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CCNA Exam Frustrations... 3

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Apr 8, 2008
5
CA
I passed my first CCNA in 2001, scoring in the high 900's, if I remember right. That was after going through the Cisco curriculum at the local college. Well, I took the Cert exam again today (it expired a while back) and I failed miserably.

I was more than a little irritated by this, as I'm currently in the middle of the CCNP coursework and I've been maintaining a 4.0 gpa. I figured I'd share my experience and hopefully have a few questions answered in the mean time...

my main question is... is there any way to skip a question and return to it later? The 'previous' button at the bottom of the page was ghosted out for me and so I assumed I was unable to leave the hard questions for later. As you're about to read, this caused me a whole lot of unnecessary stress.

in the first 15 questions, I think about 4 were labs and most others were focused on either frame relay or NAT... two areas that aren't exactly a forte of mine. My 11th question was, in a word, ridiculous. it was a sim question that looked like a collage put together by a kindergardner. It requires you to drag and drop network devices, links, and IP addresses into slots on the graphic, and then configure interfaces of the devices you place.

Had they just said "subnet these routers with this /28 and make it all pingable" it would have been no problem at all. 3 paragraphs worth of instruction did not make it any clearer, either, but only made the situation more frustrating.

The worst part were the arrows pointing from interfaces with IP's specified... after spending 10 minutes on this question I realized the numbers were not assigned to the interfaces they pointed from, but rather the far end interfaces... Of the provided drag-and-drop Ip's, none of them fell into the same /28 subnet. I ended up spending over 20 minutes on this one particular question... all because I had no idea how much it was worth and it seemed I would not be able to go back and answer it after attending to the easy questions.

This really made me mad because I've been through 1.5 years worth of cisco curriculum and I've never come across any question like this one. the format, the combination of drag/drop/configure, the required tasks themselves... it was completely foreign to me.

By this time, something else had occurred to me. I was on question 11, having already gone through 3 simulation questions...spending 5-20 minutes on each... as far as I knew I still had another 41 simulation questions to look forward to! At this point I only had about 30 minutes left and every time i looked at the clock, the subnet calculations I had written down all turned into meaningless jarble in my head.

I finally moved past the nightmare question, right or wrong, then was asked to configure NAT from memory on a router interface. What I'd like to know is how many CCNA jobs out there require you to know this? How many CCNP jobs, even? I know how to access information to do this but for crying out loud... from memory? dynamic NAT? Seemed a bit unnecessarily evil, to me.

So, the test sorta blurred at that point as I was trying to get through questions as quickly as possible after struggling through all the simulations. My nerves were a wreck, my patience was frayed, and I was furious because I knew I was going to fail. Answering endless sim questions seemed entirely futile.

Fortunately the latter half was a downhill slide, but even so, I think I was only on question 32 when I hit the 2 minute mark. THen I started guessing to get through it.

I ended with a 695. less than 15 points shy... There's no doubt in my mind had I been given another 15 minutes I would have passed. The last 20 or 30 questions were all multiple choice with maybe 1 nobrainer drag-and-drop. The ones I only needed 30 seconds to answer all came up after I had already run out of time.

I can't help but feel like I was cheated out of $150 with this exam. The only thing it tested was my ability to not suffer from a stress-related heart attack while trying to translate some sadist's idea of a good exam question.


So, here are my primary complaints about this CCNA exam:

1. the exam should start off with a brief description of how many questions of each variety you can expect and possibly even how much each type of question is worth.
2. simulations should be at the end of the exam
3. we should have the ability to go back to answer the tough ones later. Unless I'm stupid and just couldn't figure it out.
4. sim topology maps should make sense without having to compare 3 different router configs. Or at least the documented instructions should clarify the graphic...

Okay, I'll stop whining now. Of course I'm just mad right now and feel stupid for failing this exam. Had I not taken the 5 minutes to do the exam tutorial it's possible I could have gotten a passing grade that way, too.
 
I really think they have changed a lot in the past 2 years, I remember taking my CCNA and the only sim I had was based on setting up an ACL. rest of it was drag and drop, multiple choice, and maybe two somewhat sim questions where you figure out VTP and VLAN info.

But none the less... you will go back in a couple of weeks (more or less) and take it again and pass with flying colors!

