jmd0252
Programmer
- May 15, 2003
- 667
I may be in the market for a new graphics card. I do not want to start a NVIDA vs ATI discussion. What are your opions on the interfaces AGP vs PCI????
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PCI or AGP, for graphics card
- Thread starter jmd0252
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maxthedork
MIS
AGP is faster than PCI, but PCI-Express is faster still. PCI is old 32-bit technology. Most motherboards today come with either AGP or PCI-E slots.
jmd0252
PCI EXPRESS???? has the potential to be faster but only the most powerful cards will take advantage of the increased band width offered by the faster connection.
Middle and entry level cards fall well within the capabilities of the older 8X AGP bus so systems with the same card (PCIe and AGP) show little performance difference.
On purely practical terms,it would make more sense going with a motherboard that supports the newer interface,
besides the more modern motherboards are likely to have newer/faster chipsets and be equipt with extra features.
Martin
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PCI EXPRESS???? has the potential to be faster but only the most powerful cards will take advantage of the increased band width offered by the faster connection.
Middle and entry level cards fall well within the capabilities of the older 8X AGP bus so systems with the same card (PCIe and AGP) show little performance difference.
On purely practical terms,it would make more sense going with a motherboard that supports the newer interface,
besides the more modern motherboards are likely to have newer/faster chipsets and be equipt with extra features.
Martin
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PCI-Express came out way, way ahead of its time. For video, there's no real advantage when you compare the performance of a single card. The only real benefit at this time is that you'll find more options when making a purchase for the PCI-E interface than you will for AGP.
Of course, the other small benefit is SLI, which allows you to run two video cards at once on motherboards that have two PCI-E slots capable of x8 speeds. In many cases, it will provide a 10-15% jump in performance over a single card. But the increase totally depends on what you're using it for.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Of course, the other small benefit is SLI, which allows you to run two video cards at once on motherboards that have two PCI-E slots capable of x8 speeds. In many cases, it will provide a 10-15% jump in performance over a single card. But the increase totally depends on what you're using it for.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
- Thread starter
- #5
Your choice is going to be restricted by what your motherboard supports. If it is AGP only, then you will need an AGP card (or a new video card and motherboard). If it has PCI Express on it, then you will need a PCI-E video card. Right now, the newer and better cards are only being made in PCI-E form factors. The last generation of cards were available in both formats, but there won't be any "new" model AGP cards in the forseeable future.
Regarding the DVD authoring, the video card doesn't have anything to do with that. It is your CPU that is encoding the data. The video card can assist with playback, but just about any modern video card has hardware-assisted video playback features.
Regarding the DVD authoring, the video card doesn't have anything to do with that. It is your CPU that is encoding the data. The video card can assist with playback, but just about any modern video card has hardware-assisted video playback features.
jmd0252,
Frank has a good point. Realize that there is a difference between basic PCI and PCI-Express. If your mobo has an AGP slot, then it will not have a PCI-Express slot.
And as kmcferrin said, the video card does not affect the speed of DVD authoring. If you edit digital video with software like Adobe Premiere, for example, then the choice of card can make a big difference. But for just encoding video to VOB format and writing to DVD, the video card will have no effect.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Frank has a good point. Realize that there is a difference between basic PCI and PCI-Express. If your mobo has an AGP slot, then it will not have a PCI-Express slot.
And as kmcferrin said, the video card does not affect the speed of DVD authoring. If you edit digital video with software like Adobe Premiere, for example, then the choice of card can make a big difference. But for just encoding video to VOB format and writing to DVD, the video card will have no effect.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
jmd0252
I know I'll probably get shouted down again but it probably would help knowing more about your present hardware setup and just what you are trying to achieve, that way we won't have to second guess on what you are trying to achieve.
As I have said in previous threads, it helps to post as much info in the first introduction, that way the replies will be more concise and appropriate.
I will add that encoding video is predominently down to the CPU but is also effected by the platform itself. This generally means newer motherboards will have shorter encoding times due to improved performance from the latest chipsets (because of the increased bandwidth that they offer over older types)
The same can also be said for faster/lower latencey memory.
