Norton Ghost to clone Win98 in triple boot setup 2

[toolman59]

At present my HD contains three OSs - Win 98 C: FAT32 - two installations of WIN XP home on E: and F: both NTFS.
Due to problems arising from program installs on Win 98 this OS is not working very well and does not respond to a new install over the top. Will the following recovery plan work?

Copy boot loader files to safe place.
Format C: from one of the other OSs
Copy back boot files to C:\. Will the computer still multiboot at this stage?
Install fresh copy of Win 98 on C: plus all drivers etc.

When Win 98 is running to my satisfaction, use Norton Ghost 2002 to produce an image of C: for future recovery if required?

Will I in future be able to use the Ghost image to return a formatted C: drive to clean installed state without affecting the multiboot information contained on C:

Toolman59

 

[Lemon13]

no
backup boot.ini
boot from floppy and format drive
install 98
boot from floppy, rename program in programw98, windows in windows98 (not sure its nessesary, just 2 make sure)
boot from xp cd
say install xp in c:\windowsxp
after xp install copied all files and say reboot, but reboot with w98 floppy.
delete program/windowsxp(and any folder created by xp setup), rename programw98/windowsw98 and replace boot.ini with backedup boot.ini.
try the tripple boot.
nows the time for a image of c:

 

[toolman59]

Lemon13

As I guessed it is more involved than was obvious to me. I presume that the Win XP install is to rebuild the Boot information on C:I have space for another partition, so if I do a temporary install of Win XP on the spare partition it would be easier to get rid of it and would keep the C: partition clean. The boot.ini file can be replaced or edited to suit and then do the Image. Will this work do you think?

Toolman59

 

[Lemon13]

it should, give it a try.
important is that the dos part of the xp setup has to finish(copying) but the gui part should not start ;-)

 

[wolluf]

You can recreate the XP triple boot without running XP install.

If you save boot.ini, ntldr, ntdetect.com and bootsect.dos from the root of C: before you start (I'd save them to hard drive and to a floppy - can then boot the 2 XP installations from this floppy).

Now install 98 on C: as normal (boot from 98 boot floppy, format C: and start setup).

Once 98 is back up, copy the boot sector files back to root of C:, then boot into XP recovery console (either installation will do) -

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;307654.

From there run fixboot C:.

Triple boot should now be back in place. If the 98 option doesn't work, you may need to rebuild the bootsect.dos file - see

http://www.dougknox.com/xp/tips/xp_repair_9x.htm

for method for this.

Some notes and warnings. If your XP installations are logical drives in extended partition, you may run the risk of 'losing' one or both of them when you format C: (primary partition). It shouldn't happen, but have seen too many posts & had it happen to me. Primary partitions are best for installing operating systems.

If you use primary partitions, and make sure each has its own boot sector, the operating systems are basically independent. You can still use XP's boot loader off C: - but others will boot on their own if that gets corrupted. Or you can use a third party boot manager (more flexible option - I use

http://www.boot-us.com).

HTH

 

[toolman59]

wolluf

Thank you very much, I will try this over the weekend. I do have the OSs on primary partitions.

One question regarding stand alone bootable partitions, can the NTFS partitions still see the other unbooted partitions? I am aware of the limitations of an OS on a FAT32 partition with respect to NTFS, but I do not know what happens after a boot loader such as Bootmagic has done it's work. As I understand it, the selected OS partition is made visible and the the others are hidden, do they remain hidden after the boot sequence has finished?

Toolman59

 

[wolluf]

Depends on how configured. I've only had a cursory look at bootmagic (as have used boot-us successfully for 4 years) - but I think it does automatically hide other partitions (don't know if option to turn this off). In boot-us, its definitely configurable - I leave all partitions visible unless it prevents booting (eg, if you have 2 win9x/ME installations on fat32, the second won't normally boot unless the first is hidden - it will always boot the first - though I've used a linux boot loader which can overcome this!).

Also, from what you've written, not sure if you're clear on the fact its operating systems that see (or don't see partitions). An ntfs partition can't see anything. But 2k or XP can see an ntfs, fat or fat32 partition. 98 can only see fat or fat32 - though there is freewareto give 98 the ability to read ntfs - eg at

http://www.sysinternals.com.

 

[toolman59]

Wolluf

Thank you very much, I understand what you say regarding OSs being able to see other partitions. This is governed by file system type, in my case I use a common FAT32 partition for user files whether produced by Win9x or XP which makes work backup simpler, since I dont really need Win98 to read anything in the NTFS partitions, I will leave well alone for now.

