Can't stop PC using Slave drive as Boot!

[Najemikon]

Hi,

Hope you can help! Friend of mine had two PCs running together. One had an 8gb Fujitsu Hard drive, the other a 20gb Fujitsu.

The one with the 20gb failed. Instead of spending money on the PC, he asked me to put the 20gb in the 8gb PC as a slave. No problem thought I!

Here's the deal:

AMD K6 400
Primary IDE Master - 8gb Fujitsu
Primary IDE Slave - 20gb Fujitsu

This is exactly how BIOS sees the setup. So what causes this?

Drive C: - 20gb, Drive D: -8gb

No matter what I do, I cannot make the thing see the 8gb drive as the system disc! I've tried different postitions on the IDE cable, to no avail. I know it would work adding the new drive to Secondary, but I need to tleave that channel free. And anyway; it should work!

Any ideas much appreciated...

 

[wolluf]

What operating systems are we talking about (eg, WHERE do you see C: and D: drive letters)? Presume the 8 GB drivce does have an operating sysytem - does it still boot if you disconnect 20GB drive? Presume you did change the jumpers on the 20GB drive? What about boot sequence in the bios?

 

[Najemikon]

Thanks for the response, Wolluf.

Both PCs were Windows 98 SE & really, nothing has been changed on the 8gb one. It's a fully working system. Soon as I remove the 20gb slave, it boots again.

Jumpers are correct & have been checked (though I haven't attempted anything with Cable Select). If I let the 20gb boot into windows, My Computer clearly shows it as C: & the 8gb as D:. But to be fair, I'm not relying on Windows to tell me that- Fdisk sees the 20 as C & the 8 as D as well. Also, from Fdisks point of view, the 20 is drive 1, the 8 is drive 2.

I did think about formatting the slave after rescuing it's data by connecting it to the secondary channel temporarily, but I think all I'd up with then is the old "insert boot disk" message!

Although it does boot from the 20gb, it doesn't of course have any of the correct hardware or software configurations, otherwise, I'd just say sod it & let it do its own thing! Being an IT technician, that's my usual approach!

 

[Grenage]

I'd get your data off the 20 and onto the 8, then format the 20 - it looks like it's getting confused with it having an OS on there


I Had something similar once with a Linux Installation on a secondary HD.

 

[wolluf]

I think if you backed up data from 20GB drive, then just removed its partition (I would do this with a win98 boot floppy and just 20GB drive connected, just to be sure!) & reboot, you should be able to create a new partition which would take up D: drive slot (as 8GB would be only partition on machine at this point, windows would definitely make it C.

 

[Najemikon]

I really think just blanking the drive will cause it to not boot at all, Grenage. I did once have a situation where I couldn't get two blank drives in the order I wanted on a new PC. As it was a fresh install, I just lived with it! Now Wollufs idea could have solved that & it's very promising for this situation. I like sneaky tricks like that! If it isn't partitioned, how can it possibly make it active? Great stuff. I'll try it later & let you know how I get on.

Thanks guys...

 

[Najemikon]

Well that was fun!

I destroyed the partitions on the 20gb after rescuing any needed data. I was left with an entirely blank, unconfigured hard drive. I set it back to being a slave to the 8gb master, but the blasted PC still tried to boot from it! I got the "Insert system disc" message.

This was lending weight to one of my colleagues theories that the 20gb is a faster drive & spins up first. That's one of those daft ideas you have to prove wrong for your own sense of sanity. What I did next certainly did that, but I still find it illogical.

I finally got the PC to boot from the 8gb, with the 20gb on the same primary channel. How? Swapped the jumpers & made the 8gb a slave to the 20gb master.

That, is stupid. I'm not arguing with it; I have what I want, but if anyone can explain why it should want to work backwards, I'm all ears!

Thanks again for your help anyway. It certainly sounded like a winner to me!

 

[wolluf]

Perhaps the IDE controller (or the bios) on the motherboard is 'wired backwards' - so it swaps master/slave (most bioses allow you to do this anyway - set to boot from D or second hard drive, so it would be a small step for this to be set by default).

Glad you've got it working - nice bit of lateral thinking!

 

[Donfief]

Might be totaly obvious, forgive me if this seems over simple, but MY Fujitsu has jumper settings for Master, (the first jumper), Master-With-Slave-Present, (Jumper first AND second jumpers), Cable-Select, (Second jumper only), Slave,(Third jumper only). On most other drives, to add a slave drive, you would simply change the jumper on the new drive to the slave position, and cable it up. On Fujitsu, however, you also have to ADD AN ADDITIONAL JUMPER to the master drive, so that both jumper sets 1 and 2 are used on the master, and just set 3 on the slave.

BTW, if I were you, I would jumper up and down on them with my boots, and then toss them. I have lost several to the Cirus Logic problem, and have no confidence in the company, it's support, or it's products.

Don

 

[KimLeece]

You could always try the cable select setting - the 20 Gb drive on the connector in the middle - might work!

Kim Leece.

 

[Najemikon]

Hi Don,

Haven't been in here for a while as I managed to get it working, but wanted to acknowledge your response. It certainly sounds promising & it was something I hadn't tried, so if I come across it again, I'll look into it.

Cables wise, Kim, I'd tried most ways round I could think of! It was completely ignoring the position & doing its own thing.

Thanks again...

 

[edemiere]

The MASTER drive should always be the last drive on the ribbon cable.

Make sure the drives are properly jumpered and that the drives reside on the cable in the proper positions.

Good luck!