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Can anyone explain why NT kernel is said to be more complex and bigger than the UNIX kernel?
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UNIX vs NT kernel
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aixmurderer
IS-IT--Management
Not sure what the answer is here, may I venture a risky answer and say perhaps because the GUI is built into it? IBM Certified Confused - MQSeries
IBM Certified Flabbergasted - AIX 5 pSeries System Administration
IBM Certified Flabbergasted - AIX 5 pSeries System Administration
sounds like the beginning of a long thread to me.... <grin> Mike
________________________________________________________________
"Experience is the comb that Nature gives us, after we are bald."
Is that a haiku?
I never could get the hang
of writing those things.
________________________________________________________________
"Experience is the comb that Nature gives us, after we are bald."
Is that a haiku?
I never could get the hang
of writing those things.
> sounds like the beginning of a long thread to me....
Oh yeah...
Let's start with question #1: Which Unix are we talking about here? -------------------------------------------
"Now, this might cause some discomfort..."
(
Oh yeah...
Let's start with question #1: Which Unix are we talking about here? -------------------------------------------
"Now, this might cause some discomfort..."
(
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Guest_imported
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doesn't matter, any unix is better than NT....
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Guest_imported
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Heeyyy!!! NT is important & worthwhile... for video games!!
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Guest_imported
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windows....well, it's a really, really, bad joke. And games are not good on NT...not so bad on ver.5 I admit(2k), but nt? shivers.....
Butterfly123
Technical User
Unix kernel is a modular kernel, that is, the kernel modules are run depending on the need and then they exit after the work is over.. Whereas its not the case with NT.. Its not modular one.. Everything runs simultaniously.. - Hemant
KenCunningham
Technical User
......Just like my kids' noses! ;-)
Butterfly123
Technical User
Nice example, KenCunningham!! - Hemant
AIXSPadmin
MIS
I run a FreeBSD and Windows machines at home. A couple of weeks ago I had to reinstall Win98 because it was jacked up. I had inadvertanly thrown away my product key when I changed jewel cases, though I still had my Win95 OEM key. I called my sister and got her Win98 pk... nope didn't work. So I called Micro$oft, and explained to them I purchased it 2 years ago at OfficeMax and did not have my product key anymore. The lady was helpful and generated a new pk for me and said if it didn't work to call back. That evening I tried to install and guess what? It didn't work. I called back Micro$oft and they generated 3 new pk's for me and none of them worked. The last thing they told me was pay us $35 and we will open up a case and try and figure it out for you (I paid $99 two years ago - I wasn't going to pay a third of that again).
At work the next day a buddy agreed to bring in his Win98 CD for me to upgrade my Win95. His was Win98 and mine is Win98SE. And just for grins, I tried his pk on my install and lo-and-behold guess what? It worked. After 4 product keys generated from Micro$oft themselves, and my sister's Win98SE pk would not work a Win98 first edition pk worked. Typical of their crap they push out on the market. But that is (was) not all. Since I have installed Win98 from a fresh install... the computer will not shutdown! I have to hit the reset button then when it comes back up I hit the power button. But it has shutdown 3 times like it should, but it cannot restart at anytime. Typical of the crap they put on the market.
I never have problems with my BSD box or any of my 75 AIX SP nodes at work.
And talk about my NT workstation at work! Lo-and-behold I would like to understand how M$ can continue to put out crap, and to charge for it! It is unstable, shoddy, poorly written and developed, and inferior.
And then talk about how they do their registration for the new improved dynamic forward-thinking revolutionary industrial-strength powerful XP! Amazingly they continue to make money.
I curse everytime I have to use Windows!
At work the next day a buddy agreed to bring in his Win98 CD for me to upgrade my Win95. His was Win98 and mine is Win98SE. And just for grins, I tried his pk on my install and lo-and-behold guess what? It worked. After 4 product keys generated from Micro$oft themselves, and my sister's Win98SE pk would not work a Win98 first edition pk worked. Typical of their crap they push out on the market. But that is (was) not all. Since I have installed Win98 from a fresh install... the computer will not shutdown! I have to hit the reset button then when it comes back up I hit the power button. But it has shutdown 3 times like it should, but it cannot restart at anytime. Typical of the crap they put on the market.
I never have problems with my BSD box or any of my 75 AIX SP nodes at work.
