Question for guys who are in IT for 10+ years 6

[routeconfig]

Hi guys,

I have completed 10 years in IT. Got jack of all for fields including Novell.Unix..Windows..Networking.Security..DB admin etc etc (as job requires)and still working as Technology Specialist..

The IT world keep changin every now and then..It seems to be we will not be able to keep that speed..getting OLD.. ( certifications kills me now..Newcomers are collecting lots of them)..

My questions for guys u guys..WHAT SHOULD WE DO NOW??REMAIN AS TECHNOLOGY SPECIALIST (which is not sure for anyone since market demand changes from platform) OR MOVE TOWARDS SOFT SKILLS (Project managemt/Consultant?)

Your thoughts will be most welcome!!

Jo

 

[MasterRacker]

Get into the soft skills. Expecially supervisory management and project management. You've seen the underbelly of how projects get implemented and you know how the technology works. Now you can work up the ladder of management bringing real-world experience to that table. If you try to stay strictly in technology, you will eventually fall behind. At best you'll be treading water.


Jeff
The future is already here - it's just not widely distributed yet...

 

[Dimandja]

Certifications are there to weed out the riff-raff. There are simply so many more candidates to choose from. My resume is solid enough that I have not had the need to try and collect those certifications.

However, if you are trying to break into a new field and away from your current clients, you may need to be certified.

I did do add new platforms recently -- web development, Visual Studio, etc. But then, my old customers started calling. Luckily, many of them are interested in these new platforms as well.

I guess keeping versatile in what you do is the key. Certifications are nice but, for an old timer, real skills are best. With a brand new certificate, the ground floor is all you can aspire to -- I don't think you want that.

 

[screwloose]

I am near the 10 year mark in IT and others may remember my posts asking “what next?”

For me it has become so routine and boring that I derive no enjoyment from the field that I used to. I also wonder that even within the industry, if I changed from Unix admin to say Web admin, or Unix admin to Security admin, I would feel the same way in a very short time – after the “newness” wore off.

I have considered going back to school so I would have a current degree in a field. Currently, I already have a bachelor’s degree in business administration and a master’s degree in education, but feel that a current master’s in a new field would give me what is necessary to start a new career. Also, having two master’s degrees would not relegate me to the salary offer of: “well we can start you at a pretty decent $22,000 with some nice benefits.” Plus, the baby-boomers are on the cuff to begin retiring and within the next few years will begin some employment gaps, which they are predicting will cause the next dot.com scenario, because there is not going to be enough of a highly-educated, technical and professional work force to replace those retiring, which is going to cause the same monetary practices business used for technology people. Large salaries to attract and keep employees; and possibly bonuses. In the future, it will be the educated worker who will fare better, because it is a knowledge economy and an economy that is based on skill.

I also would like to return to teaching someday and so I need to change from a hands-on day-today Unix admin to something else that will broaden the experience I can relay to students. Plus, the added education will be beneficial to teaching. I just need to find the next area I want to work in, because that area will most likely be the last until I return (hopefully) to teaching. My sister is completing her second endorsement (she is a teacher) and is considering getting her masters after she completes the new endorsement, but said only if I get my doctorate. I told her that wasn’t a fair comparison, but being on a campus is where I really feel at home and something I truly enjoy. So, while I am not sure about getting a PhD (that I would LOVE to have) I am strongly thinking of a second masters.

 

[johnherman]

I have 20 years in IS/IT, starting as a programmer. During that time I have been a Data Architect, Project Manager, Director (of Data Warehousing), Consultant, and Technology Specialist. For someone with 10 years experience, I don't think certifications mean a lot if you have the experience. And I agree with MasterRacker that the soft skills become more important as you gain experience. Experienced staff, even new (but experienced) staff members, are looked at as mentors, advisors, and repositories of knowledge and experience. You will be asked your opinion many times more than a newbie with less than 3 years, not only by your boss, but by business people, too.

If the opportunity presents itself to get into consulting for awhile, I would highly recommend it. The experience is invaluable. I consulted for consulting companies for three years, did another three years on my own or through contracting companies, and am now back as a F/T employee with a good company.

If you are worried about platform issues, get closer to the data. Whatever the server OS, whatever the presentation layer (touch screen, keyboard, PDA, phone, etc), the data is still what makes the system worthy of use. Without data, what good is a PDA or server? Play games? Even games have data. Just a thought.





-------------------------
The trouble with doing something right the first time is that noboby appreciates how difficult it was.
- Steven Wright

 

[gbaughma]

I also have 20 years in the field. Getting into management has always been a good option, because *good* managers are hard to find, and good managers that understand IT are almost non-existant.

You're right about certifications though... I mean, when I was in high school, our school had *gasp* two Apple 2e's. Now, your average high school kid can graduate with A+ and Cisco certification!

How can a guy pushing 40 compete with this? Experience, and people skills.

Just my thoughts..



Just my $0.02

"In order to start solving a problem, one must first identify its owner." --Me
--Greg

 

[arnoldmram]

Hi,

I agree with gbaughma. This mad race for certifications really cant get us anywhere. I know of a brilliant guy, in his early twenties, with 35+ papers to his credit and yet says he sees no stability in this field and has Finance as an alternate path.

