I have an old windows 98 machine that I'm going to upgrade to se and need to move some files over to another PC on my network to backup. After much swearing (and 15 attempts) I was able to get a NIC installed correctly in that machine but now I can't get it to go out to my DHCP server (my broadband router is acting as my dhcp server) and retrieve a local ip address. I'm running a 192 network and the win98 PC keeps coming up with a 169 address. I've tried releasing and renewing using ipconfig but it's not retrieving an address. Any ideas as to what the problem may be? Thanks!
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adding windows 98 machine to network
- Thread starter rswebscan
- Start date
'After much swearing (and 15 attempts) I was able to get a NIC installed correctly in that machine'
Are you sure its installed correctly/definitely working? NICs are dead easy to install & set up, even in 98 machines - so why all the problems? I'm suspecting a dud NIC or configuration issue? What does device managwer say aboutt he NIC? Have you another you could try instead (they're very cheap now - you could buy a new one).
Can you ping other machines on the network?
If you give machine a manual 192 IP address, can other machines see it?
Are you sure its installed correctly/definitely working? NICs are dead easy to install & set up, even in 98 machines - so why all the problems? I'm suspecting a dud NIC or configuration issue? What does device managwer say aboutt he NIC? Have you another you could try instead (they're very cheap now - you could buy a new one).
Can you ping other machines on the network?
If you give machine a manual 192 IP address, can other machines see it?
Try changing the network cable and check any restrictions on the router. If releasing/renewing doesn't do it getting a 169 address, then that's an indication that it's just not seeing the network AT ALL.
Since you had a helluva lot of trouble getting the card installed, that could also be the problem (bad driver installation or not functioning correctly in Windows). Make sure you have TCP/IP setup correctly for the NIC to detect automatically.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Since you had a helluva lot of trouble getting the card installed, that could also be the problem (bad driver installation or not functioning correctly in Windows). Make sure you have TCP/IP setup correctly for the NIC to detect automatically.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
- Thread starter
- #4
Yeah, I've installed 20 or 30 NIC's without much trouble so this is a new one on me. Windows kept locking up during installation and running through the installation process after each reboot. If I do switch manually to a 192 address, I still cannot ping in or out from that machine. I know both the cable and hub are fine and I have 4 other PC's connected to that hub that are communicating fine and I've switched ports and cables with no difficulty on my other PC's. I think the problem with the installation was a software issue. Windows was showing that a nonexistent SMC ethernet card was in the machine and once I removed that from network neighborhood it seemed to install fine.
Yes, having more than one instance of a NIC in device manager can cause problems in Win98, which relies heavily on hardware profiles. Usually, you can only have one NIC active in each profile, otherwise the network stack for TCP/IP becomes confused.
So it seems like you found your problem, right? Make sure you only have one NIC device enabled in Device Manager and you should be good to go after a reboot.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
So it seems like you found your problem, right? Make sure you only have one NIC device enabled in Device Manager and you should be good to go after a reboot.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
- Thread starter
- #6
Well, but you already indicated that others from the router are working fine. As long as you don't have a limit to the number or range of IP addresses for DHCP set on the router, then I don't think that's the issue. The transmission is likely fine from the router.
Instead at this point, I would remove the NIC (yes, I know it was a pain in the arse to get it installed). Remove it from Device Manager and blow out the network stack (Client for MS Networks, TCP/IP, etc). Reinstall the NIC followed by the clients/protocols and try again.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Instead at this point, I would remove the NIC (yes, I know it was a pain in the arse to get it installed). Remove it from Device Manager and blow out the network stack (Client for MS Networks, TCP/IP, etc). Reinstall the NIC followed by the clients/protocols and try again.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
- Thread starter
- #8
What kind of NIC. Where is it installed? And autoinstall or manual install?
NICs can be "Alice in Wonderland" devices. Since they work on smoke and mirrors, diagnostics can lead you astray.
Try a ping of 127.0.0.1 to see if the internals are up correctly.
Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.
NICs can be "Alice in Wonderland" devices. Since they work on smoke and mirrors, diagnostics can lead you astray.
Try a ping of 127.0.0.1 to see if the internals are up correctly.
Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.