And talk about my NT workstation at work! Lo-and-behold I would like to understand how M$ can continue to put out crap, and to charge for it! It is unstable, shoddy, poorly written and developed, and inferior.
And then talk about how they do their registration for the new improved dynamic forward-thinking revolutionary industrial-strength powerful XP! Amazingly they continue to make money.
I curse everytime I have to use Windows!
Hi all,
The thing is that for companies using windows they can just hire trained monkeys to do the administration part of it.
It crashes from time to time all by itself, so those monkeys can't really do much *more* harm.
One could fill pages & pages with the sheer stupidity these certified trained monkeys produce from time to time but then we are accused of having a waaay to big ego.
Win2K server you say ?
Win2k running on a PII750 still can't beat this old Ultra10 running with a 300Mhz cpu as a simple printserver.
Win2k has the Same layout, same "panels" everywhere and numerous screens you have to consult before you actually know what setting is on what value.
Install a patch a fear that your bootblock is gone, (old NT problem that NEVER went away)
But, as long as this situation continues, I'm having fun!
The thing is that for companies using windows they can just hire trained monkeys to do the administration part of it.
It crashes from time to time all by itself, so those monkeys can't really do much *more* harm.
One could fill pages & pages with the sheer stupidity these certified trained monkeys produce from time to time but then we are accused of having a waaay to big ego.
Win2K server you say ?
Win2k running on a PII750 still can't beat this old Ultra10 running with a 300Mhz cpu as a simple printserver.
Win2k has the Same layout, same "panels" everywhere and numerous screens you have to consult before you actually know what setting is on what value.
Install a patch a fear that your bootblock is gone, (old NT problem that NEVER went away)
But, as long as this situation continues, I'm having fun!
aixmurderer
IS-IT--Management
I must say XP (Xtra Problems?) is much improved, at least the blue screen of death is now exactly that, all blue. No more useless info displayed to try and look helpful... IBM Certified Confused - MQSeries
IBM Certified Flabbergasted - AIX 5 pSeries System Administration
IBM Certified Flabbergasted - AIX 5 pSeries System Administration
we had an install of windows XP here ... we were sceptical at first, but we were amazed that it managed to stay up without a reboot for almost a month.
yes, that is, 31 days ... after which it seemed to lose its File allocation table (NTFS5) losing all the work that the user had done in a month (he had not bothered to store any on the server since he had brand new huge GB disks ...)
after a complete reinstall it now only crashs about 2 to 3 times a week, but he does reset it more often than that
--
the MicroSloth robots keep ringing us up to get us to join the rolling upgrade program ... you know, then one where you pay lots of money so that you can always have the latest upgrade ... it's taken them about 3 weeks, but they've finally taken the hint that we're running at 1995 technology, running solaris, linux and where it is really needed some win3.1 and win95 platforms as clients ...
robot: "ok, if you got to <xxx> site and download <xxx>.exe and run it on your server and run it it will tell you what products and systems need to be added to the license agreement"
us: "we seem to get a "MZ<encoded characters>: not found at line 8" command
us: do you think it might be because our server is RUNNING SOLARIS!!!?"
robot: "you really weren't kidding were you?"
...
I know ... I'm waffling ...
yes, that is, 31 days ... after which it seemed to lose its File allocation table (NTFS5) losing all the work that the user had done in a month (he had not bothered to store any on the server since he had brand new huge GB disks ...)
after a complete reinstall it now only crashs about 2 to 3 times a week, but he does reset it more often than that
--
the MicroSloth robots keep ringing us up to get us to join the rolling upgrade program ... you know, then one where you pay lots of money so that you can always have the latest upgrade ... it's taken them about 3 weeks, but they've finally taken the hint that we're running at 1995 technology, running solaris, linux and where it is really needed some win3.1 and win95 platforms as clients ...
robot: "ok, if you got to <xxx> site and download <xxx>.exe and run it on your server and run it it will tell you what products and systems need to be added to the license agreement"
us: "we seem to get a "MZ<encoded characters>: not found at line 8" command
us: do you think it might be because our server is RUNNING SOLARIS!!!?"
robot: "you really weren't kidding were you?"
...
I know ... I'm waffling ...
