George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
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Novell's Linux strategy worries some customers 2
- Thread starter bytehd
- Start date
Take it as you want it, sounds like a M$ sponsored artical to me.
Just reads like the author took an M$ FUD artical, rehashed it and called it news.
Wait until you guys get the hoe down at Brainshare 2005, lots of kewl stuff comming from Novell will be announced then.
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
Brent Schmidt Certified nut case![[hippy]](/data/assets/smilies/hippy.gif "[hippy] [hippy]")
Senior Network Engineer
Just reads like the author took an M$ FUD artical, rehashed it and called it news.
Wait until you guys get the hoe down at Brainshare 2005, lots of kewl stuff comming from Novell will be announced then.
=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
Brent Schmidt Certified nut case
Senior Network Engineer
- Thread starter
- #3
future product announcements is a M$ tactic
so all the netware services running on less capable kernel
cant wait for that...
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
so all the netware services running on less capable kernel
cant wait for that...
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
LawnBoy
MIS
- Mar 12, 2003
- 2,881
10 years ago NetWare was a completely different animal than it is now. I (at least) managed to keep up.
10 years from now NetWare will be a completely different animal than it is now. I (at least) will manage to keep up.
Now substitute the word NetWare with the OS, system, hardware, or pc of your choice. Such is the nature of the IT game. Is Novell immune? Of course not, nobody is. We will all be continuously re-learning our methodologies until we get out of this business.
Hey, RSX on a PDP11 was rock solid, but things change.
10 years from now NetWare will be a completely different animal than it is now. I (at least) will manage to keep up.
Now substitute the word NetWare with the OS, system, hardware, or pc of your choice. Such is the nature of the IT game. Is Novell immune? Of course not, nobody is. We will all be continuously re-learning our methodologies until we get out of this business.
Hey, RSX on a PDP11 was rock solid, but things change.
- Thread starter
- #5
yeah i guess
netware will just say "grub" when it boots....
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
netware will just say "grub" when it boots....
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
- Thread starter
- #7
The Apple/Mac guys switched to a UNIX-Kernel - it seems - few people are missing MacOS-Classic. I believe Novell only can win by focusing also more on the UNIX/Linux-kernel. On the long term the counterweight against the M$-Systems could be more significant, if there's more unity and we can compile UNIX-Code on Netware, as well as on MacOS and Linux.
I appreciate Netware 5.1 a lot - the Netware we always dreamed of 10 years ago. Let's hope they don't sacrifice functionality and stability and take (Group)wise and careful decisions how to migrate without agonizing us.
Rüdi
Black Forest
I appreciate Netware 5.1 a lot - the Netware we always dreamed of 10 years ago. Let's hope they don't sacrifice functionality and stability and take (Group)wise and careful decisions how to migrate without agonizing us.
Rüdi
Black Forest
Not to be rude, but, I don't think any company needs to "win". I believe that their customers should "win". I've been using Netware for almost 20 years now. Each and every competent IT person should and must do what is right for the organization that they work for. It is our responsibility to do so. We must use the best product for the situation.
Iolair MacWalter
Iolair MacWalter
- Thread starter
- #10
Yes Jr,
but some of us dont just "use what they tell us"
Some of us use what works. We drive the industry.
Not the other way around.
If Novell really thinks linux is the future
then netware should be OSS..
Why should they keep peddling a superior product?
How many of your netware servers have virus problems?
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
but some of us dont just "use what they tell us"
Some of us use what works. We drive the industry.
Not the other way around.
If Novell really thinks linux is the future
then netware should be OSS..
Why should they keep peddling a superior product?
How many of your netware servers have virus problems?
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
-
2
- #11
ITsmyfault
IS-IT--Management
we have a saying about that here..
are you a sheep or a goat?
Goats eat where they want, sleep where they want, do what they want.
Sheep get slaughtered.
MSFT shops are sheep for the most part. "Everyone else does it.." herd mentality. Everyone gets "I love You".. "Blaster" and the like too. what a bargain. MSFT's own talking heads even espouse the "advantage" of being able to patch all your machines the same way.. (!!) ACK! How about NOT having to patch them at all??? Their world is an extension of their monolithic windows architecture: the monolithic network of all MSFT servers and apps. The network as a SPOF. Brilliant guys.. really. <golf claps..>
Netware has saved us tons of money and tons of downtime over the years. So we keep using it. Period. Everytime there is a big patch out for MSFT or a big virus takes out one of our competitors, I go into the CFO's office and let him know why our network is running - and why they are down. Knowing what is better is not enough. As IT professionals we must COMMUNICATE it to the dollar & cents folks in ways that they can understand WHY WE DO WHAT WE DO. I run 25% more stuff with 33% less staff because of Netware. Our network is 4X as complex as it was 4 years ago and yet costs 1/4 as much to impliment and operate..largely bc of Netware. Stuff like that they understand.
& Am I happy about Linux? Yes I am. Thanks for asking.
1 - Gives Novell the company a chance to be vibrant again if they can just EXECUTE this time.. (remember unixware?) They have lacked this kind of clear vision for a while. It feels like they are finding their feet again.
2 - Gives Linux in the enterprise the 'shot in the arm' it so desperately needs imho.. a solid directory, groupware, easy to use file and print, better security and clustering (NSS, NCS) and more. It becomes IMHO a viable offering for many firms.
3 - solves the issue of Netware server as app server. Linux can better run web, java and database apps.
