OS X AGFA PPD Imagesetter issue 5

[Tuck007]

We are using a AGFA AccuSet 800 Plus Imagesetter here. We've been using Mac OS X with Classic and OS 9.2.2. In 9.2.2, all our applications can make use of the PPD for the 800, allowing proper linescreen defining and resolution for all our seperations. All the applications we use (Quark, Illustrator, Freehand, Pagemaker, InDesign, and Acrobat) can print and make use of the Print dialog boxes just fine, all the options from the PPD are availible.
This is not the same in OS X. If we use the OS 9 PPD, we get options. If we use a PPD for anopther AGFA product, we can still print, and we get the resolution options. I wanted to find out if anyone has seen a good imagesetter PPD that works with this model AGFA or can help troubleshoot? Are there any specific forums or FAQs in this area. I have visited the AGFA website and there is very llittle to no support for this product in OS X. Apple's website has provided a lot of information for general printing procedures, but nothing specific.

.:TUCK:.

 

[ggdebgg]

What driver are you using?

 

[Chuck12563]

What PPD have you been able to get to work under OSX?
I have an Agfa Accuset 1000 Plus with a Viper RIP.

Print Center will not recognize the PPD, and my Mac sees the RIP, but hangs it up trying to commuicate with it.

All I want to do is make PostScript files that take advantage of what my imagesetter and RIP can do.

This is not an issue for Illustrator 10 or 11 or for InDesign because they use their own print engines and recognize my PPD.

But Quark 6 is a different story, it relies on a printer configured in Print Center.

If you find anything out, please let me know. Right now I'm tyring to re-write my PPD to try to make it OS X friendly.

Chuck

 

[Tuck007]

We have tried using the OS 9 PPD, and the converted OS 9 to X PPDs. There was all the ones from OS X. We have been having the same issues with any application in OS X, Quark 6 specifically. Trying to get the RIP to take the file and process it correctly has been very difficult. We are using the Viper RIP too. Agfa has no support for this issue as far as I can find. Whenever we run a job, it comes out as all default settings, not what was setup in the Print Dialog boxes.

.:TUCK:.

 

[Chuck12563]

Instead of trying to re-write the PPD, I found one that works.

Go to Adobe's site (

http://www.adobe.com)

to their downloads section and look for the PPD section. You will find a listing for AGFA. Download it and in it are PPDs for all of AGFA's imagesetters, but these are ones that I never saw before. The one that you want is called "AGFA AccuSet 800-A" (PS Level 2).

This PPD is really for the Taipan RIP, but it will also work with the VIPER. It may give you a "PSE Environment" warning, but it still works. I am using the "AGFA AccuSet 1000W-A" (PS Level 2) and it works for me.

Here is my setup:
Accuset 1000 Plus
VIPER 1.9.2 RIP (PS Level 2) running on a Mac.

Our workflow is to make PostScript files of everything that we want to image and drop them into a "HOT Folder" and set the RIP to "Hot Folder" mode. We do not image anything directly to the RIP. We also have all of our Mac's as dual boot machines and do most of our work in OS 9 (not Classic mode under OS X).

The PPD that we use under OS 9 is from 1998 ("AC1000.PPD&quot and we started using it when Quark 4 came out. This PPD solved page orientation problems that we were having with Quark 4 and our old PPD which was "Agfa Accuset 1000.ppd"

Now our OS 9 PPD (AC1000.PPD) is a PPD Format "4.2" (you can open a PPD in any text editor to see the Format Version Type.) Print Center under OS X does not like this PPD and fails to use it. Even setting up a "Virtual PS Printer" using the IP printing and "localhost" stuff does not work correctly. And "Auto Setup under OS X cannot commuicate correctly to the VIPER RIP--it does see it and communicates with it, but the answers that the VIPER gives OS X or the queries from OS X cause the session to hang and fail.

The "New" PPD "AGFA AccuSet 1000W-A" is a Format 4.3 PPD. This OS X likes.

I'm just curious, when you said that you had OS 9 PPDs converted to OS X PPDs what did you mean.