Martin
We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
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I know I'll probably get shouted down again but it probably would help knowing more about your present hardware setup and just what you are trying to achieve, that way we won't have to second guess on what you are trying to achieve.
As I have said in previous threads, it helps to post as much info in the first introduction, that way the replies will be more concise and appropriate.
I will add that encoding video is predominently down to the CPU but is also effected by the platform itself. This generally means newer motherboards will have shorter encoding times due to improved performance from the latest chipsets (because of the increased bandwidth that they offer over older types)
The same can also be said for faster/lower latencey memory.
Martin
We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.
- Thread starter
- #12
jmd0252
Programmer
- May 15, 2003
- 667
Well, I have posted another question. In this same form, due to a possible MB problem,, I may be replacing my MB. So my question, was for future consideration. If I have to do a MB replacement,, should I look at the standard AGP, or the newer PCI. Which path, would be the best considering the new Vista, on the horizon, the fact that I am starting to do DVD authoring, which I undertand is a CPU intensive job, and since I end up changing hardware about every 2 - 3 years. I did not want an ATI vs Nvida battle, brand maybe incidental, functionality and capability is important however, and of course cost.
If you are buying new hardware (MB and video card) go with PCI-E. Otherwise your future upgrade options will be severely limited, as AGP is being phased out.
As mentioned previously, PCI-X and PCI-E are two different things. PCI-X is a high-speed PCI interface typically used in server motherboards. PCI-E is PCI Express, and that is what the newer video cards are using. They are not compatible.
There are many motherbaords out there that have AGP and PCI-X., which is largely irrelevant to this poster's request since there are no such thing as PCI-X video cards. There are also one or two motherbaords out there that have an AGP and a PCI Express slot on them, but they cannot be used simultaneously and you must change a large number of jumpers to go from one to the other. They typically are targetted at the value-conscious PC builder who wants to use their existing AGP card while moving up to a Socket 939 CPU platform (the ones that I have seen are all S939), and then have the potential to go to PCI-Express later. But if the OP is talking about getting a new video card now, they aren't a practical option.
As mentioned previously, PCI-X and PCI-E are two different things. PCI-X is a high-speed PCI interface typically used in server motherboards. PCI-E is PCI Express, and that is what the newer video cards are using. They are not compatible.
There are many motherbaords out there that have AGP and PCI-X., which is largely irrelevant to this poster's request since there are no such thing as PCI-X video cards. There are also one or two motherbaords out there that have an AGP and a PCI Express slot on them, but they cannot be used simultaneously and you must change a large number of jumpers to go from one to the other. They typically are targetted at the value-conscious PC builder who wants to use their existing AGP card while moving up to a Socket 939 CPU platform (the ones that I have seen are all S939), and then have the potential to go to PCI-Express later. But if the OP is talking about getting a new video card now, they aren't a practical option.
Johnthephoneguy
Technical User
if you believe youa re going to be doing a lot of video intensive work then go the SLI route and use 2 video cards.
Actually, there is one. On my current work project I wanted to capture high resolution RGB (1024x768@60Hz@24-bit and @60fps) from an external source and display it "picture in a picture" on my Windows desktop. Matrox makes a PCI-X capture card that works paired with a PCI-X dual monitor capable graphics card. I put built it into a rackmount with PCI-X/PCI passive backplane and a PCI-X dual Xeon CPU board. Here's a link >>
PCI-X is not a widely used interface in desktop systems. In the past, it was heavily used on motherboards targeted for the server market. And since we know jmd0252 was referring to PCI-Express, any additional points about it are moot.
jmd0252,
You'll be fine going with either one - AGP 8x or PCI-Express - since there are still plenty of offerings out there for either. However, PCI-Express will have slightly more to offer in terms of video card selection. Therefore, it makes more sense to go with PCI-E.
I suggest you go to or for hardware reviews, or pick up the latest copy of Maximum PC magazine. You should find all the info you need. Unless your question gets any more specific, there's not a whole lot else to say. Just asking what you should get in general will get you so many different opinions to the point where every new product on the market will be suggested to you...
