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NW4.11 Bindry Server?

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jeffkelly

jeffkelly

Technical User
Aug 18, 2003
71
US
Well, as you can see from my previous post, I have to build a new NW4.11 server. The current two-server network was built and implemented as NDS when it wasn't necessary. The only reason NW4.11 is installed is because we couldn't purchase NW3.12 at the time -- which is very stable for our application. The client workstations are DOS utility machines with one purpose. No people log into the server. There is a backup server in the tree -- also running NW4.11 (will be replaced as well). There is no SFT level to swap servers when the primary fails. Instead, files are copied to the backup server using a 3rd party cloning utility. If the main server crashes, we manually log each workstation into the backup server. So, you can see that my network model is bindery. The only other thing the server will do is host an external SCSI tape drive and run Backup Exec 9.

Amazingly, I found the NW installer discs after all these years. I glossed through a few NW4.11 books and it appears the server has to be installed to support NDS. With our current (and sick) server, the workstations log into directory services, but on the new server I'm building, I want them to log into the primary server only (bindery mode). A few questions:
[ul]
[li] Is there such a thing as "minimal installation" of NW4.11? I want the OS clean without a bunch of unnecessary programs/services installed.[/li]
[li]Is the server exclusively NDS and if I want to log into bindery services, I do it on the client?[/li]
[li] I don't want anything related to IP enabled...just IPX. Is this possible?[/li]
[li] What is the latest patch level of NW4.11? [/li]
[/ul]

If you have any other guidance or opinion about my installation, please feel free to express it.

Thanks in advance to all who answer,

Jeff
 
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Having not installed NetWare 4.11 for ages, I can only comment from my bad memory :)

a) I think you have to select additional services as part of the installation or maybe install them from a workstation so I would not worry about installing services you do not need

b) The server can use Bindery mode but that still needs NDS to work. From the console, you can set the Bindery context to an NDS location where the users are stored (eg. SET BINDERY CONTEXT = .USERS.MAIN)

c) IPX only is ok. A NetWare 4.x server only uses IP for things like printing, you cannot use IP only on a NetWare 4.x server

d) Novell does not offer any Support Pack downloads for NetWare 4.x anymore. If you have a copy of a Support Pack, use that. Unless someone else knows where it can be downloaded.

As mentioned before, this is all from memory so apologies if some of the info is nondescript or inaccurate.

--------------------------------------
"Insert funny comment in here!"
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In the box I found:

1. Original 4-disc NW4.11 disc set
2. 100 user license floppy
3. Netware 4.11 w/ HD & Lan Support disc
4. NW4 SP7A
5. NW4.11 SP8. Obviously this supercedes #3 above.

Does anyone know if there was a service pack newer than 8 and if so, where I might obtain it?

Thanks
 
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Thanks pagy. You and I must have hit submit at the same time :)
 
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Having NDS shouldn't be seen as a problem. NDS does a lot of good things. I understand you want Bindery, so go ahead and use bindery services. Even NetWare 6.5 can be used in Bindery mode from a DOS based client. No big deal. (I have yet to be defeated on my challenge that ANY legacy DOS based app can run on a NetWare 6.5 server). But you don't slice NDS out of the picture and you shouldn't try to disable it. It is required.

The one problem I see is that with new hardware, you may have difficulty getting drivers to work for NetWare 4.11. If you have problems with drivers, you're on your own. No vendor is going to support that.



Marvin Huffaker, MCNE
 
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I understand about the hardware and drivers. Luckily, I scored two 29160 SCSI controllers and two Pro1000 NIC cards. Both are supported as early as 3.12 so I know I'm safe. The rest of the computer peripherals will be disabled.

I have two 3.12 servers running on the same hardware platform (Intel server MOBO, 29160 controller, PRO1000 NIC, 512 MB RAM, P4-3.4 Proc). The NIC driver is for 3.2 but runs flawlessly. In fact, they are the most stable servers in my company! Our main network is NT running active directory. Another group in my company handles the NT domain. My group handles all the non-NT servers and legacy stuff. I went the MCSE route and in retrospect, wished I would have obtained a CNE as well. I've done plenty of 2.x, 3.11 and 3.12 servers many eons ago. I've never installed a Novell operating system newer than 3.12.

