MOC must be delivered by MCTs?

[hmcheung]

Is it a must for the MOC materials be delivered by an MCT? Thanks! Please visit my WebCam!!

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[tjh03]

MOC is created by Microsoft for the Certified Education and Training Centers (CTEC) and AATP programs. To Microsoft's credit they have lessened the requirements on obtaining the MOC, but it is my understanding that only MCT will teach inside the CTEC and AATP locations according to the rules.

 

[Voyager1]

I'm afraid that I have to disagree with tjh03's "to Microsoft's Credit" statement. I feel that Microsoft has become WAY too lenient on thost that deliver their technical training. There is no quality assurance, nothing that states that the instructor is an expert in the subject matter he or she is presenting. You don't even have to pass the exam any more. A couple of years ago you not only had to pass the exam, but you had to sit the class in order to deliver it. Under the current program, all you need is a premium cert (MCSE, MCSD, etc), a simple Train-the-Trianer course, and you are authorized to teach ANYTHING Microsoft publishes (don't forget the country-club fee).

You must be an MCT to deliver MOC materials. You don't, however, have to be an expert on the subject you are teaching. What a crock...B-(

 

[Guest_imported]

I agree Voyager, it is a crock. But lets look at the flip side of this. There will be an influx of "wannabe MCT's" and they will come at a cheap price. VERY QUICKLY the training centers are going to see the quality of the instruction and will be dropping these folks like crazy. Then we will be able to go in basiclly NAME THE PRICE. I know we aren't in it totally for the money but it sure is nice

 

[Voyager1]

iamavol, agreed. I think the "Country Club Fee" which has not been announced but is rumored to be around $1,000 will help keep the "dabblers" to a minimum. Even so, I still think it's too easy, and there is no quality control in place.

X-) Bill
CNE, MCSE, CCNA, CCA, MCT, CCI

"I'd much rather be lucky than good"

 

[Guest_imported]

I agree with most of the comments and as a new MCT I definitely agree that Microsoft should keep the “exam requirement” for MCT’s prior to teaching a MOC course. I would feel like a fool if I were teaching a course that I was not certified in and a student asked me about my qualifications prior to teaching the course. I remember very well when I first took a MOC course at a college in Tampa (USF) several years ago and the instructor was just an MCP in Workstation and Server with absolutely NO real world experience. Paying 2 grand for someone to turn pages and read out loud from the MOC material is a complete waste of money. Unfortunately, I see this happening again to many students if Microsoft sticks with their current stratagy. I strongly suggest any new student who is contemplating attending a CTEC/ATEC to investigate the prospective instructor very carefully. The only positive thing Microsoft has done with the new MCT program is the continuing education requirement. According to the educational point values required to maintain the MCT certification is to test out on at least one or two courses a year and attend other technical events that MS has allocated educational value points to. Perhaps this is a way to weed out those with lesser talents.

 

[Voyager1]

Floridadiver, I think the continuing education requirements will help, but not solve the problem. And yes, without a doubt any prospective student should inquire about the qualifications of an instructor, and perhaps audit a chapter or two of his class. Any CTEC that will not divulge an instructor's background, or allow a prospective student to audit even a small portion of a class is hiding something.

An MCT, no matter how much instructional experience they have, who has never worked in the "real world" (outside the classroom) is a fake and is worthless to students. As you say, a couple of grand is a stiff price to pay for storytime - I could just as easily have my 15 year old daughter read the book to me.

Sorry to rant so much - I have some very strong opinions on the subject...X-) Bill
CNE, MCSE, CCNA, CCA, MCT, CCI

"I'd much rather be lucky than good"

 

[wekkew]

Hi

This is my understanding of the matter.

In order to deliver the "high-end" courses (MCSE/MCSD etc) then you must be a MCT, but if you are working within an AATP then all that needs to happen to become a MCT is that the organisation must sign a form confirming that the "MCT-to be" has been teaching for a set time. They do not have to hold any teaching qualifications or complete a "Teach the Trainer" course. In order to teach a course you have not attended as a students you first need to read the manual and then sign a sheet confirming that you have read the manual and understand what you are about to teach.

I agree with the earlier comments about "storytelling" but a lot of this depends on the class. Some students never ask questions, just plod their way through the labs in silence whilst others take the whole course as a "pick-your-brains" exercise.

For what it's worth the main problem is with people attending courses who have very little knowledge about the subject! It would be nice if there was some sort of entry/assessment procedure before students attended the course so that attendees actually gained something from the course rather than simply sitting in front of books, pressing button 1, followed by button 2 etc.

Kate

 

[tgoodman]

I agree with most all the comments here. When I went through my MCSE training I had 2 instructors. Both were MCT's. One of them it became apparent had never worked in the field and was teaching because he couldn't do. The other was an old hand at NT and you could pick his brain. We also had 1 person in the class who ended up getting their MCSE while failing 12 exams. He is now teaching. Kinda weird scenario.

Anyone planning on taking any courses should sit in on the course and talk to the instructor about their experience level. I am not saying that every instructor should be an absolute expert in the material but they should be able to apply what they teach as well as get the material across to their students in a manner that it is learned and retained. I have also seen instructors that were technically brilliant but couldn't teach a lick. So, I think you have to have a fine balance to be an instructor. Unfortunately they are far and few between. This is not just a Microsoft problem. Just look at our educational system.

T

 

[Voyager1]

Good point tgoodman (public education)!

And I agree with earlier comments about students. Some just do the time, while some really participate. The worst thing in the world is when a student goes to pick and instructor's brain and comes up empty.

It's up to us, the experienced and "field tested" instructors to raise the bar for the rest.

IMHO Bill
CNE, MCSE, CCNA, CCA, MCT, CCI

"I'd much rather be lucky than good"