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cat 6 cable with cat 5 ends
- Thread starter Fixin
- Start date
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
My first question is why would you spend the money on Cat 6 cable and then not use the proper connectors?
That said...if you use Cat 5 connectors on Cat 6 cable, you will theoretically have a Cat 5 system.
That desn't mean it won't work at Gigabit, but you certainly may find yourself having BER problems or problems maintaining such a connection.
Then again, depending on the quality of products installed, it may work with no discernable problems...
Lots of variables here, but again, why do this in the first place?
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
That said...if you use Cat 5 connectors on Cat 6 cable, you will theoretically have a Cat 5 system.
That desn't mean it won't work at Gigabit, but you certainly may find yourself having BER problems or problems maintaining such a connection.
Then again, depending on the quality of products installed, it may work with no discernable problems...
Lots of variables here, but again, why do this in the first place?
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
Hence my "theoretical" comment...it goes back to the weakest link theory.
It would not be Standards compliant if that is the real question.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
It would not be Standards compliant if that is the real question.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
WaitronUnit
IS-IT--Management
- Dec 2, 2003
- 38
Ditto to Servmatic... BTW, what's running across it? Is it something that now needs (or will need) GB capability? If you invest in the cable, do the same for the jacks, etc. The cost should not be a consideration if you've already planned to run 6.
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
If one were to be technical no.
Standards require you to use all components of the same category rating in a channel.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Standards require you to use all components of the same category rating in a channel.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
I thought that they were written so that it was the spec or better? (IE Cat5 jacks + Cat6 cable=Cat5 compliant). If not, what's the point of parts being backward compatible? Besides, isn't the sum of the parts more important anyway? Because when you put a tester on it, then what? The test automatically fails because one part is of different category rating than the rest?
For the example, take Cat5 jacks and Cat5e cable, and you've got one of the fancy testers that you can imput the actual manufacture of the parts. Then when tested, you pass Cat5 specs with flying colors (which would probably get you into Cat5e teritory, but that's beside the point). Is this test not a valid PASS because the parts aren't all the same rating? I wouldn't thinks so. If a variety of parts can't be standards compliant to the lowest common demoninator, then they've made themselves obsolete when upgrading the standard. The only standard which would be of any value would be the most current, and highest rated (performance wise).
Also to consider, is was standard you see the part as meeting? Is Berk-tek LANmark 2000 Category 6 cable, or is it just really good Cat5? The standards are just a minimum benchmark, hit this low bar and you pass.
Sorry, but Cat5 jacks and Cat5e cable not being standards compliant just doesn't make sense to me.
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
For the example, take Cat5 jacks and Cat5e cable, and you've got one of the fancy testers that you can imput the actual manufacture of the parts. Then when tested, you pass Cat5 specs with flying colors (which would probably get you into Cat5e teritory, but that's beside the point). Is this test not a valid PASS because the parts aren't all the same rating? I wouldn't thinks so. If a variety of parts can't be standards compliant to the lowest common demoninator, then they've made themselves obsolete when upgrading the standard. The only standard which would be of any value would be the most current, and highest rated (performance wise).
Also to consider, is was standard you see the part as meeting? Is Berk-tek LANmark 2000 Category 6 cable, or is it just really good Cat5? The standards are just a minimum benchmark, hit this low bar and you pass.
Sorry, but Cat5 jacks and Cat5e cable not being standards compliant just doesn't make sense to me.
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
Sorry, but Cat5 jacks and Cat5e cable not being standards compliant just doesn't make sense to me.
It makes sense to me
the cat 5 jacks where designed with the characteristics of cat 5 cable in mind
when connected to cat 6 cable that has diffrent charactersitcs it might not evan come up to cat 5 standards .
not a good practice in any event
It makes sense to me
the cat 5 jacks where designed with the characteristics of cat 5 cable in mind
when connected to cat 6 cable that has diffrent charactersitcs it might not evan come up to cat 5 standards .
not a good practice in any event
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
I think you misunderstood my comment, here is what the standard says...TIA 568-B.1
10.2.3 Connecting hardware termination
Cables should be terminated with connecting hardware of the same category or higher.
Cat 5 is however not standards compliant any longer, but cat 5e is still is. As I prefaced my comment with...
If one were to be technical no.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
10.2.3 Connecting hardware termination
Cables should be terminated with connecting hardware of the same category or higher.
Cat 5 is however not standards compliant any longer, but cat 5e is still is. As I prefaced my comment with...
If one were to be technical no.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
Sorry, left out a part from the same section, 10.2.3
Installed transmission performance of components that meet requirements of different performance categories (i.e., cables, connectors, and patch cords that are not rated for the same transmission capability) shall be classified by the least performing component in the link.
But since cat 5 is no longer standards compliant, again, technically the answer is no.
That being said read my initial comments about whether it will work or not and then keep the following in mind.
Since most cat 6 is actually larger in AWG it may not even fit right and stay properly terminated in cat 5 jacks, this is a problem we saw at Leviton frequently with some cat 6 cable due to the larger AWG.
Plus the fact that to achieve the 100 Ohm CI with a lower resistance cable you may very well have an Impedance mismatch when mixing anything older than cat 6 with cat 6.
Bottom line...it is always best to design a system, not just throw a bunch of parts together and hope it works.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Installed transmission performance of components that meet requirements of different performance categories (i.e., cables, connectors, and patch cords that are not rated for the same transmission capability) shall be classified by the least performing component in the link.
But since cat 5 is no longer standards compliant, again, technically the answer is no.