Chuck

 

[Tuck007]

Wow, I will look into that this week! I don't think anyone here would have thought to look at Adobe for Agfa PPDs. I haven't been with this company too long, but it sounds like both companies have run into the same issues and fixes for things.

We have an Agfa Accuset 800 and a SelectSet 7000 (running 13" and 26" film, but is not our primary machine), and we use VIPER on both. Generally, we print using the Network RIP Mode. This works fine and we don't use the Hot Folder mode unless our PS job file is over 300~500MB. We too have had issues, and still do someties, with page orientation. We generally make our page size, in the print dialog box, square (12" x 12&quot. This works well, if the orientation spins, we still get everything imaged. We also stay Dual booted with OS 9 as many customers are still using Quark 4, Illustrator 9, and PageMaker 7. Even using Classic envoriment under OS X, we can print just fine. We have yet to get Quark 6, Photoshop, InDesign, or Freehand to print properly from OS X. They do print, but we can't control the resolution or Agfa specific controls, such as screen filters.

My co-worker had told me when I began tackling this problem, that he had tried taking the PPDs from OS 9 and selecting them when setting up the printer. He said new files had appeared after he did this. Upon going back to try other PPDs, the newly created files were selected. As I wasn't there when he did this, I had to take his word. Opening them with an editor, they looked a little different than the originals, I guessed they had been converted to an OS X standard, but they never worked.

.:TUCK:.

 

[SunshineGal]

I sure am glad I stumbled upon this discussion - we too are running an Accuset 800 with Viper Rip and having problems... however I'm on OSX 10.3 (Panther). Which are you running? Also, I tried downloading the PPD from Adobe's site, which does attempt to image from InDesign but it gives me an error "Warning: This RIP is not running a PSE Framework." I don't know what that means, any idea? I haven't yet tested fonts/layouts/etc in InDesign yet and haven't even tried going through Quark yet. I can't find any other place on the net with people running these imagesetters on OSX, have you found anything else? Thanks for all your help!!!

 

[Tuck007]

I did a lot of looking as well as coming here. I consider this forum one of the best for technical discussions and assistance. I searched the forums here a lot and I ran into some other printing discusssions, but not on this specific topic.

We are running OS X 10.2 on one machine and I have a failed installation of OS X 10.3 (Pre-release) on my machine. Generally, we use Quark 5, but we have been trying to use the beta and pre-releases of Quark 6. We're not ready to drop $1000 in something our customers don't even use yet.

I do not prefer to use InDesign. Mind you, I will, but I prefer Quark or PageMaker (I can't believe I just said I prefer PageMaker!).

.:TUCK:.

 

[Chuck12563]

Tuck,
The "Upgrade" for Quark 6 from version 5 is only $200, but I agree, why get it if nobody is using it.

SunshineGal,
You can use an older, yes older, PPD with InDesign and Illustrator under OS X. The older PPD is called "AC0800.PPD". This PPD will not give you the PSE warning. It will work because InDesign and Illustrators built-in print engine can see it and use it were as OS X cannot.

PSE stands for PostScriptEnvironment. The Viper is a CPSI (Configurable PostScript Interpreter) RIP. As the Viper RIP was updated (1.9, 1.9.1, 1.9.2, 3.0) the PostScript Environment was also updated (10, 10.4, 11, 12). The PPDs from the Adobe site (which by the way are not longer available on the Agfa site) are really meant for PSE 12. If your Viper is version 1.9.2 then you are probably using PSE 11. The warning you get is just a warning. Your PS files will be OK and your jobs will print correctly. What you won't be able to do is customize that PPD with embedded Calibration curves or use it to override certain specialized defaults in the RIP.

Remember, the Viper will image ANY valid PS from ANY source and will do so using it's default settings. If you look at the Viper log file you will see that at the beginning and end of every file that it processes, it states a resolution, line screen value, POS/NEG value and a Right/Wrong reading value. Those are the Defaults set for your RIP. Some of these you can change using the AgfaSet application (3, 3.1.1, 3.1.2) that is part of that whole PSE thing. Some defaults (like line screen) have to be set in your UserBoot file.