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
jmd0252,
You'll be fine going with either one - AGP 8x or PCI-Express - since there are still plenty of offerings out there for either. However, PCI-Express will have slightly more to offer in terms of video card selection. Therefore, it makes more sense to go with PCI-E.
I suggest you go to or for hardware reviews, or pick up the latest copy of Maximum PC magazine. You should find all the info you need. Unless your question gets any more specific, there's not a whole lot else to say. Just asking what you should get in general will get you so many different opinions to the point where every new product on the market will be suggested to you...
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
- Thread starter
- #17
jmd0252
Programmer
- May 15, 2003
- 667
I appreiciate you guys,, sometimes you need to widen your point of view. I knew AGP, was on the decline, and the newer PCI-Express, was gaining ground. The dual card, feature of SLI, or crossfire, or whatever Nvida calls theirs, is tempting, but I cannot afford that much money. But I wanted a perspective, on staying wth AGP or moving. And I have found that discussion fosters better thought,, so thanks a lot guys.
jmd0252
Perspective!!! of course but if you want perspective we need to have a starting point and an aim!
So I ask AGAIN! what is your present setup AND
What are you trying to acheive, what are your goals?
I just don't know how a discussion can go on and on like this without having proper background information.
Martin
We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.
Perspective!!! of course but if you want perspective we need to have a starting point and an aim!
So I ask AGAIN! what is your present setup AND
What are you trying to acheive, what are your goals?
I just don't know how a discussion can go on and on like this without having proper background information.
Martin
We like members to GIVE and not just TAKE.
Participate and help others.
- Thread starter
- #19
jmd0252
Programmer
- May 15, 2003
- 667
Martin,,
Present setup is am 128 Nvida graphics, running on a 3 year old Gigabyte MB, with and AMD processor. MB and processor are suspect, hard drive was replace last year, and so was power supply, and a dvd RW was added. So if I replace the MB, question was which graphics interface do I need to choose for the new one. I will stay with AMD, used them ever since, I used a slot 1 processor, running at 1.0. SLI was considered, but cost is a factor, and do I really need that much HP, just to run VISTA, when it hits? Any furthur questions?
Present setup is am 128 Nvida graphics, running on a 3 year old Gigabyte MB, with and AMD processor. MB and processor are suspect, hard drive was replace last year, and so was power supply, and a dvd RW was added. So if I replace the MB, question was which graphics interface do I need to choose for the new one. I will stay with AMD, used them ever since, I used a slot 1 processor, running at 1.0. SLI was considered, but cost is a factor, and do I really need that much HP, just to run VISTA, when it hits? Any furthur questions?
jmd0252,
Looking over this thread, it appears that all of your questions have been addressed.
** I'm assuming you now know to get PCI-Express on your next motherboard.
** I'm assuming you now know that the video card doesn't affect DVD authoring
** I've already mentioned that SLI will not give you a huge increase in performance overall
SLI is mostly a decision based on your gaming needs. It will have little or no impact in other areas. Even in gaming, it will rarely give you an increase beyond 10-15% over just running a single card. But keep in mind that even those numbers don't matter, since there are faster non-SLI compatible cards coming out all the time.
The point to have SLI is a moot one in the terms you've asked your question regarding Vista, the OS. It's not that important in those terms. It is nice to buy an SLI-capable motherboard to give you that option down the road, but it's not an option to be that concerned about.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
Looking over this thread, it appears that all of your questions have been addressed.
** I'm assuming you now know to get PCI-Express on your next motherboard.
** I'm assuming you now know that the video card doesn't affect DVD authoring
** I've already mentioned that SLI will not give you a huge increase in performance overall
SLI is mostly a decision based on your gaming needs. It will have little or no impact in other areas. Even in gaming, it will rarely give you an increase beyond 10-15% over just running a single card. But keep in mind that even those numbers don't matter, since there are faster non-SLI compatible cards coming out all the time.
The point to have SLI is a moot one in the terms you've asked your question regarding Vista, the OS. It's not that important in those terms. It is nice to buy an SLI-capable motherboard to give you that option down the road, but it's not an option to be that concerned about.
~cdogg
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein
[tab][navy]For general rules and guidelines to get better answers, click here:[/navy] faq219-2884
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