That being said read my initial comments about whether it will work or not and then keep the following in mind.
Since most cat 6 is actually larger in AWG it may not even fit right and stay properly terminated in cat 5 jacks, this is a problem we saw at Leviton frequently with some cat 6 cable due to the larger AWG.
Plus the fact that to achieve the 100 Ohm CI with a lower resistance cable you may very well have an Impedance mismatch when mixing anything older than cat 6 with cat 6.
Bottom line...it is always best to design a system, not just throw a bunch of parts together and hope it works.
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Ok. I'll take the 'technically' part. And understand why. But that raises the question, now that Cat5 is no longer recognized, what does that do for current installations? If this change invalidates existing installs, then I would absolutely agree. So lets take one that is valid, Cat5e jacks on Cat6 cable. Cat5e standards compliant? Or not?
Understand first hand about the AWG with Cat6. I forget now which manufacture connectivity that I was using, might have been an older Hubbell 5e patch panel. But was trying to put on LanMark 2000 which is 22.5 AWG, and man it almost didn't go on.
And won't disagree at all with the bottom line.
One thing that should be noted here. I'm putting in Cat6 everything these days, so this really isn't anything I would do or considering doing. I just can't see how things won't boil down to the lowest common denominator (taking out the part about cat5 being dropped).
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
Understand first hand about the AWG with Cat6. I forget now which manufacture connectivity that I was using, might have been an older Hubbell 5e patch panel. But was trying to put on LanMark 2000 which is 22.5 AWG, and man it almost didn't go on.
And won't disagree at all with the bottom line.
One thing that should be noted here. I'm putting in Cat6 everything these days, so this really isn't anything I would do or considering doing. I just can't see how things won't boil down to the lowest common denominator (taking out the part about cat5 being dropped).
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
Servamatic
IS-IT--Management
They do Justin, I am not disagreeing with you at all on that.
My first post on this was:
That said...if you use Cat 5 connectors on Cat 6 cable, you will theoretically have a Cat 5 system.
Hopefully everything will play nice and it will work...
It is always so much fun trying to explain things in a one way conversation, what makes perfect sense when you type it, doesn't always read that way...
I think we are in agreement for the most part Justin, but I know if I had said ..oh yea that is compliant and it will work, without any other comments a particular person or two would have argued that with me...lol
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
My first post on this was:
That said...if you use Cat 5 connectors on Cat 6 cable, you will theoretically have a Cat 5 system.
Hopefully everything will play nice and it will work...
It is always so much fun trying to explain things in a one way conversation, what makes perfect sense when you type it, doesn't always read that way...
I think we are in agreement for the most part Justin, but I know if I had said ..oh yea that is compliant and it will work, without any other comments a particular person or two would have argued that with me...lol
Richard S. Anderson, RCDD
Understood, and probably know to whom you refer. Been around that barn once or twice. I figured we were in agreement, I just couldn't see how the standards would be written to exclude older stuff.
Anyway, discussions like this are good to keep the brain matter flowing.
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
Anyway, discussions like this are good to keep the brain matter flowing.
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
- Thread starter
- #15
Just thought I'd add some fuel to this burnt out fire:
From the TIA category6.org web site FAQ
"If we use a Cat 5e RJ45 connector and connect it to a Cat 6 UTP cable, will the installation be Cat5e or Cat 6?
By definition (of the standard), it will be a Cat 5e channel. The actual performance will probably be somewhat better, but nowhere near Cat 6 requirements. Of course, you can set up a channel using any components and measure it using a Cat 6 (level III) compliant tester, and if it passes, it is Cat 6 performance compliant. It would not be standards compliant however, because the components have requirements in and of themselves to assure interoperability with other Cat 6 components."
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
From the TIA category6.org web site FAQ
"If we use a Cat 5e RJ45 connector and connect it to a Cat 6 UTP cable, will the installation be Cat5e or Cat 6?
By definition (of the standard), it will be a Cat 5e channel. The actual performance will probably be somewhat better, but nowhere near Cat 6 requirements. Of course, you can set up a channel using any components and measure it using a Cat 6 (level III) compliant tester, and if it passes, it is Cat 6 performance compliant. It would not be standards compliant however, because the components have requirements in and of themselves to assure interoperability with other Cat 6 components."
Justin T. Clausen
Physical Layer Implementation
California State University, Monterey Bay
daronwilson
Vendor
Justin thanks for adding that source, even though you know some folks don't like when you quote outside sources that disagree with them. Of course, some folks don't like it when you disagree with them at all 
But...back to the original question:
If I use cat 6 cable with cat 5 ends ( jacks ) will it slow down cat 6 capabilities?
It is likely that you will have less than category 6 performance or capabilities, however depending on the margins (length, quality of wire, quality of outlets, etc.) you might find that you can get the full capabilities of the Cat6. However to keep Richard happy, we would not call it standards compliant.
Good luck!
It is only my opinion, based on my experience and education...I am always willing to learn, educate me!
Daron J. Wilson, RCDD
daron.wilson@lhmorris.com
But...back to the original question:If I use cat 6 cable with cat 5 ends ( jacks ) will it slow down cat 6 capabilities?
It is likely that you will have less than category 6 performance or capabilities, however depending on the margins (length, quality of wire, quality of outlets, etc.) you might find that you can get the full capabilities of the Cat6. However to keep Richard happy, we would not call it standards compliant.
Good luck!
It is only my opinion, based on my experience and education...I am always willing to learn, educate me!
Daron J. Wilson, RCDD
daron.wilson@lhmorris.com
- Status