For instance, my defaults are 2400 DPI, 133 Line Screen, Positive and Right reading. We get Negs by setting the Accuset (not the RIP) to W-wrong N-Negative. It UNcomplicates the workflow tremdously because the same PS file that is used to image the film is also used to generate PDFs from Distiller for soft proofing or hard proofing (lasers).

We also have a permanent Calibration file active at the RIP so all of our tints are spot on with a variance of +-.5%..

If you have been unable to get Calibration files to work, then you need a patch for the Viper that is on the Agfa site. If you are having trouble with your dongle sometimes not working, there is a patch to fix that too.

Go to this Agfa Link.

http://support.agfa.com/support/EN/home.jsp?jsessionid=3442671065133147069

This is the only place on the Agfa site that has anything, (i.e. software update, manuals, FAQs, Info Sheets) for any of the older Agfa products like the VIPER RIP and the older Accusets.

Hope this info was helpful.

Chuck

 

[Tuck007]

For instance, my defaults are 2400 DPI, 133 Line Screen, Positive and Right reading. We get Negs by setting the Accuset (not the RIP) to W-wrong N-Negative. It UNcomplicates the workflow tremdously because the same PS file that is used to image the film is also used to generate PDFs from Distiller for soft proofing or hard proofing (lasers).

Amen to that! We have our Accuset setup the same way. When doing Negs that require a PDF proof, we just run the job to PS file and distill it. When it's been approved we just run the job the same, just direct to the RIP. We can also run it to an Fiery RIP for Epson prints or make Match Prints from the film.

I had a recent issue with a customer concerning tints. He brought a sample that we had printed to film and he ran, and then ran a direct to plate. It was clear that our negs were printing a darker tint, more than 5% which can sometimes be expected. I will have yto look into those calibration files.

.:TUCK:.

 

[Chuck12563]

Tuck,

You will need Calibrator 4.0 or 4.1 depending on your setup. You will also need the "VIPER1.9.X_XFER_RES_PATCH.sea" from Agfa's site to fix the bug in the Viper that prevents Calibration files from working. You will also need a Densitometer to take readings of your film..

An uncalibrated imagesetter can be off as much as 20% (usually too dark).

Download the Info sheets on the Agfa site on how to set up Calibration files. The procedure in the manual that came with the Viper is incorrect and doesn't work.

Here's a comparison of requested values versus Acutal Values

Wanted---------Measured
100.0------------100
95.0--------------98
90.0--------------94
85.0--------------90
80.0--------------85.5
75.0--------------81
70.0--------------77
65.0--------------72
60.0--------------67
55.0--------------62.5
50.0--------------57.5
45.0--------------51.5
40.0--------------45.5
35.0--------------40
30.0--------------34.5
25.0--------------29
20.0--------------23
15.0--------------17
10.0--------------12
5.0----------------6
0.0----------------0

In this example the problem areas are in the midtones and shadow areas.

If you change Brands of film, you need to re-calibrate for that film. You may even have to recalibrate for different "lots" of film within the same brand. It takes time to do, but it makes all the difference in the world, especially if you run a lot of 4/C seps.

Chuck

 

[macaholic]

sounds like I'm onto something here.....
We use an Agfa Accuset 1000, and we need to create linescreens of 55, 65, 75, and 85. We output to an Agfa Viper RIP on a networked mac, and we would like to do this with OS X (and stop using OS 9). Can anyone tell me how to do this directly from Quark in OS X (or even through illustrator for that matter)?
I need to assign custom screen angles and various linescreens (we output EVERYTHING at 3000 dpi positve em. up. Is there a easy step - by step method that we can follow to accomplish this (other than upgrading the RIP)

 

[Tuck007]

macaholic ,

The 800 I use, goes up to 2400 DPI, but thats all we ever need at 200 ~ 133 linescreen. We print all the way down to 45 linescreen for shirt positives. To do this of course the Agfa Screen Filter must be set to Off in the Printer Specific dialog box.

Quark allows you to manually adjust the linescreen in it's print dialog box under Output tab. If you want to go below 65, just type it into the lpi box. If you want to go beyond 2400, type it into the dpi box. you can manually change the screen angles too.
Illustrator does the same thing in it's seperations dialog box. You will have to first use the lpi/dpi that is allowed from the PPD. Next, you can manually change each seperation to a different lpi or screen angle.