4 - Linux gives them the continuum from desktop to server room.
5 - Linux gives them a broader base of knowledgeable professionals to be consultants and engineers and support their offerings.
6 - I firmly beleive (as NOVL mgt does) that the OS is *not* the value added in a computer. The APPS are. The OS is valuable only so far as it facilitates the running of the apps. Has windows ever solved a business problem for me? no, but Excel has.. Word has.. Turbotax has. If Office ran on BSD, everyone would run BSD.. Excel and Word begat Windows. Not the other way 'round. Linux makes evolutionary sense in this way. MSFT is trying to turn Windows into an app to suck more $ out of every pocket precisely when we are on the cusp of getting to "the point". Office is a great suite.. but why only on winows? Groupwise is a great suite on windows, linux or Netware. eDir is a great directory on netware, solaris, luinux or netware. This kind of flexibility is the future. (IMHO) It's about the apps, not the OS. If Linux can be as secure, stable and powerful as Netware as an application platform I welcome it.
I think it can work.. I hope it does work.
are you a sheep or a goat?
Goats eat where they want, sleep where they want, do what they want.
Sheep get slaughtered.
MSFT shops are sheep for the most part. "Everyone else does it.." herd mentality. Everyone gets "I love You".. "Blaster" and the like too. what a bargain. MSFT's own talking heads even espouse the "advantage" of being able to patch all your machines the same way.. (!!) ACK! How about NOT having to patch them at all??? Their world is an extension of their monolithic windows architecture: the monolithic network of all MSFT servers and apps. The network as a SPOF. Brilliant guys.. really. <golf claps..>
Netware has saved us tons of money and tons of downtime over the years. So we keep using it. Period. Everytime there is a big patch out for MSFT or a big virus takes out one of our competitors, I go into the CFO's office and let him know why our network is running - and why they are down. Knowing what is better is not enough. As IT professionals we must COMMUNICATE it to the dollar & cents folks in ways that they can understand WHY WE DO WHAT WE DO. I run 25% more stuff with 33% less staff because of Netware. Our network is 4X as complex as it was 4 years ago and yet costs 1/4 as much to impliment and operate..largely bc of Netware. Stuff like that they understand.
& Am I happy about Linux? Yes I am. Thanks for asking.
1 - Gives Novell the company a chance to be vibrant again if they can just EXECUTE this time.. (remember unixware?) They have lacked this kind of clear vision for a while. It feels like they are finding their feet again.
2 - Gives Linux in the enterprise the 'shot in the arm' it so desperately needs imho.. a solid directory, groupware, easy to use file and print, better security and clustering (NSS, NCS) and more. It becomes IMHO a viable offering for many firms.
3 - solves the issue of Netware server as app server. Linux can better run web, java and database apps.
4 - Linux gives them the continuum from desktop to server room.
5 - Linux gives them a broader base of knowledgeable professionals to be consultants and engineers and support their offerings.
6 - I firmly beleive (as NOVL mgt does) that the OS is *not* the value added in a computer. The APPS are. The OS is valuable only so far as it facilitates the running of the apps. Has windows ever solved a business problem for me? no, but Excel has.. Word has.. Turbotax has.
If Office ran on BSD, everyone would run BSD.. Excel and Word begat Windows. Not the other way 'round. Linux makes evolutionary sense in this way. MSFT is trying to turn Windows into an app to suck more $ out of every pocket precisely when we are on the cusp of getting to "the point". Office is a great suite.. but why only on winows? Groupwise is a great suite on windows, linux or Netware. eDir is a great directory on netware, solaris, luinux or netware. This kind of flexibility is the future. (IMHO) It's about the apps, not the OS. If Linux can be as secure, stable and powerful as Netware as an application platform I welcome it. I think it can work.. I hope it does work.
ITsmyfault
IS-IT--Management
on the subject of Office running on BSD.. it does really - runs great on the MAC.. BUT with a key exception: Outlook. Why?
I think bc MSFT is scared. If folks could roll out Mac clients, they would. BSD is arguably the most stable of all the unixes.. and the Mac variant should still be pretty good (they have a good track record code wise IMHO) Having 110 million exchange users that can't move over easily makes it harder to replace windows.
Discuss amongst yourselves.
I think bc MSFT is scared. If folks could roll out Mac clients, they would. BSD is arguably the most stable of all the unixes.. and the Mac variant should still be pretty good (they have a good track record code wise IMHO) Having 110 million exchange users that can't move over easily makes it harder to replace windows.
Discuss amongst yourselves.
ITsmyfault
IS-IT--Management
and this just in from provo.. call it a 'retraction' to that other garbage press release bytehd posted about.. and then some!
marvhuffaker
MIS
Itsmy... thanks. your post is excellent and that link is great too.
Although I have to say while GroupWise technically is multiplatform and does run on Windows... It sucks. Keep GroupWise on NetWare. (from a support standpoint -- the users don't know either way except for when the windows server crashes)
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting, Inc.
Although I have to say while GroupWise technically is multiplatform and does run on Windows... It sucks. Keep GroupWise on NetWare. (from a support standpoint -- the users don't know either way except for when the windows server crashes)
Marvin Huffaker MCNE, CNE
Marvin Huffaker Consulting, Inc.
- Thread starter
- #16
See, now my clients can rest assured.
Thanks Novell....
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
Thanks Novell....
George Walkey
Senior Geek in charge
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