Power Supply Requirements? 4

[chromarog]

I'm currently running a 1.3 duron on an abit kt7, non raid. I'm currently running a geforce2gts 32meg card. I bought an mx440 128meg card. I plugged it in, it booted fine, detected the card, all was looking good. I changed the resolution and lost power. It constantly reboots once it gets to the the XP user selection screen. It's a 300w power supply, I thought it was a 350 but it says on the sticker 315max. Not sure how I got that wrong but that was while ago. I have 3 hard drives on it, and 2cd's, (one ide dvd, and one scsi cdr on an adaptec 2940u/uw). If I put the old video card back on, it works fine. I suspect it's a power supply issue but here are my questions that have me puzzled:

1. I removed all the scsi hardware, no change. I haven't attmpted removing drives yet, due to space. (that's my next upgrade)

2. Would a 400w power supply do the trick or do I need to go bigger? I'm already on a super-tight budget and I have get the on sale/clearance items.

Thanks
Chomarog

 

[ceh4702]

There was recently an article at Toms Hardware:

http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/02q4/021021/index.html

It went into quite a lot of detail about power supplies. It had an example for the wattage a computer might be using. They suggested adding up all of the total hardware devices and estimating what their wattage is and taking 80% of the total for the required wattage.

You very seldom ever use all possible wattage on all devices. However, it showed that sometimes wattage requirements and guidelines could go over 300 watts. A lot depends on how many devices you have that are high wattage users like sound cards, video cards, etc. They had a profile made up showing how much power devices may be expected to use. They also had a comparison of power supplies. It showed that some power supplies died before they got to 100% of their rated amount. Some even popped components instead of shutting down properly. If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[Steve688]

Hi,

I doubt that this has anything to do with your power supply. It is most likely a problem with your video driver.

I had a similar problem with Windows 2000 after a video card change.

Try this:

Go to this MS knowledgebase article to get your XP started in safe mode.

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q315222

Try the "last known good configuration" option first, if it doesn't boot normally, try the "VGA" option next.

Once you get in, change the video driver to standard VGA and then try to reboot. After all that, check your card manufacturers website for an up-to-date driver for XP.

Hope that helps.

 

[cdogg]

With as many devices as you plan to run, 350W would be the very least I'd recommend. 400W would be more than enough leaving you further room for expansion. Also be careful on the brand you buy. I've recently read an article at Tom's Hardware (

http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/02q4/021021/index.html)

that stated some power supply manufacturer's are improperly labeling their parts. Just because the sticker says 350W, it might not be able to take a load of more than 300W or less. This is because cheap suppliers don't test at heavy loads or assume that you're not going to reach that limit. So be careful!!

~cdogg

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein

 

[chromarog]

Thanks, I checked it out and it was very informative. Thanks again.

Chromarog

 

[mikeindetroit]

To check your power supply you can do a few things. Get a new, nice high output one (400W) and see if anything changes. Before you go and do that though, try unplugging everything you do not need to boot. If you've still got the same (or different now) problem then it's likely not your power supply. Drives take up juice but they're only really hogging it when spinning up or doing large amounts of data transfers.

I doubt its the power supply.

Try booting XP in Safe-Mode or whatever will work (VGA Mode??) so you can tell it that your video card is a generic VGA or SVGA card. this will allow you to boot normally and troublshoot/diagnose the driver (unless i am still thinking about 9x days ) Do what you can to get it started and get the latest drivers from the manufacturer for it and tell windows about them.

Bet that fixes the problem.

-Mike

 

[ceh4702]

I have seen a lot of people have problems with an MX440 video card. It cant run much better than a Gforce 2 GTS. Just try getting an RMA and returning it and buy a different video card. Make sure your AGP port is the right number of volts for your present video card. I am using a visiontek Geforce 2 GTS-V 32 MB DDR video card that runs great. If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[ceh4702]

Also, not all power supplies can run at their stated wattage level; most quit at about 80% This is one thing they talked about in the article at

http://WWW.TOMSHARDWARE.COM/

If you do not like my post feel free to point out your opinion or my errors.

 

[SQLScholar]

psu`s can be cheap.

If in UK go to novatech they do aa 500w one for about £35ish ----------------------------------------
There are 2 types of computer, the prototype and the obsolete!!

 

[CitrixEngineer]

thread602-388908

...don't believe everything that PSU makers claim - especially if the PSU is cheap... CitrixEngineer@yahoo.co.uk

 

[chromarog]

I replaced the power supply and it did the same thing. I tried it in another system and installed different drivers and it did the same thing. The memory chips on the opposite side of the agp port were extremely hot. More-so than the others, and even more to the mx chip itself (where I could feel on the back of the card). I'm gonna RMA it for a different one.

I'm considering a GF4 4200 128meg card. Any bad word about that card?

ChromaRog

 

[cdogg]

You don't currently have a PCI card in the slot right next to the AGP port, do you? If it's an overheating problem, it's probably not just the card. Replacing it is a start, but it might not solve the problem. How many fans are in your rig - 1 in, 1 out?

Check your AGP voltage support and make sure it's identical to what the card requires.


