and requesting time and one half when working overtime. double time on sixth day or anything over 12 hours, triple time on seventh day or on holidays. These guys that screw nuts on at Chrysler make around $50,000/year and many a lot more.
Any of you folks up for forming an IT union?
Cheers,
pivan
In not now, when?
If not here, where?
If not us, who?
Just do it!!
Nope. I used to be in the Teamsters and found that while my hourly wages WERE higher (by a thumping 25 cents!), they were real quick to come get your dues money but wouldn't do squat for you when you needed them. Now I avoid unions like the plague!
While the catch-phrase "loyalty is a two-way street" is tired, it is still true. If you want loyalty for your company, the company had better show loyalty to its employees. And since the industry generally seems to be disinclined to do so, is it any surprise that employees feel little or no loyalty to the company? It seems to be an ever-downward spiral - but when you DO find a company/manager that exhibits loyalty, you also find loyal employees with good morale. I know this is true - I've seen it!!
However, I've also noticed that employees' expectations currently tend to be that the company will NOT care about/for them and WILL throw them under the bus at the first sign of trouble. Consequently, it becomes incumbent upon the employer to try to show that this is NOT the case. As soon as employees figure out that maybe they ARE as important to the company as, say, a desk or PC you wind up with employees that don't mind working late to make their company "first to market" or "best of class"; they come up with better ways of making the company profitable; they really DO give a damn about the company and their manager; they ARE loyal! But until the company demonstrates loyalty, about the best they can hope for are employees who believe in giving an honest day's work for an honest day's pay.
Any employers out there listening?
While the catch-phrase "loyalty is a two-way street" is tired, it is still true. If you want loyalty for your company, the company had better show loyalty to its employees. And since the industry generally seems to be disinclined to do so, is it any surprise that employees feel little or no loyalty to the company? It seems to be an ever-downward spiral - but when you DO find a company/manager that exhibits loyalty, you also find loyal employees with good morale. I know this is true - I've seen it!!
However, I've also noticed that employees' expectations currently tend to be that the company will NOT care about/for them and WILL throw them under the bus at the first sign of trouble. Consequently, it becomes incumbent upon the employer to try to show that this is NOT the case. As soon as employees figure out that maybe they ARE as important to the company as, say, a desk or PC you wind up with employees that don't mind working late to make their company "first to market" or "best of class"; they come up with better ways of making the company profitable; they really DO give a damn about the company and their manager; they ARE loyal! But until the company demonstrates loyalty, about the best they can hope for are employees who believe in giving an honest day's work for an honest day's pay.
Any employers out there listening?
And yes, I know the purpose of the company is to make money, not make employees feel good about themselves. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about a give-and-take relationship between employer and employee which leads to a net gain for both parties.
Sorry for the rants - it's been a slow day!
Sorry for the rants - it's been a slow day!
Maybe USAT is in a better bargaining position than he thinks if he's the only one running the IT show there. With all those sites, the overtime, and the 24/7 paging, he's probably being taken advantage of, but it also sounds like they definitely need him. If he were to suddenly announce that he was leaving to take a job with more money, I wonder how quickly they would respond with a counteroffer. Regardless of his level of experience in IT, his compensation should be tied to how much his presence means to the company, and how much it would cost if they were to lose him.
John "Remember you are unique, just like everyone else"
John "Remember you are unique, just like everyone else"
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