.:TUCK:.

 

[dstanek]

I am running mac os x.3 and quark 6. All of a sudden I cannot get my agfa rip to work...it hangs. But keeps putting a resolution 133,45. I actually erased the ppd and used it empty. It came up with the same thing. It won't even write postcript files...help I need to run film. Anyone have suggestions? (I tried deleting all the pref files etc...)

 

[Tuck007]

Printing at 133, 45 sounds like a defualt that the AGFA has set. If you still have Quark 5, launch that in Classic and get the job out for now. Otherwise, follow the instructions that were posted in this thread about downloading the PPD from Adobe's Website by Chuck12563.

.:TUCK:.

 

[Tuck007]

Chuck12563 (TechnicalUser) wrote on Nov 9, 2003:
Go to Adobe's site (

http://www.adobe.com)

to their downloads section and look for the PPD section. You will find a listing for AGFA. Download it and in it are PPDs for all of AGFA's imagesetters, but these are ones that I never saw before. The one that you want is called "AGFA AccuSet 800-A" (PS Level 2).

I could not find the PPD Section of Adobe's Download section. Could you either post the link or email me the file you downloaded at chris at guardlitho dot com Thanks!

.:TUCK:.

 

[macaholic]

Thanks Tuck for your reply:

However, I already have the Balanced Screening turned off, as we use this in Classic. The problem I am having is setting up the print driver in the first place in OS X. Any short guideline on how to do that (where to put it, what to name it, how to get Print Centre to recognize it etc, and how to configure any driver-based options etc)

Thanks again,

Mac

 

[sungrafx]

hi all. i too run an Accuset800 and Viper, we just upgraded to Panther and are starting our testing and troubleshooting. i suggest everyone go to agfa.com click on SUPPORT, then click on ASK, register on the site to submit directly to t tech for the image setter in question. in my experience, the more request they get about a problem, the more likely it is they will respond. the work around you have come up with are good. i will keep everyone informed with any info i come up with.

 

[Chuck12563]

The link to the PPDs at Adobe's site is as follows:

http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/product.jsp?product=44&platform=Macintosh

Scroll down that page and you will see a Section for PPDs. The Agfa PPDs are the 7th one down.

Under OS X, the "Automatic" PPD selection doesn't work with the Viper RIP. Manually choose the PPD for your machine. You can put the PPD anywhere you want, just use the browse function to find it.

There are no "Driver" options to configure because there is no longer any "Driver" (i.e. PSPrinter, LaserWriterDriver) under OS X as there is under OS 9. The Mac OS X has the PostScript "Driver" built-in. You only need to supply a PPD file (PostScript Printer Description) that OS X can see and use.

The 3 key factors here are RIP, PPD and OS X--NOT your imagesetter. Buy a new PS Level 3 RIP for your imagesetter and probably the RIP software will come out of the box OS X friendly. The Viper PS Level 2 RIP can drive a variety of imagesetters AND Agfa's Imagesetters can be set up to use a variety of different RIPs. This variety or flexibility is built into the PPDs that most of you use under OS 9, and it is exactly the lack of specifics that cause the problems under OS X.

Chuck

 

[Chuck12563]

Here is Agfa's solution to our common problem:

"Hello.

Thank you for your inquiry.

The Viper 1.9.2 is one of our older level 2 RIPs and will not have any PPDs developed for OSX. We would recommend upgrading to a current RIP that's compatible with OSX and WinXP. Would you like someone to contact you with information on upgrading?"

So much for help from Agfa.

And, yes there is a problem with Quark 6 and Panther (10.3). If you try to make a PS file using any of the PPDs that work under 10.2.8, the result is an empty file. The immediate solutions is to set up a Generic printer under IP printing, and pick Generic Imagesetter in Quark's "Printer" box when you select "Save As" and pick PostScript. You CAN use the Agfa PPD in Quark's Print Set-Up Tab under "Printer Description" to allow you to pick the Resolution/LineScreen combinations that you want.

Chuck