~cdogg

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein

 

[chromarog]

I did have a scsi card there, but in the process of eliminating peripherals to cut down on power cosumption, it was first to go. I also have the side of the case off for cooling.

ChromaRog

 

[cdogg]

Your motherboard sports the VIA KT133A chipset. Since the problem doesn't occur until you get into XP, I'm starting to lean in the direction of a driver issue. First, make sure you've installed the latest VIA 4-in-1 drivers. Then make sure you have the latest Nvidia drivers (which I would get from the card's manufacturer's site, not Nvidia in case they're customized).

If you still have problems, check the settings for the AGP card in the BIOS and post back.

~cdogg

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein

 

[chromarog]

I had the same problem with a machine at work which is compaq deskpro p3 550 with the card installed with the manufacturers drivers cd. It seemed like when the card got warmed up. Then it did it. I have the latest 4-in-1 drivers and I never got a chance to apply latest detonator drivers. I can't remember the ones I have but they aren't the newer ones as the newer ones don't really boost my current cards performance. I thought that if it were a driver issue, the pc I have to test it on at work would not choke because I used the manufacturer driver cd.

 

[garebo]

I can add this:

So many times I see a thread and the person blaming the power supply. In the end it always (so far) turns out to be something else.
Power supplies are very important, that is why I am running an Antec 350 watt for my rig. But they should not always be the first culprit in our minds either.
If I told you what I am running on my rig at 350 watts you would tell me I need 400 or 500 watts, yet my system has been fine for a year and a half now. Don't get me wrong, wattage is important too, but I just think it gets overstated a bit as well.
Personally I think you have a driver issue or an icompatibility issue or maybe even a bad card. I dont think its the power supply.

 

[cdogg]

If you take all the devices out of the system except the video card, hard drive, mobo, RAM, and CPU, and you still have the problem, then the power supply is not the cause my friend...more power is not the solution!

It might be a long road still ahead of ya, but you can pretty much bet that it's a driver conflict, video card hardware problem, or incompatibility with your AGP slot (always verify that the voltages match up). ~cdogg

"The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources."
- A. Einstein

 

[mikeindetroit]

Everyone remember that a PS might be rated at 400 or 500 watts, but not supplying enough wattage/voltage/amperage on the needed leads. Read all requirements then check the sticker on the PS for lead supply details. Might check the manufacturer website/phone number for details if they're not on the label.

Your problem, Chromarog, is likely a driver/compatibility issue, as everyone else seems to indicate.

New drivers, fresh install (no install over old version installs), maybe test with a different OS or Windows version.

Work on one problem at a time (attempt at a solution that is). Keep the variables as low as possible. It will definately help. Also, never hurt to set your BIOS options to 'fail-safe' mode, or set them all to lowest performance/highest stability.

Good luck.

Mike

 

[gargouille]

So far, I've just been watching this thread...but the responses have finally urged me to post my opinion:

Set the BIOS to initial display 1st=AGP and make sure the BIOS isn't set to halt on all errors.

BTW, unchecking the automatically reboot and allowing an admittedly cryptic message to appear as to why the BS (blooscreen)is happening is far better IMHO than wondering WTF happened!
Boot to safe mode and change the setting...you might not be far enough along in the boot process for it to reveal anything useful, but it may.
Having done that, you can also look at Event Viewer for clues. You may have to start the service.

Here's a link thrown in on a successful install of MX card in a system with your motherboard with very detailed steps:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?R2F962142

It of course is not an XP, system, but it may help you get booted. (if you're still trying)

Seems just booting into the OS is the primary objective...and if you can make it there, WinXp has put some wonderful native troubleshooting tools in the toolbox that would certainly lead to better understanding what the problem is...and how to solve it.

dxdiag at Start/Run can be an invaluable aid at troubleshooting video issues (which I too, am convinced you're facing). If any test fails, disable then reenable it. Sometimes this cures the problem. Also pay attention to the comments section of the dialog.

Just a friendly (emphasis friendly) reminder to JimJohn:
Anarchy rules, dude: anyone can do anything with their computer. A lot of the systems I'm putting together are overkill...and after I tell the customer what I think I go ahead and give them what they want.

A friend has utilized a fat pipe and an insatiable appetite for collecting music, amassing 87 Gb of the hits of the 50s to today...and offered me a transfer if I supplied a 100 Gb hd.
I passed on this one, but instead run a raid setup with matched WD1000JB's and an old 30 Gb hd for backup imaging.
Is it silly? I think it's NYB!

And finally the talk about not enough power supplied:
latest Maximum PC has a kid who put 37 OS on six hard drives (53 if you count flavors of DOS) and he did it with a QUALITY 350-watt power supply. He did it because an online computer expert said that it couldn't be done!

Short p.s. It's amusing that ceh provides a link and invokes no response...no star...and then along comes cdogg (probably responding at the same time with no knowledge of what anyone else had said) with the same thread link and HE gets a star! That element isn't working on my system right now, but when it is I'll come back and give ceh his, too!

 

[ANFPS26]

I think everyone should have more than one harddrive with Norton Ghost backups of each on the other ones. So, when one dies, you can recover from another one. Just me. I don't like having all my eggs in one basket. "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing....."