Getting into the role of consultants or managers is definitely the best thing as you have already done a lot of hands on job which means you have all the ingredients to make a good tech manager!

Arnold

 

[MikeLacey]

Soft skills are the way to go, knowing what to do is the hard bit, knowing how to do it is the smallest part of most projects.

Mike

"Deliver me from the bane of civilised life; teddy bear envy."

Want to get great answers to your Tek-Tips questions? Have a look at faq219-2884

 

[mmorancbt]

Ah, my personal soapbox.

I wrote the article, Why Technologist Must Learn To Speak Business & The Role of Technology to address this exact issue.

http://www.cbtoolkit.com/consult/whytechnspeakbusiness.htm

I am a consultant earning $100K or more since 1995. I have no degree or certs but recently, my book, The IT Career Builder's Toolkit was purchased by Cisco Press to supplement their technical titles. FYI: I am not pointing this out to say, "Hooray for me," just to lend some credence to the information provided.

The book concentrates on soft-skills, business acumen, professional networking, and project development - in particular, aligning technology projects with value-driven business objectives.

FYI: This is not an advertisement ;-) The Book will not be released until early next year - so I am not selling anything..yet... However, the message I have been delivering consistently has placed me in meetings with top-executives and running small-business technology shops on a consulting basis (Virtual-CIO).

I am not against gaining certs and knowledge, per se, but the mis-conception is that they are career drivers. They are not. They are information drives (hopefully). The proper application of that information/knowledge is the career driver.

And I am very specific about the "proper" application. Many technologists have been "doing technology" instead or "providing solutions." One has a focus on the business objectives of efficiency & profitablilty - whether saving time or increasing revenue - the other has a focus on optimizing technical function and pet projects that are ill-advised.

The source of such projects might even be company management. However, a solution-driven technologist must have the foresight to assess a project's value and proactively suggest superior (value-rich) projects to management.

It is just a thought.

Matthew Moran

 

[routeconfig]

Thanks all for your suggestions.

Question come in mind; once you become consultant/PM.. you are not 100% in touch with Technology (e.g. not involve in DETAIL step by step procedure like implementation /troubleshooting etc), and will/can not fully complete project yourself..I mean you may need assistance (from other expert(sometime))

We will loose DETAILS/expertise (due to managerial/Admin duties)from all fields. I think that will happen eventually. But the gain is Knowing complete process cycle/implementing project etc. Am I correct?


Joe

 

[sostek]

I'm just about to embark on a program for my MBA. Already have my B.S. in InfoSci but I want to move more into the management and teaching side of things.

 

[wolluf]

routeconfig - read Matthew Moran's post. If you can talk the talk like he can, you can make big bucks, like he does.

But are you cut out for that? - after 10 years, you'd already be doing that if that was you. As you're not - your choices are - bite the bullet & buy into the bullshit (money, but can you live with it - if you can do it), continue trying to keep up, or find yourself a niche market, where you can satisfy yourself and your customers - ie, start your own business.

 

[mmorancbt]

Wolluf,

Your response seems to imply that I don't produce the technical product. I do more than "talk the talk" - although doing that is a good start.

However, just to make sure we are clear. The last two weeks I wrote some sql routines and an VBA module that uses web services to transmit data between a client and a vendor, checks the response, synchronizes data between their two systems.

I wrote an Outlook module that ties data from Goldmine, the company ERP database, and Exchange - to automate their sales process.

Tonight and tomorrow (between finalizing a couple book chapters and going to a radio interview) I will write a module that pulls data and creates some worksheets and graphical reports for cash-flow and bonus summaries.

This past year I rebuild their network, implemented QOS on their WAN, implemented a VOIP based phone system, wrote an intranet project with various web reports, etc.

I also ran two field technicians for their remote office conversion to the new system. I meet with other technology vendors and coordinate activities and projects and work with the executives and partners to analyze corporate goals and find places where technology can automate or simplify that work.

It is not an either/or proposition. It is a both/and. You must be good - at the technology and at the communication.

That, at least, should be the goal. I simply recognize it, don't complain about it, and find those people who can teach and mentor me.

I hope this helps.

Matthew Moran

 

[chelseatech]

Interesting subject.

I've got 25+ years in IT so can still remember loading disk packs into a IBM 1130 and using paper tape and punch cards.

In that time, I've done development (including PL/1, Cobol, Basic+, Foxpro and now VB6 and .NET), IT management, Sales, Network training and Consulting.

My advice. Keep skills up to date and specialise. Even when we go to a good technical conference like TechEd there are always some things of immediate and direct importance. But it's also worth while to go to a subject out of left field. All progress happens at the edge, not in the middle.

Be the best in a small (but productive) niche. I can no longer do it all, so have found an area that has growth potential, and is fun.

What advantages do we have over the new young ones with all the certificates? Experience in business. The ability to decide what is important and make a contribution that doesn't come out of a text book.

But keep reading these forums in case something comes along that we didn't expect. While everyone was looking at using Computers on their TV those guys in Chicago invented Netscape. Even Bill was suprised by that one.

