10Mb over 400ft of 25pair?

[sysrq]

I am curious if I would have any chance of getting at least a 10Mb connection over a 25pair Cat-3 line, that is not in use. This cable has been abandoned for at least 10 years, but seems to be still in good condition, and the distance is probably around 400 feet. It also has the old style screw in lightning protectors, carbon maybe? Not sure if it would help to take those out or not if maybe they cause interference.

 

[Bobg1]

I certainly would not want to rely on something like that.
As to will it work, you never know unless you try it.

 

[jimbopalmer]

http://www.tutsys.com/mtu/products/ethernetworking/xl_600ld_ether_repeat/index.cfm

if I had to rely on it I would usetwo of these

I tried to remain child-like, all I acheived was childish.

 

[jerryreeve]

the 100 meter distance limitation is more a limitation on time elapsed in packet transfers than on actual distance. like bobg1 said you won't know till you try it. If you end up having to try to push out the distance you could try a small switch in the middle to receive and retransmit the packets.

JerryReeve
Communications Systems Int'l
com-sys.com

 

[buitenhek]

All good points. Since cable was mfg'd around/b4 1994, the CAT3 rating would likely allow 10 Mbps. As jerryreeve indicates the actual distance (400') may not be a culprit, but rather the packet transfer time. You will not know until you try. Any ack/nak delay will cause additional packets which will likely cause collisions which will cause more packets, et al. Your system overhead will be higher than a properly designed cabling system.

The hub midway will alleviate the distance and/or latency problem.
Regards,
Peter Buitenhek

 

[sysrq]

I appreciate your opinions, I am going to attempt it next week, its nothing I have to rely on for production purposes, but just a hope of getting a share of my DSL connection over to the studio house on the property, it wont need much, so even a little packet loss I wouldnt mind, as long as a bit of surfing could be done, my other worry, which I forgot to mention, and probably will damper it a bit more, is the fact that its in the air, on the same poles as the power lines for about 2 pole lengths, I bet that throws alot of interference in it, and it makes it harder to use a switch or something to that extent to repeat it, since its high up, and there are no splice boxes between the 2 locations, but anyhow, I think this will be a fun project, whether it works or not. Thanks again

 

[sysrq]

jimbopalmer, that ethernet repeater looks interesting, but I didnt see any price, do you what they run about? Thanks for the help

 

[skip555]

being in the air will probably degrade it further since the clamps used work by clamping ino the cable thus changing the orientation odf the pairs and flatteng out the twist so it probably isnt evan cat3

also dont forget to add some lightning protection (wich will degrade the signal evan further)

let us know how it works out

 

[jimbopalmer]

None are on ebay,although some older tut products are, online pricing for new units seems to be near $300 per end (you need 2)

I tried to remain child-like, all I acheived was childish.

 

[EdPorts]

I actually don't see any reason that the "clamps used" would do any sort of damage to the cable.

If it's aerial, and it's 25 pair... it's either figure 8, which means that the "clamps" used are compression fittings that attatch to the messenger, more commonly referred to as sachs clamps. Or... if it's lashed, that means that lashing wire is bound around it to steel messenger... which again has very little affect on it.

Sysrq... go with what jimbo said. If not, flowpoint DSL bridges and routers are capable of point to point connection (google for it) as well as Paradyne.

I couldn't tell you if your protector will be the problem, but I would assume that some of those carbons have gone bad by now... at least depending on the environment they're in. A lot of the OSP rebuild I did at an old army base that was decomissioned in 1994 had the same problem. Lots of corrosion with the screw on carbons. It may require that you get a new protector (which wouldn't be a bad idea anyhow) and if you haven't got access to any telecom distributors, I see them on e-bay regularly.

 

[Pyg]

Black box makes some really nice line extenders that will achvieve this at even higher speeds. I've used them many times. However, they won't jump across bridge clips on a 66 block so you have to make sure that there are no breaks in the cable.

 

[skip555]

If it's aerial, and it's 25 pair... it's either figure 8, which means that the "clamps" used are compression fittings that attatch to the messenger, more commonly referred to as sachs clamps. Or... if it's lashed, that means that lashing wire is bound around it to steel messenger... which again has very little affect on

waht I was envisioning and have seen on more than one occasion is plain old cat3 25pr IW strung between a couple of poles

no messenger and compression clamps used thus compressing the cable.

 

[EdPorts]

Skip,

If they hung 25 pair IW, and it's going from pole to pole via drive hooks, or P hooks... or some other method, then there's no way it's still going to be intact 10 years later. I agree though, if it is IW -- then screw the idea entirely.

I might just hire a cable subcontractor that works for the cable company and has the equipment to work on aerial plant, and have him put in some outdoor rated Cat5e. That'd be cheap, effective, and you could use your point to point DSL method still. Too far for normal transmission of 10mbit or 100mbit, but you could do point to point DSL. Or better yet, put up some fiber

 

[sysrq]

Point to point DSL, what kind of equip does it take to do that, and what kind of cost does that reach?

 

[EdPorts]

Flowpoint routers are capable of it. Paradyne makes some products capable of it as well.

Jimbo mentioned this product:

http://www.tutsys.com/mtu/products/ethernetworking/xl_600ld_ether_repeat/index.cfm

That's quite capable of it as well. It'd be faster to use those tutsys ones rather than the PTP DSL solution, as DSL isn't anywhere near 10Mbit speed.