Dallas, Texas
Telecommunications
CCNA, Net+
Working on MCSA, Convergence+, CCVP
 
Thanks, guys. I started the 3rd semester of CCNP last night and one of the other guys in my class had a similar experience to mine, failing the ccna his first time through. He's pretty sharp, so I don't feel quite so stupid anymore.

Thank you for the link, Burt. I'll take a gander. :) The help site my instructor gave me was worthless like a one legged horse.
 
sweetjimmy,

Don't worry - you will knock it out next time :)

No, you can not go back on a Cisco exam and yes most CCNA exams have 2 - 3 sims radomly placed in the mix. I had one lucky number 13 once!

I was lucky enough to meet the head of Cisco's CCNA exam team at a Cisco Networkers convention in San Diego several years ago. He had about 15-20 years experience (and his PHD) in the area of adult testing!

He explained how each and every question is looked at in detail and the data that is collected from the tests.

He also discussed some of the reasoning behind not being able to go back - on the CCNA it is almost impossible to come up with 55 questions where one does not answer another question!

He also said fraud, cheeting and security are HUGE reasons for many ways that things are done. He even said (would not say that Cisco does this) that you can pick most cheeters out based on the % of wrong answers in different areas of the exam. He said as an example - a person gets the extremely hard questions right 95% but gets the easier questions right 65% of the time. He said there is lots of science behind adult testing :) Like I said he could not confirm how much of it Cisco has him using!

Good luck!


E.A. Broda
CCNA, CCDA, CCAI, Network +
 
Thanks for the response, Ciscoguy... just wanted a little clarification on the lucky 13 comment, though. Do you mean you had 13 sim questions on 1 ccna exam?

If that's the case...gulp!

Well hopefully they review the question I struggled with and do something to make it a little more clear. My wife has a masters in education (not necessarily a phd, but still) and she seemed to agree that removing the ability to go back on a question for the sake of answering other questions is only a sample of poor test design. I agree with her, but the scale of the CCNA deployment is so large I guess they've got to do what they've got to do.

I still stand by my belief that the harder/longer questions should go at the end of the exam (just like they do in the cisco curriculum) so you at least have an opportunity to answer all the easy ones. But I'll shut up about it. I don't mean to whine or complain. :)

Thanks again!

 
sweetjimmy,

NO! It just happened to be the 13th question ! I had 2 sims both times I took the exam - most students that I have talked to who have taken it in the last year had 3 sims!


E.A. Broda
CCNA, CCDA, CCAI, Network +
 
I am currently attending the CCNA Network Academy and just took the ICND1 test. (Two test approach).. Several of us took this test and we all had one thing in common.. The sims/testlets and difficult questions came early... You absolutely have to pace yourself on these tests.. It really sounds like you semi beat yourself here.. Before I took this test I found everything I could pertaining to the layout.. IE. Knew approximately how much time to spend on a question (roughly 90 secs).. How many simulations/testlets to expect (2 -3).. And I knew that watching the tutorial did not penalize me in any way.. (Time does not start until after the tutorial when you click begin).. Also that I could not go back and answer questions and that i COULD use ? in the CLI... If you would have reseached the test that you were about to take then I am certain that you would have blew it away... just pretend that you bought a REALLY GOOD test prep and blow it away next week...

If you visit the CCNA Prep Center (Google it if you are unfamiliar) It's on the Cisco site and there is an exam tutorial interface that covers the various types of questions..

For anyone else about to recert.. Try one of the 31 days before the CCENT/CCNA books.. They are awesome and will let you know exactly where you need to place you refresher study time..

By the way... One of my classmates is still having nightmares about that /28 ip testlet that you were referring to.. He crashed and burned with that same question.. Just remember.. it's the CCNA NOT the CCNP.. They are looking for basics here.. I believe that people make that question too difficult and more importantly SPEND WAY TOO MUCH TIME ON IT!

Good Luck and hopefully I will be there with you on the CCNP track one day!
 
You're right mac. I know I would have passed had i not allowed the test to get to me. I have every confidence that I'll pass it next time. i did run through the tutorial and I thought it actually counted against my time, but I must have been wrong. Even my CCNP instructor seemed surprised that we can't go back on the questions, though.

next time i'll fire up the tutorial again and use that time to lay out a good subnet chart to ease the stress when those questions pop up. In the CCNP curriculum and labs everything is /24 because they assume you know how to break down a class C, but i find if i'm not continuously doing subnet exercises, the numbers all start running together. I need to just memorize it and be done with it.