Editor and Publisher of Crystal Clear

http://www.chelseatech.co.nz/pubs.htm

 

[GwydionM]

I started as a computer professional in the 1970s. I've managed to move with the times, picking up new skills.

Management and consultancy are particular skills. Only a minority of computer professionals are any good at it. If you don't have the knack for it, it can be a road to nowhere.

------------------------------
A view from the UK

 

[edwinmccrory]

Hi routeconfig;

Good question and worth exploring early.

I started in the computer business in 1960 with the UNIVAC file computer and have been associated in one way or another with just about all the models that have been sold in the 60s through the 90s. I was General Manager of a large service organization for 16 years covering all of Europe and the Middle East with 22 countries (subs) reporting to my organization. Through it all I kept up with the technical part of the computers, both hardware and software because I knew that one day-I would be irrelevant in my company (all execs were when they reached somewhere around 55 or 60)

These days if you have management skills I would ride that horse until it dies but keep your technical skills up for the possiblity that you may be able to use them after you are shifted aside in management. If you have the right company and are not a threat to the VP you may be able to stay in management until you retire. What then?

Well, after finding that it was almost impossible to break into the independant consulting business in less than 2 to 5 years in my area, I turned to new and different things that I had never before even thought of; e.g. Consulting with Seniors with desktop units to give them a help desk for whatever they may not be able to do and need help.
Currently I am VP of Operations for Echo Entertainment LLC; producing musical shows; at the same time constucting the video, music and other technical issues that are involved in show production.

You may not be interested in anything like that, but I tell you this just to illustrate that you should not be thinking narrowly and only in your field. You have learned a great deal of skill and informaiton that can easily be applied to other fields of endeavor.

Just a thought....

Ed

 

[ChrisHunt]

you have already done a lot of hands on job which means you have all the ingredients to make a good tech manager!

No you don't. Tech skills are important to managing an IT team, but they certainly aren't "all the ingredients". There are a lot of additional skills involved in management that are unrelated to any technical ability. If you're good at those other things, and you enjoy the new role, by all means move into management.

I know that in my case, though I'm a brilliant coder (and been in the biz for 15 years), I'm rubbish at management. I'd much rather be doing things myself than tell others what to do. Maybe that's because I'm good at one and bad at the other, or maybe the cause and effect is the other way around. You need to take a hard look at yourself and your skills (of all sorts) before you follow the Peter Principle and get promoted to your level of incompetence.

My escape route was to leave my permanent job and start contracting as a programmer-for-hire. That way I could stay coding, manage no-one but myself, but increase my income too. Been at it for 7 years and never looked back.

-- Chris Hunt
Webmaster & Tragedian
Extra Connections Ltd

 

[Skittle]

I have to agree with a lot thats been said here.

I have been in IT for 20 years as an analyst/programmer and am now joing the certificate bandwagon. Without them I'm in deep trouble. I don't like that they will be out of date in a few years time but I don't really like the idea of going into management ( all those petty personnel issues ) and to be honest by project management skills are weak.

I'd rather stay at the coding end but as you get older you have to be careful about where you work. For my next job I will be looking for a modest salary but highly secure location. I've had my eye on two such organisations for a while now.

Dazed and confused

 

[pipk]

Can't say what the US market is like, but here in the UK (I am also a 10 year bloke) the trend is for offshoring so unless you start learning Punjabi/Thai or Mandarin, your technical skills will be usurped by younger and very much cheaper 'dime a dozen' overseas coders.

The only thing I have going for me at the moment is that I am such a niche skill area at the moment, that my bosses have yet to find overseas labour that can replace me, however I give it 2 years before I am forced elsewhere. Unfortunately having niche skills means suitable positions elsewhere also come along infrequently.

I could move into management but I see the same thing happening there, either cheaper overseas labour, or too much competition at the lower management levels (from all these techies getting out of their own dead end doomed careers).

I know because my brother in law, a senior manager at an Insurance Software house, was made redundant last year just prior to a secondment to Canada for 2 years (the week he and his family had just bought their tickets!!) and spent the next year on the management scrap heap going from one interview to the next. Unlucky for him he is the wrong side of forty.

For me I can't see the situation improving, and even if I am OK now, I will just be in the same old situation a few years down the line, e regardless of whether I am stilla techie or a manager of some sort. I will just be slightly older and therefore slightly less attractive top a potential employer - bottom line is always going to be youth and cheapness over age - regardless of experience.

As a result I have decided that my current job will be my last in I.T. and am already making plans to move into languages (funnily enough I do speak Mandarin, ha ha).

It is a real shame what is happeing over here, a lot of experience is being written off or pensioned off and I believe the economy will suffer in the long term, however, todays companies seem to be more bothered about short erm money making rather than long term investment in their employees. It sucks but I guess that's life.

 

[mrdenny]

What I hearing from pipk is that once 40 starts to roll around, start planning on find a job to not be to easy? I've got plenty of time between then and now (I'm only 26), but from what I've been hearing on forums once 40 roles around, I'd better plan on having some major savings in the bank. And odds are that number will start getting lower.

Denny

--Anything is possible. All it takes is a little research. (Me)