Resume Tips and Help

[BJCooperIT]

In the Age Bias thread it has been mentioned that those of us who have a bit of gray should list "extensive experience" rather than "## years experience" on our resumes. I think this is excellent advice.

This, however, leads me to a question. If you have previous employers listed in reverse chronological sequence, should you leave off the starting and ending dates? By looking at the start date of the first job, the total number of years is pretty obvious. If you omit the dates, will a recruiter discard your resume because they cannot determine how long and when you worked for a specific company?

I have a good bit of old mainframe experience. While the technology is mostly outdated, the analysis, design, user training, documentation, team experience, and application exposure are still of value. Any advice on how to effectively consolidate the "early years"?

Any other questions or tips for writing a good resume?

^{Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw}
Consultant/Custom Forms & PL/SQL - Oracle 8.1.7 - Windows 2000

 

[jrbarnett]

Hi,

Not sure where you are based, but in the UK the consensus seems to be to give details of the last 10 years worth of work in full, then use a prior statement - eg

"Prior to 1993, a variety of IT jobs involving the design, development and support of systems based on Oracle databases" or something similar.

If it comes up in interview, you can then elaborate, and give the details of your experience and the transferable skills you gained from it.

John

 

[BruceReed]

I have to agree with John.

Use the stuff up to ten years in detail, then very summarized prior to that. It shows that you were not on the street begging for quarters, but that the stuff you did back then is probably not applicable anymore; technology has moved on, and you have changed.

Bruce

 

[SQLSister]

Ten years is all you need in the US too. Most recruiters will tell you they don't look at anything farther back than that anyway.

The best resume is the one which sells your particular skills best. ALl of my jobs have included duties which are way beyond the the job title I held. Therefore, my resume puts very little emphasis on the chronological jobs list. In fact, it doesn't show up until midway down on the second page. What I have instead is a Summary of experience at the top (as the job objectives section is just wasted space in my opinion.) Next is a summary of the skill set I have. This is table format and is necessary because many recruiters and HR offices only sort resumes according to a key word search. So I make the key words easy for them to find. Then a list of accomplishments. By the time they get to my work history and education, they no longer care what it is because the accomplishments have already sold them.

Other things to remember in doing a resume. Omit any personal information. Nobody need to know you are married or have a hobby of sky diving.

Bad things I have seen in resumes I was reviewing for hiring:
Picture of the person, more than 2 pages (We got one that was 10 pages once and the guy only had a couple years of experience.), objective which does not match the job applied for (My favorite was the guy who said he wanted to be a CIA agent, as I wasn't hiring for the CIA guess where his resume ended up.), bad grammar, poor organization, table of skills which did not appear to match the jobs as described in the chronological section, anything that makes the reader laugh (web sight instead of web site for instance!) Jobs listed in chronological order are bad too as the hiring manager is usually most interested inthe current job or maybe the last two. Don't make that person have to search for the information wanted or the resume will end up on the bottom of the pile. Another thing that makes you look unprofessional is using the Courier typeface. That is a typewrite typeface and anyone in the IT filed is presumed to be proficient with at least one word processor. If you appear as if you aren't, that calls into question your IT skills as well.

But the number one annoyance is experience that is not a match for the job as advertised. For instance, I advertised for a senior web site developer and got resumes form recent college grads with no web experience, from people whose specialty was Word, and from sales personnel. Not only didn;t I hire them for the job at hand, I flagged their names so no one else wouldd hire them either becasue they showed such poor judgement. This porbably an effective tactic at a large company where HR sees and sorts the resumes first, but at a small company, you only annoy the IT hiring manager by wasting her (his) time.

I also have a strong preference for people who use their cover letter to explain to me why they are a good fit for the job I advertised.

One thing to remember in resume writing is that the hiring manager probably received a ton of resumes. He or she will likely do an initial sort that weeds out the obviously bad ones in a just a couple of seconds of looking at the resume. So make sure the initial impression is a good one. Many managers don't read the second page at all except for the people they already decided to interview, so make sure the most important information is on the first page.

 

[CajunCenturion]

But the number one annoyance is experience that is not a match for the job as advertised. That's a tough call. I've seen that work both ways. I can fully appreciate the frustration when looking a resume and not seeing what I asked for, but on the other hand, how many companies ask for exactly what they are looking for. How many put in bogus requirements just to scare some people off or keep the numbers down?

How many times have you seen an offering say "MCSE Required", only to find out that the person who got the job didn't have an MCSE.

