ATA on Nforce2 slooowwww

[Hooner]

Hello chaps, I must apologise, I feel a bit of a fraud as I'm far from the professional the membership form wanted me to be.

I've searched Google til my eyes bled, posted various "amateur" forums with no success, please help me?

Trying to get my ATA/100 HDD to run at a decent speed off my Nforce2 IDE controller (mobo, not PCI). At the moment it's behaving as if it was in PIO mode, but Xp has the IDE controller listed as ATA, and the BIOS has Ultra DMA set to auto.

So why can't I get a decent speed out of it? it's chugging along like something out of the Flintstones, wouldn't be surprised to open it and find a lizard running on a wheel.

It's all setup correctly, right cable (tried 2), correct jumper settings, this is the only drive on the IDE channel, Nforce2 ATA drivers are the latest from Nvidia.

I used to like computers, more importantly, they used to like me, I feel this is going to test our relationship..............

Many thanks to any who read this.

 

[Hooner]

Do you know what? I have no idea why the format worked either, but it did, so I aint complaining!

SYAR2003, yup, I have the 3.13 drivers installed with SW-IDE, and yeah, they work like a charm!

I agree with cdogg, using Nero as a benchmark is not the right way to go about things. If you look above Doc, you will find links to PCPitstop, an excellent benchmark site where you can compare your results with systems just like yours.

 

[DocMigru]

You all miss the point - I'm not interested in absolute speed results of the HDs. Of course there are other programs to do that. I simply compare different PCs with the same product and this is ok with Nero. If Nero shows 4MB/sec for PCa and 12MB/sec for PCb its a result. If another benchmark shows 5432MB/sec for PCa - who cares?
I noticed first time, that there is a problem when transferring my DVDRW and wondering why 4xDVDR needs nearly 1hr to finish. Then I activated the speed measurement and found that problem. My games and other programs are running fine on that machine. No noticeable problem there. Only dvd burning, which needs more than 4mb/sec, is a problem. Ok, a minor problem. In most cases I use RWs, which are writable with 2x speed. I can live with it, but its somehow annoying.

You asked for more infos:
I now use again 3.13 drivers (still the 4mb/sec). I had different versions tested during the last days, all with the same result.
IDE1 samsung80GB (Pr) Samsung 160GB (sec) both UDMA5
IDE2 Teac DV50W (Pr) LiteOn CDRW (sec)DMA66 and DMA33 (or whatever it was named).

Is DMA33 equivalent to 4MB/sec? Maybe the driver chooses the speed of the slowest drive on the controller for all of them?
You guys without problems - do you have all four IDE ports in use?

regards, DocMigru

 

[SYAR2003]

I'm not sure what you are takling about here doc.

I have the DVDRW drive alone on IDE chl 2 .
And it's running in UDMA 2 (as all ATAPI devices)
Nothing else on IDE 2 .
Harddisks on IDE 1.

I ditched all old CDRW reader/writer and DVD reader ,
As my DVDRW drive covers all needs now.

Burning a 4GB movie takes about 20 minutes (on a 2,4x DVD+RW disk).

(of course the reading of it first and making of
the files to be burned has to be added to the time)

1X DVD speed is equal to about 9,2 X cd speed
in the Kilobyte pr. sec. measurement.
1X cd is 150KBps , 1X DVD is 1350KBps ( or 1,3MBps )
So a DVD writer writing on a DVD 4x rated disk
will write at 1,3MegaByte times four ( 5,2MegaByte pr.sec)
And this is not constant in the writing caused by CAV or
other mecanisms .
Just as with CDRW's the write speed varies depending on
where the laser head is aligned on the disk .

So the DMA33 bandwith on the ide channel isn't near
it's top threshold with one DVD writing session going on if
the writing data is being passed from a HDD in ide1 chl to
DVDRW in ide2 chl .

DVD roms and CDroms that use UDMA2 (DMA33) for transfer that is 33MBYTE/s .
In kilobytes that is 33782KBps.
This is the max speed(bandwith) of the channel between the ide controller and the atapi device .
But reading and writing to from cd/dvd is another thing.

A good article :

http://www.digital-digest.com/dvd/articles/dvdspeed.html

syar

 

[cdogg]

Doc,
I'm not sure if you are looking for help or to prove a point, but so far you have seemed ungrateful for anything you've received thus far. Do not forget that this site is a professional one which serves as a forum for peers to help each other. It is not a helpdesk, so try not to vent your frustration on anyone here.

"[blue]If another benchmark shows 5432MB/sec for PCa - who cares?[/blue]"

You should care, because if another benchmark shows that the HDD is running up to par, then you know the problem is not the HDD physical configuration or an operating system setting. You can conclude that the problem is either the DVD burner itself or the software that it's using. To most of us here, that would be an important thing to know.

Secondly, between PCa and PCb there's a huge difference - Win98 vs. WinXP. You can't rely on one piece of software such as Nero Burning ROM 5 for accurate readings across two completely different OS's.

"[blue]Maybe the driver chooses the speed of the slowest drive on the controller...[/blue]"

And finally, no that shouldn't matter. WinXP and newer motherboards easily have the ability to run two separate devices at their own rated ATA interface. In other words, you could have a CDROM drive running at ATA/33 and a hard drive running ATA/100 on the same IDE channel. That shouldn't be your problem, as long as XP is showing you the two separate modes are properly set on the channel.