Since we will have two 4.11 servers on the same network (primary and backup), an NDS tree is unavoidable. I'm still going to log each of the 61 workstations into the primary server instead of the Netware context/tree. These workstations run 24/7/365 and I want the most minimal, but stable, Netware installation necessary to accommodate our needs. Our IP entry into the Netware network is though a Windows 2K server running GSNW. We tried NWIP and it was very unstable.


Question:

Do I install the OS from the original disc, patch it with SP9 and configure after that or do I install the OS from the original disc, configure it and then patch it?

Thanks Much,

J
 
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The machines log into the Novell network, launch Windows and then a custom application we wrote internally. The machines control numerous automated systems.

I'll attempt the installation tomorrow. If I run into any unforseen challenges, I'll be sure to post them here.

BTW, on NW3.12, there are two tools that allow me to back up the bindery and trustee from the live server. Does NW4.11 have the same thing?

This is a great resource! Thanks everyone!

J
 
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I installed the original CD and did a custom configuration to define three volumes on the NW partition. I used all the available space, but for some reason "volumes" is reporting a fourth volume called NW411. It wasn't on the list I saved so can someone tell me what it is and if it is safe to delete? Right now namespace is DOS on all four partitions. The three I created have Cp and Sa flags, while the NW411 volume does not have any flags defined.

Beyond that, I had to blow past installing the Pro1000 NIC because the driver requires SP5 and above. Other than that, it went well. My last question is about SP9. I haven't looked, but does it have its own installer or does it have to be installed through the install.nlm utility?
 
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I read the instructions and got though the SP9 update. I did get one error: Directory path e:\install\4\msgvar.rcf is invalid. The E drive is my cdrom drive. Other than that, no errors during and after restart. Now I have to install the NIC driver and hope I don't get any public symbols errors like I did prior to SP9 (I discovered the driver needs SP5 and above to work).

Another observation: when I down the server, only the three volumes I created dismount. The fourth volume named NW411 wasn't mentioned. Could it be the DOS partition?
 
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Now the server won't register memory. No matter if I auto register or set it to 1000000 20000000, all I get is 64MB. I have 512 MB in the server. Any idea what's wrong?
 
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Do you have any memory commands in the dos boot like HIMEM or EMM386? if so get rid of them.
 
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I had Himem.sys as part of the DOS installation. That fixed the problem. Thanks
 
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Is there a way to add the first user w/o installing the Netware client? I prefer to not use the NW client because it crawls when UNC mapping. Instead, I use the CSNW native to Windows XP and it works fine (very fast). It looks like CSNW can't be configured to log into directory services as a different user than my NT credentials (whereas the NW client will allow me to do this).

I want to add my username/password to the server so I can begin building the accounts. Before I install the Novell Client, I though I'd ask if there is a way to do this w/ CSNW. Netadmin and NWAdmin don't work; Netadmin wants me logged into directory services and NWAdmin is looking for LOCWIN32.DLL. I'm certain there will be other missing DLLs behind it.

Thanks in advance.

J
 
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The short answer is NO.

The long answer is YES, but the details of doing this are so complicated that frankly, it's not worth it.

Just suck it up and install the Novell client onto your Windows XP box and use NWADMIN. The reason you get those errors is because it requires the client to be able to access the NDS database.

Marvin Huffaker, MCNE
 
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Does anyone know why I ended up with one more volume than I created? I configured:
Sys
Bank
User
The server has a fourth volume called NW411. It won't expand in NWAdmin (gives an error about building subordinate objects).

I placed a picture of NWAdmin with the extra volume HERE

Notice the ROCK_NW411 volume? I didn't create it. Can I delete it?

 
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That's your CDRom - it created that volume (from the NetWare 4.11 cd) automatically when you installed it and you can delete it if you want. No big deal.

Marvin Huffaker, MCNE
 
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If I delete it, will I be able to mount my CDROM in the future?
 
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Yes, by using the cd mount command

All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure.
- Mark Twain
 
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