AIXSPadmin
MIS
XtraProblems... that is good!!! My windows box at home now (suddenly) shuts down correctly now. Ever since my re-install I was not able to connect to my router so I could use my cable modem on my BSD and windows boxes simultaneously. I have 2 ethernet cards in my windows (10 & 100) and 1 in my BSD box (100). My BSD box could connect to my router, ping it, even get into the admin console, however, I could not do that with my windows box after the reinstall; though I could connect to the internet directly plugging the cable modem into the ethernet card. The other day for no reason at all when I started my windows machine my two ethernet cards were gone. I rebooted and a new ethernet device was found that was not right, so I reinstalled one of the devices (10) and then had to reboot. When it came back up I plugged it back into my router and hub and lo and behold the windows machine could now find the cable router.
Talk about crappy software. But, I guess as long as it makes you billions, who cares if it works or not!
I also wonder why Linux is now getting such a big push in the marketplace when BSD has been around for years longer and is more stable. I would chalk that up to the licensing and lawsuits from years ago. That is another topic I guess, and one that has very strong opinions on both sides.
Talk about crappy software. But, I guess as long as it makes you billions, who cares if it works or not!
I also wonder why Linux is now getting such a big push in the marketplace when BSD has been around for years longer and is more stable. I would chalk that up to the licensing and lawsuits from years ago. That is another topic I guess, and one that has very strong opinions on both sides.
Yes, unfortunately, BSD carries some emotional baggage for a lot of the older Unix crowd, who remember all the licensing nightmares in the 80s and early 90s. This is why so many developers flocked to work on the Linux project, because it was seen to be untainted from any previous proprietary code.
And this split is made worse by the fact that the Linux license lends itself to being used as a chess piece by Sun, Oracle and IBM in the war against Microsoft, while the BSD license lends itself to being slurped up by proprietary software concerns such as Apple and Microsoft. So we still can't all just get along...
Although I understand some of the complaints about the BSD license, I am still a little bit uneasy about some of the GPL zealotry I see on the Linux side. (sort of a "if you aren't with us you are against us" attitude). The BSD developers seem a little more easy-going.
In terms of just plain technical merit, I prefer FreeBSD for my servers, hands down. It just plain RUNS, without any fluff to get in the way. In my line of work, we do a lot of custom PHP/Apache/PostgreSQL applications, and the only time we reboot is when we want to exchange hardware. It is a sad day for us when we have to ruin a 2-year uptime streak just to replace a network card or upgrade the hard drives. But I have to admit, the Linux distros have made installation/desktop/multimedia far easier for end users than FreeBSD. -------------------------------------------
"Now, this might cause some discomfort..."
(
And this split is made worse by the fact that the Linux license lends itself to being used as a chess piece by Sun, Oracle and IBM in the war against Microsoft, while the BSD license lends itself to being slurped up by proprietary software concerns such as Apple and Microsoft. So we still can't all just get along...
Although I understand some of the complaints about the BSD license, I am still a little bit uneasy about some of the GPL zealotry I see on the Linux side. (sort of a "if you aren't with us you are against us" attitude). The BSD developers seem a little more easy-going.
In terms of just plain technical merit, I prefer FreeBSD for my servers, hands down. It just plain RUNS, without any fluff to get in the way. In my line of work, we do a lot of custom PHP/Apache/PostgreSQL applications, and the only time we reboot is when we want to exchange hardware. It is a sad day for us when we have to ruin a 2-year uptime streak just to replace a network card or upgrade the hard drives. But I have to admit, the Linux distros have made installation/desktop/multimedia far easier for end users than FreeBSD. -------------------------------------------
"Now, this might cause some discomfort..."
(
AIXSPadmin
MIS
One thing that Linux/BSD don't have that AIX has, that would be nice is for hot-swapping of hard drives. Some of the commercial aspects would be nice to be integrated into the free Unix (Linux/BSD) markets. And with IBM and the others working on Linux, I can see more being added. One thing I cannot understand is, if you spend millions on an OS/390 (IBM mainframe), why you would run Linux as your OS? The OS and hardware are phenomenal for error-checking and continuous running.
Still, commercial Unixes (AIX, Sun, HP) have features that the others don't as I mentioned above. But then I have worked on AIX and SPs for 7 years, so I cannot help but not miss the PSSP and LVM features I have to work with.
Still, commercial Unixes (AIX, Sun, HP) have features that the others don't as I mentioned above. But then I have worked on AIX and SPs for 7 years, so I cannot help but not miss the PSSP and LVM features I have to work with.
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