I don't think it's fair to arbitrarily blackball someone who doesn't necessarily take the offering requirement at face value when so many offering's requirements are not completely accurate.

One thing is for sure, rarely, very rarely, will you get a job that you don't apply for.

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[jrbarnett]

CajunCenturion,

I did actually that - I registered for a job board just after graduation and the company who ended up being my first employer contacted me. I then phoned up and arranged an interview, and the rest is history.
I even featured in a publicity leaflet for the service, and have a copy filed somewhere for future embarassment.

John

 

[BJCooperIT]

I appreciate everyone's input. I changed my hard copy resume this weekend. Much better but it still is three pages long and according to SQLSister, I need to rearrange it and shorten it a bit yet. Is there a minimum margin (top/bottom/left/right) size preferred? I am using Times New Roman (Western) font. Is font size 11 OK or can I make it smaller, say 10 or even 8? I do not have MS Word on my home computer, so I keep it in RTF format. I worry that will that count against me.

Some of the online job boards give you no choice in the format of your resume. Monster is a perfect example. The format they use is:
OBJECTIVE
TARGET JOB
TARGET COMPANY
TARGET LOCATIONS - required
WORK STATUS - required
EXPERIENCE - dates required
EDUCATION
SKILLS
ADDITIONAL INFORMATION
While I was able to make the 10 year+ summary fit in the earliest (last) job slot, it does not allow me to properly present myself. In the Career Level section, my 30+ years as a developer only can be categorized as:
Entry Level
Mid Career (2+ years of experience)
Management

I made a 2-column bulleted list of the applications I have worked on like:

· Invoicing           · Accounts Payable
· General Ledger      · Payroll

Hopefully that is an acceptable summary format. However, Monster converts the tabs and it looks more like:

· Invoicing · Accounts Payable
· General Ledger · Payroll

Even TT converts the bullets to a special character! Very frustrating to get a quality finished product. Then there are the other job boards that have a different format!

CajunCenturion
What is your opinion on applying for the job that wants a skill/certification you do not possess? Would it red-flag you, like SQLSister mentions, or get your foot in a only partially shut door? If you send a resume for a job that states "MCSE Required", would you add something to the resume to explain why you feel you are qualified for the position without it?

^{Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw}
Consultant/Custom Forms & PL/SQL - Oracle 8.1.7 - Windows 2000

 

[CajunCenturion]

In a perfect world, where everyone says what they mean, then I would not apply for such a job that required some qualification that I did not possess. Unfortunately, that is not normally the case, in fact I'd say its rarely the case, and so I would definately apply for the job if I feel I'm qualified for it.

To answer specically your question, it most likely depends on the specific skill/certification being requested. If it's a certifcation they require, I'd apply anyway. All they can do is say No. If it's a certain number of years experience in a skill, then if I have any reasonable experience, I'd apply anyway. If a company is not interested in me because I only have 4 years experience in C++ and they want 5, then as far as I'm concerned, it would be their loss, but it would their decision not to consider me, not my choice to not give them the chance to consider me. Again, all they can say is No and as far as ruining any chances of ever being employed by them, or running the risk of not being considered by whomever they choose network the red-flag with, I'll take my chances. With respect to these types of situations, I don't think I would bring any attention to them at all. Let the resume/cover letter speak for itself.

If the skill that they are looking for is, let's assume a specific language, like LISP, then if I didn't know LISP I wouldn't apply. On th other hand, if they wanted Borland C++, I would still apply because I'm proficient in MS C++, and that IMHO is close enough to warrent consideration, but here I would make special note of the situation as to why I felt MS C++ experience could or should be considered in lieu of Borland C++. If it's a product they are looking for then I'd probably respond much the same. If I have something comparable, I would bring it to light and apply.

So in short, it depends on the specifics, but the benefit of the doubt would be to apply. After all, what's the best thing that can happen if you do apply, what's the best thing that can happen in you don't apply. And what's the worst if you do, and the worst if you don't apply.

Good Luck
--------------
As a circle of light increases so does the circumference of darkness around it. - Albert Einstein

 

[bi]

BJ: I wouldn't go any smaller than 10 pt. 11 pt. would be a better size, though. Make it 8 pt, and they may have to get out the magnifying glass! Using 8 pt may get it down to two pages, but it will look so cluttered, it won't be easy to read.

RTF format shouldn't count against you as it is supposed to be usable by many different word processors.