 
Jimmy,

You said - " Even my CCNP instructor seemed surprised that we can't go back on the questions, though." this surpises me since the CCNP instructor should have taken at the very least 5 different Cisco exams and Cisco has never allowed you to mark/go back on a question.

When my students take tests and practice exams in the Cisco Network Academy - I always tell them NOT to go back on questions so that they get used to the way it will be on the "real" exam - most have thanked me for that advice!

If you are taking Cisco exams - it is just one of those things that make getting the cert just a little harder so everyone can not do it :)

Just some thoughts!


E.A. Broda
CCNA, CCDA, CCAI, Network +
 
Even my CCNP instructor seemed surprised that we can't go back on the questions, though."

You sure he was a CCNP???lol

Burt
 
I read that Cisco exams used to let you go back but no longer. Look at the bright side. The multiple choice questions did not tell you how many answers to choose in the old days but they do now (Used to say choose all that apply). I would prefer not to go back over that anytime. Either way you have the right attitude. The second best thing that you can do other than passing a cert exam is failing one. That way you know exactly where to place your time and energy.

I will avoid instructor bashing but one sound piece of advice would be to research everything test-related yourself and put it to public scrutiny. That is why I love forums/blogs. I posted a request for CCNP Lab info here and on a couple of other key forums and was well rewarded (I believe)! I was able to determine not only that I could go with the 2950 standard switches and save $100 each but also where to find some 3640 routers for only $99 each saving $100!!! (No face plates but who cares.. it's a lab) Waiting on them to show up now but found a comment about them on Wendell Odom's blog! Will post the link if I get them and all if good!

As far as subnetting goes... Check out this link...
It's a nice way for a real quick review and is possibly a better way to subnet for the CCNA level exam! (I will leave that up to you all!)

Later!
 
maczen

You said - "I read that Cisco exams used to let you go back but no longer", I passed the CCNA the first time in May of 2002 and you could not go back then.

I had my Cisco Academy "train the trainer" classes in 2001-2002 and all through the training we were told "you can not mark your answers and go back on a Cisco exam". Not sure when Cisco let you go back but it must have been more then 7-8 years ago!

I have taken 5 Cisco exams over the past 7 years and have never been able to mark a question or go back!

Point is that you can not go back or mark a question on a Cisco exam and have not been able to for many years :-(

I hope this settles it for any of those just starting to study and thinking they just "missed" an "easier" version of the exam!

Please cont. with what you were doing :) :)


E.A. Broda
CCNA, CCDA, CCAI, Network +
 
CiscoGuy33,
I am not sure when or if you were ever able to go back. (I am working on my CCNA after all)! LoL I merely stated that I "read somewhere" that Cisco exams used to let you go back.

I am providing an excerpt from....
CCNA
Cisco Certified Network Associate
Study Guide 6th Edition
by Todd Lammle - CCSI
ISBN# 978-0-470-11008-9
Page: xxx Introduction (Just before the assessment test before Chapter 1... Last bullet on the page)!

"You can no longer move forward and backward through the Cisco exams..."

So I guess you could go back at one point.. and that point must have been greater than 7-8 years ago... Great.. We all agree! Either way.. I still agree with my previous post.. I would much prefer to have the number of correct answers displayed as opposed to the ability to go back and second guess myself!!! I absolutely abhore "Choose all that apply" type questions... LoL

By the way, I apologize if I may have left the impression that fellow beginners missed an easier version of the exam! That was definitely not my intent. However, there was the introduction of IPv6, SDM, VPN's, Wireless and the various other new material that has been incorporated into the new exams since last November. Now that could possibly leave the impression that individuals just getting started could have possibly missed an easier version of the exam. The truth is that I don't know! I have only taken one exam and have no base for comparison.

Later All!
 
maczen,

I agree on the multi choice questions! I never saw a "Choose all that apply" type questions on a Cisco exam but friends who took MCSE exams said Microsoft "loved" them!!!

I did have a few fill in the blank where you had to type the answer like a command - these have been replaced by a "drag and drop" to "make" a command from several choices!