At this point, I think you're going to need to suck it up and do some of the following:

1) Update/flash to the latest BIOS revision on your motherboard
2) Try benchmarking your hard drive with Sisoft Sandra, PCMark, or PCPitstop
3) Look into any firmware updates for your DVD burner that might have resolved issues in XP
4) Try another burning program

~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind"
[tab][tab]- Aristotle

 

[DocMigru]

Sorry, maybe it's a language problem, but I never intended to attack someone or ignore your hints even if it looks so.

1) Update/flash to the latest BIOS revision on your motherboard

I can try this some day...

2) Try benchmarking your hard drive with Sisoft Sandra, PCMark, or PCPitstop

Well, I still don't see a reason for that. Nero showed on my Win98 sytem correct ratings (please forget absolute numbers). Slow with NVidia driver, fast with MS driver. Even the DVDRW was the same. If the IDE driver is faulty on XP and another one not, Nero will show the difference!

3) Look into any firmware updates for your DVD burner that might have resolved issues in XP

That might be a point and isn't wrong, regarding new DVDRs on the market. But I still see the IDE driver as a problem. Remember: The same hardware can be used in the other pc without any speed problem. But I will look at this.

4) Try another burning program

Hmmm...

Regards, DocMigru

 

[cdogg]

Doc,
If there's a language barrier which caused any confusion earlier, then I apologize for taking it the wrong way.

2) One of the biggest things you are overlooking is the Operating System. Windows 98 and Windows XP are completely different and will give different results in certain tests if the driver or software being used is not optimized for either OS. My suggestion is that Nero's built-in benchmark does not work well with either XP or one of the drivers you have installed in your system.

In order to rule out Nero as the problem, you must use another piece of software to test the drives. The numbers don't matter. Just run a new benchmark test in both the old and new PC with the same DVD burner and hard drives. The result will show you whether the problem is Nero or not.

In an earlier post, you pointed out that Nero did not work well with an Nvidia driver. Well that makes sense. Everything else seems to work fine on your PC except burning. [red]THE SOFTWARE (NERO) SEEMS TO BE THE LIKELY CAUSE[/RED]. Fixing it should be a matter of:

A. Upgrading or reinstalling Nero in hope that it will eventually work with the drivers in your system

-OR-

B. Change the burning software to something else

If you change the drivers in your system to work with Nero, then there's a chance you could make performance worse in other areas. Changing the firmware on the DVD burner would be my only other choice, but that's just me.

~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind"
[tab][tab]- Aristotle

 

[DocMigru]

Some news:
Latest Bios for my MoBo (Gigabyte 7N400L F6) --> No effect
Latest Firmware for the TEAC DVDRW --> No effect

Then the hint &quot;other burning software&quot;. Maybe that's really the point, because I never noticed speed problems in games or other apps. My beloved Nero, extremly good software through years? But ok, I never used it with XP before, at least not with fast DVDRWs. Should it be the cause for slowing down everything to <2x speed ?
Since I'm obviously a Nero addict, I downloaded the demo for Nero version 6.3 (was using 5.5...). Running the same burning test as the last days showed:

...28MB/sec !!! Aaargl! *heartattack* X-[


Ok, I'm back to life. Unbelieveable! Enough speed for 16x-DVDRWs! Nero 5 has problems with WinXP and NForce2 chipsets! Not like &quot;doesn't burn anything&quot; but like &quot;burning much slower than possible&quot;. Wow!

Thank you guys, case closed, your hints helped.

...even if I didn't use other hd benchmarks...

Bye, DocMigru

 

[cdogg]

Yeah, it sounded like the Nero version was the problem. If you look back on my Jan 7th post, you'll see that I asked:
&quot;[blue]Have you made sure that the version of Nero you have is 100% compatible with XP? Have you tried to update it if any updates for your version exist on their site?[/blue]&quot;

I'd say that was more than a hint!

Glad you got it fixed!


~cdogg
[tab]&quot;All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind&quot;
[tab][tab]- Aristotle

 

[TopBuoy]

I have been reading with interest the problems you have had with Hard drives. I also have a very similar problem, with with my Maxtor 160Gb drive,set as a primary slave , it will only run in PIO mode. ASUS mother board BIOS ( upgraded)is set for DMA and all my other 3 Devices run in DMA, it has been recognised by XP to be 160GB.( I have installed SP1 and the 137GB fix )
I noticed the problem when read /writing video for the first time , the software said it was to slow to tranfer data,2495Kb/sec transfer rate , yet my primary drive is Ok at 40000 Kb/sec. Play back of video on this drive is very jerky.I have installed /uninstalled IDE/ hardware drivers etc , reformated the drive. But still no joy.
At this rate it will be going back!
Any help gratefully received.

 

[cdogg]

Just as a test, have you tried the drive on an IDE channel all by itself?

Also, there's another option to buy a cheap OEM PCI IDE controller card that does ATA 133 and gives you an additional IDE channel. Perhaps you could move a secondary drive over to the PCI controller and keep your main 160GB drive on the mobo IDE controller.

I'm also sure Maxtor would have a few suggestions if you contact them.

~cdogg
[tab]&quot;All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind&quot;
[tab][tab]- Aristotle

 

[TopBuoy]

Cdogg
Thanks for the reply, not yet tried it by its self so I will give it ago.

TopBuoy