I will check on Bootmagic to see what it does and also have a look at Boot-us.

Toolman59

 

[TekTippy4U]

hi wolluf;
in relation to the other thread, and my question about XP creating an Extended or Primary (using NTFS), "after" a w98 install to C:\ ......

toolman59 says;
I do have the OSs on primary partitions
The info in this thread seems to suggest that XP will create a Primary rather than Extended during install on a separate partition on same HDD. (is this correct?, and if so, does it have anything to do with FAT32, or NTFS?).

toolman59; Can you help a little in my understanding?....did you use any special Boot loader to make E: and F: Primary partitions?

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs

 

[toolman59]

TT4U

I relied on Partition Magic 8 to configure my HD. I chose to make the the Partitions containing the OSs as primaries. This meant that I installed XP on existing partitions.

My disk setup looks like this

C: Win98 FAT32 2.0GB

D: Work files FAT32 (used by Win98 or XP) 4.5GB

E: Pagefile for F: and G: 2.0GB

F: Win XP Home NTFS 8.0GB (general use)

G: Win XP Home NTFS 7.0GB (CD burning and Flight Sim, deleted the internet, firewall, virus software after updates were completed.)

H: Spare partition for whatever. FAT32

R: CD ROM

S: CD recorder

T: Zip 250 internal

I set the removable drives well down the list so that I could make them the same in the NTFS and FAT32 OSs. I should have kept all the FAT32 partitions in rotation starting at C: so that the visible drive letters remain constant between Win98 and XP

My basic knowledge of partitioning and formatting is pretty thin, but is greatly helped by people like Wolluf and others on Tek-Tips.

Toolman59

 

[TekTippy4U]

hi toolman;
had no idea PM was involved.
I only suggested E and F from your initial post.
thanks for clearing that up for me
At present my HD contains three OSs - Win 98 C: FAT32 - two installations of WIN XP home on E: and F: both NTFS.

you also say
My basic knowledge of partitioning and formatting is pretty thin
hehe ...so is mine.
So in 98, you see C,D,H and the rest. starting at R
In XP you see all

as to your original problem with ghosting, the only thing different on C, other than a Standard 98 install (once tweaked and updated - ready for imaging) is the XP triple boot info....therefore, couldn't you just Backup those 4 important files (as suggested to hdd and floppy), and wipe C:\ with PM, and Reinstall 98, tweak it, update it, add the 4 Boot files back, run FIXBOOT (cheeck your work) and Ghost Image it then?.....as basically outlined in wolluf's first post?
This should yield not only a nice 98 Image to restore, but also an Image of the tri-boot setup, as you have it.

I may be missing something, and /or have a diff thread crossed with yours in my head, but how are now getting to Choose which OS. Are you presented with a Boot Menu option for diff OSs? I'm just sorting through the differences in my jello upstairs between Primaries and Extended. Maybe PM gives you these options.

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs

 

[TekTippy4U]

well,
I just answered my own question as I looked at edfair's answer in thread751-882444 there's a co-supplied boot manager in PM.

Now I'm curious to know if Ghost copies/backs-up the MPT/ MBR info ,as this is the essential info for any dual-boot / tri-boot....or is it necessary, because of using PM, that PM info needs Backing up (should've be done anyway separately).
Maybe the XP fixboot doesn't need to be done (always have that option though anyway) after re-inserting the PM backed-up info.
hmmmm

TT4U

Notification:
These are just my thoughts....and should be carefully measured against other opinions.
Backup All Important Data/Docs

 

[wolluf]

TT4U - what ghost backs up will depend on type of backup (if you do the entire disk, you should get everything, if just a partition you won't get mbr etc)

 

[toolman59]

Progress to date

Created floppy with the four boot loader files.

With boot loader floppy in A: rebooted. All worked OK

Created Ghost image of C: partition on D:

Booted with Win98 boot disk.

Formatted C:

Booted from A: with boot loader files, the remaining OSs started OK.

Rebooted with Ghost disk and restored C: from Ghost image on D:, everything working as before.

When I have time I will reformat C: and do a fresh install of Win98, copy in the boot loader files, and Ghost this as suggested when everything is setup.



Toolman59

 

[toolman59]

Forgot to say, but at the moment I use the Windows XP boot loader. I did this because last year I got in bit of a tangle with the Boot Magic loader. Next major HD clean out may see me changing from the XP loader.

Toolman59

 

[wolluf]

do have a look at

http://www.boot-us.com.

 

[toolman59]

wolluf

Thank you, I am downloading the various packages. Next step read the manual.


Toolman59