Without question all Cisco exams are getting harder - CCNAs are doing what CCNPs did a few years back and CCNPs are doing what CCIEs did!

As a Cisco Academy instructor - I AM GLAD IT IS GETTING HARDER! Too many people just want to get into it because they think they can make big bucks $$$$$ I hate when someone from another area such as health care or business asks me if they take the 4 Cisco classes and pass CCNA will they be hired as Sr Network Engineers making $100,000 a year like they were at their "old" job selling condos for 10 years :) I always ask back if they made $100,000 a year 10 years ago right out of the gate!

Just somt more thoughts!

E.A. Broda
CCNA, CCDA, CCAI, Network +
 
Yeah, I know what you mean CiscoGuy33... Albeit probably on a smaller scale. I initially wanted to program; however, I quickly found that I enjoyed networking more (although I still code)! Then I joined the military networking and troubleshooting various digital systems.. (On the aircraft)! Let me take a second to express that I would recommend this avenue to ANYONE just getting started. If you are young and considering the military and not sure how to get a quick start in life.. This is definitely one avenue of pursuit.. Just remember that A.. you will take from it what you put in.. and B.. Choose a technical profession... CTN, CTT, IT, AT, AE, ET etc.. OK.. Enough on that.. (By the way I am referring to U.S. Navy now... Can't speak for other branches or countries)...

That said, I can relate to your comment.. I have made it this far but have now decided to take the extra step and either cross to CTN in the Navy (and work with this type of equipment.. hopefully) or get out at the end of my current enlistment and work with this type of equipment.. hopefully.. LoL... Either way I will be far from $100,000 a year but I WILL be doing EXACTLY what I want in the long run and that is what matters... (You won't starve in networking though.. LoL)

I do have two brief questions for you though... I just got my two 3640 routers in.. They work great by the way! I was just wondering..
<b>
1. They have 12.2 IOS installed... How can I legally upgrade to 12.4 (They do support it)
2. They both came with an NM-1E2W module... When I run an "sh int" or "sh ip int brief" I only see the ethernet port not the wic... I have it in slot three on both so it shows e3/0...
</b>
BTW.. I am glad that the material is getting harder as well... The cert wouldn't mean anything if just anyone could study for a month and pass the test... It also forces you to go into various areas actually learning the material.. I've learned so much just researching which switches/routers to buy alone! (Almost bought the 32/8 3640's that don't support 12.4 IOS).. I'm at the point where I can do a good portion of route summarization in my head.. And the CLI is beginning to come second-nature (Although it has it's moments.. LoL) I have a long way to go but I would hate it if the cert didn't require me to have gained these skills because I may not have evolved so far! I have to admit... It felt good adding my first module to my router! LoL..

I absolutely love the way the Cisco exams are set up! CCENT, CCNA/CCDA, CCNP/CCDP, CCSI, CCIE.. the specialist exams.. You have so many options to progress and stay certified and it motivates you (not only to retain your current certs) but to cross train and learn even more.. Thus creating the well-rounded network tech! Other than the fact that I fell in love with the CLI.. this was one of the primary reasons I decided to go Cisco! So many options and cool certs.. like Cisco Certified Firewall Specialist! You are definitely right about the exams being harder.. I was watching a CBTNuggets video with one of my classmates and Jeremy Cioara said that he recently took the new exams just to test them out and he started with his chair leaned back and all relaxed.. He also said that by question five his chair was down and he was like man I can't fail this test.. LoL (He is CCIE and definitely knows what he is doing..like yourself.. so if the test gave him a scare..however briefly.. I can understand that it must be somewhat more difficult than it once was...

OK.. Enough of this book... Have a nice day all!
 
Well, the legality is a tricky deal. If the box will not be in production, then technically you can acquire the IOS in certain ways other than signing up for a hugely expensive SmartNet contract. Someone may give it to you, or I have even seen them sold on Ebay (and they still are) for around $30, which would include Cisco study material (very good). If THAT were illegal, Cisco lawyers would definitely have been on that! Trust me! A program that will help is IOSHunter. It's free, and their makers have never been taken to court.
As far as the NME slot---it's not a WIC---it's a two slot deal that plugs into the motherboard that two WICs can plug into...not sure what you're asking there...

Burt
 
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