 

[SQLSister]

I wasn't saying you had to be an exact match, but that your qualifications shouldn't be so far off that no one would rate you as qualified. Like the examples I gave of the person with no experience just a degree applying for a senior developer or the people who aren't even programmers applying for a programming position.

 

[BJCooperIT]

SQLSister,

Thanks, I knew what you meant and value your opinion. I was thinking more along the lines of:

1. If they ask for Crystal Reports and you have extensive
Oracle Reports (very similar), would you still apply?

OR

2. If they wanted a Bachelor's degree and did not mention
a willingness to accept years of experience in lieu of
the degree. Would they likely just discard the resume?

^{Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw}
Consultant/Custom Forms & PL/SQL - Oracle 8.1.7 - Windows 2000

 

[SQLSister]

In those cases, you can apply. They may or may not reject your application especially on the education requirement. But explain in your cover letter why you think your experience is similar to the experience required or the equivalent of a degree. They may only look at you if no one meets their defined requirements. But if you explain why you think your experience makes you qualified at least they won't look at your resume and go "Why did this guy apply?"

When substituting other experience for what they wanted, it really helps if you have something special. We require a degree, but we waived it for the guy who actually published a book on the program we were hiring for. Who cares that he doesn't have a degree; he's an acknowledged expert.

 

[DonQuichote]

BJCooperIT,

...While I was able to make the 10 year+ summary fit in the earliest (last) job slot, it does not allow me to properly present myself.

I think you have made the most important point there. You know what you are worth, and you know you can do the job (you wouldn't apply for it if you didn't).

So, on my resume, I have a section "systems experience", which still states I used a commodore 64 when I was young. People who know the type of computer also know that you hacked every problem or inconvenience (such as copy protections) yourself instead of calling a support department.
People who don't usually ask, so that I can explain what internal computer knowledge it has given me.

I'd like to give you one tip for templates: I never encountered a template that could remotely fit my resume. But my resume was always on the internet, and a link to an HTML page always fits in whatever template there is. If you are afraid of publicizing too much personal details with such a page, include a

ROBOTS

metatag so search engines won't index it.

My resume states a lot of different experiences: Technical Draftsman, Draftsman/Programmer (yes, using LISP!) and finally programmer. It is not an average resume, but in my experience this only gets attention in a positive way. It also describes me for who I am: I am willing to learn and have to develop myself to be happy.

About degrees: experience is usually valued better than a degree. I only heared people complain that the lack of the degree made a difference in salary.

Best regards

 

[BJCooperIT]

DonQuichote,
I agree that I do know what I am worth. When I am on a team, like it or not, I become the backup analyst, DBA, and project leader - all with just a certificate (I went to a one-year programming school fresh out of high school and started my first programming job at 18).

Many of degreed 20-somethings I have worked with, who code well, sit back, watch, and wait to be told what to do. They do not know how to contribute to a project as a whole and often are reluctant to ask questions or speak up if they encounter a problem. I, on the other hand, put problems on the table, fill gaps when things need to get done, and mentor those who need guidance. They learn from me and I often learn from them, it is a symbiotic relationship. My years of experience count for much on the job if not on paper.

The primary function of a resume is to convey my worth to a potential employer. This is where I get bogged down. This is difficult to convey in a few short sentences. It is easy to cross the line from stating the facts to sounding like a braggart - or worse, sounding like you are lying.

All,
After 3 months of not receiving one response as a result of submitting an electronic resume, yesterday I got an email inquiry from a Sunday submission of my revised resume. This is encouraging (even if I don't get the contract). I had thought that my age would act in my favor as a consultant since most companies want to feel they are getting the most "bang" for their contracting buck. My, how times have changed.


^{Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw}
Consultant/Custom Forms & PL/SQL - Oracle 8.1.7 - Windows 2000

 

[DonQuichote]

BJCooperIT,

First of all: good luck with the interview!

On my resume, I have a short description on each project that is listed. Because I started working on short projects to pay for my study, there are a lot of them. And they do state my major achievements. For example, that I managed to make some parametric drawings in CADAM. This means that you just fill in a few variables, and the program starts drawing or adapting a complete technical drawing. Now, as far as I know, CADAM was never sold as capable of doing that, but I proved it possible. You can imagine it saved us quite some work.

However, I never thought about that as "too unbelievable". It only shows how creative someone can be with computers.

Although the projects themselves are described in just a few lines, my total resume is some 3 or 4 pages when printed. I never heared anyone complain about that.

Do not be afraid to put things like creativity, willingness to learn and insight in how to solve problems in your resume. Especially for a consultant, those properties are priceless.

Good luck!