- Thread starter
- #10
Hi Ed,
I've tried two different NIC's in two different PCI slots (Netgear 311 and a Belkin f5d5000) I couldn't get the Belkin to work at all (yellow splat ndis.nxd, ntkern.nxd loader....) The Netgear (I tried that NIC first) appeared fine in device manager but I couldn't get it to hit the dhcp server (my router). Now I'm reinstalling the Netgear and during bootup when installation is looking for the CD-Rom drive it can't find it. I have a yellow splat on "secondary ide controller" and no cd-rom after I cancel the NIC install. It (cd-rom) is being found by the bios during boot so the network card must be messing with the CD-Rom resources...?
I've tried two different NIC's in two different PCI slots (Netgear 311 and a Belkin f5d5000) I couldn't get the Belkin to work at all (yellow splat ndis.nxd, ntkern.nxd loader....) The Netgear (I tried that NIC first) appeared fine in device manager but I couldn't get it to hit the dhcp server (my router). Now I'm reinstalling the Netgear and during bootup when installation is looking for the CD-Rom drive it can't find it. I have a yellow splat on "secondary ide controller" and no cd-rom after I cancel the NIC install. It (cd-rom) is being found by the bios during boot so the network card must be messing with the CD-Rom resources...?
With the CD problem I would suspect that you have a M/B support chip problem. And that might indicate that the NIC problems are also related.
Time to get Belarc and see what shows for the M/B.
Once you have a NIC apparently installed how about a continuous ping to the router/hub or another machine to see if there is any indication that anything is going across the wire.
Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.
Time to get Belarc and see what shows for the M/B.
Once you have a NIC apparently installed how about a continuous ping to the router/hub or another machine to see if there is any indication that anything is going across the wire.
Ed Fair
Give the wrong symptoms, get the wrong solutions.
TekTippy4U
Technical User
rswebscan
Uninstall all the NIC software , Client for MS and TCP/IP stack....reboot into safe mode and trash any splats, duplicates of anything (other than mobo resources) and any unknowns or "others".....and ofcourse NICky.
Shutdown.....remove the sucker from PCI and Reboot to flush
shutdown and then Reinstall the Card and Boot directly into BIOS and "Reset" or "Clear" the Configuration Data (ESCD), near the PnP OS spec...Save changes and reboot...and let winblows detect it
reinstall all your TCP/IP and Clients, and off ya go -- hopefully
TT4U
Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs
Uninstall all the NIC software , Client for MS and TCP/IP stack....reboot into safe mode and trash any splats, duplicates of anything (other than mobo resources) and any unknowns or "others".....and ofcourse NICky.
Shutdown.....remove the sucker from PCI and Reboot to flush
shutdown and then Reinstall the Card and Boot directly into BIOS and "Reset" or "Clear" the Configuration Data (ESCD), near the PnP OS spec...Save changes and reboot...and let winblows detect it
reinstall all your TCP/IP and Clients, and off ya go -- hopefully
TT4U
Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs
rswebscan,
Yes, you tried removing and reinstalling the NIC, but did you also remove all clients and protocols like I had suggested? Just right-click Network Neighborhood and go to Properties to check. Make sure you remove them after removing the NIC physically and from Device Manager.
Reinstall the NIC, then check the network properties again. Add the clients/protocols that you need back.
If you've already tried the above, then reboot Win98 into safe mode. Check Device Manager there for multiple NIC instances and remove them. Sometimes additional entries will show up here that didn't show in Normal mode.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Yes, you tried removing and reinstalling the NIC, but did you also remove all clients and protocols like I had suggested? Just right-click Network Neighborhood and go to Properties to check. Make sure you remove them after removing the NIC physically and from Device Manager.
Reinstall the NIC, then check the network properties again. Add the clients/protocols that you need back.
If you've already tried the above, then reboot Win98 into safe mode. Check Device Manager there for multiple NIC instances and remove them. Sometimes additional entries will show up here that didn't show in Normal mode.
~cdogg
[tab]"All paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind";
[tab][tab]- Aristotle
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
TekTippy4U
Technical User
Yep - Things "definitely" show up in safe mode that don't usually in the Full Boot mode - check out the WMPcodecs and stuff, just to name one.
TT4U
Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs
TT4U
Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs
- Thread starter
- #15
Yes I had wiped out the stack and removed all the protocols etc...
Thanks all, after I reinstalled the Netgear card everything started working. I didn't do anything different than I did 20 times before that so I don't know what the solution is but it is working now. Thanks for all your suggestions....
Thanks all, after I reinstalled the Netgear card everything started working. I didn't do anything different than I did 20 times before that so I don't know what the solution is but it is working now. Thanks for all your suggestions....
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