Mitel Licensing Question - transfering licenses 1

[ACentury]

We have a 3300 with all the licensing we need at present (just barely). Call that System-A.

I found another 3300 (1 generation older) that has licenses galore for just $800, call that System-B.

Can I buy System-B, transfer the SysID to our company, then transfer the licenses to System-A (ie: a different SysID) while keeping all the System-A licenses in tact? The physical box for System-B would go into the junk heep and maybe scavanged for parts.

Note: System-A has a different mix of licenses than System-B, so I can't just transfer sys-IDs. Also; System-B pricing is nearly free to us because they're willing to take our 47 old Nortel Meridian phones in trade.

 

[kwbMitel]

There is a re-licensing fee for the Sys-ID to be transfered to your ownership. Your VAR should be able to tell you how much Mitel will charge.

Mitel Licenses the use of the components registered to a Sys-ID. Mitel technically owns all licensing it does not come free.

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Occam's Razor - All things being equal, the simplest solution is the right one.

 

[ACentury]

Thanks kw.

So; the $800 the used reseller is charging does not include us gaining license ownership?

Any way to quantify this re-licensing fee based on practical experience?

The fact that we're already a Mitel user seems irrelevant to that purchase.

The secondary issue, after we own that Sys-ID and all the devices and associated licensing, is the matter of transferring all the licenses from one 3300 to the other.

Our current VAR (the one who sold us the current unit) told me we absolutely could not do this. He has a history of making absolute statements that don't pan out and it doesn't seem fair ergo my question on this forum.

I assume I can purchase the $800 Mitel switch together with all that licensing. I accept that there is a re-registration (transfer) fee that might not be built into that.

My remaining question is:
Can I take some or all of the licenses from one Mitel switch that I own and add it to another that I also own without moving SYS-IDs between equipment (ie: keep the same Sys-ID on my production unit)?

Thanks very much for your insight.

 

[kwbMitel]

There is a means to transfer licenses from one Sys-ID to another. Not all licenses are transferable but I'm sure the ones you are looking for are.

The $800 fee would be for the Hardware. As mentioned, Mitel retains ownership of licensing and technically as you are not the registered owner, you will be breaking Mitel's User licensing agreement.

Many people that buy on the Grey market can live with that. Your situation is slightly different in that you want to transfer the licenses from one system to the other. This will only be done with the full cooperation of Mitel and your VAR. If your VAR is as difficult to deal with as you suggest then I would consider that to be a major roadblock. I have never been directly involved with relicensing a system so I can't speculate on the cost.

I work for a VAR and I move licenses all the time for my customers with multiple controllers. It is very simple as long as the licenses and passwords for the system have been synchronized with the Mitel licensing server (AMC). If however, the license password was downloaded and manually entered you will not be able to transfer licenses without some very complicated processes.

Sorry for making this even more confusing but sometimes there is no simple answer.



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Occam's Razor - All things being equal, the simplest solution is the right one.

 

[slapin]

It is possible to transfer ovnership of sysID. There is some paperwork involved. MITEL has some legal procedures when both parties need to sign some documents wich include transfer of managemt from one VAR to another as well.

 

[ACentury]

Thanks - that answers my questions.

It appears Mitel resisted the whole concept of resealable licensing but market forces have allowed exceptions.

Since it appears it would cost us tons of VAR intervention (and maybe changing VARs) to acquire licensing purely because it's nearly free price tag, no longer makes any sense.

This reveals why Mitel set things up so murky; to effectively eliminated competition from the used market. As a customer, my only recourse is to be dissatisfied about it.

It seems there is a path to getting used stuff and it's unfortunate that "my VAR" (ie: the guy lucky enough to get my business when I bought this $50K system) has to get his cut like it's some back alley deal, but if we were less well funded I'd be forced to navigate those waters.

I appreciate your assistance. Cheers.

 

[kwbMitel]

I do not know of any other manufacturer that even makes this possible. I agree that the process is probably overly complicated but at least it exists. As a Mitel Owner, you might be able to circumvent your VAR. Talk to Mitel directly and be up front on what you are trying to accomplish. Nothing will be lost by asking at this point.

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Occam's Razor - All things being equal, the simplest solution is the right one.

 

[IrwinMFletcher]

It's similar to a lot of licenses though I think. You can for example, buy a used computer with Vista installed. But if you want to then move that copy of Vista to a new PC you can only do it once, after that you have to buy a new license. Originally you couldn't even do it at all. So in terms of a used market, you can buy what you like, as is. Try to change it and people will want to be paid.

Just a side note, why not just use the used controller as is? Depending on what the licensing is and what you require, you may be able to create a small cluster and expand on the 'new' box.

 

[ACentury]

A simple transaction for, with trade-in, $256 to add all the licensing we would ever need is a slam dunk.

Adding more points of failure at the cost of more VAR configuration hours, maintenance fees, power, rack space, wiring, complexity, etc would only make sense if it added redundancy and insulate us from component failure.

Since it's a generation behind our 3300 it wouldn't even function as a standby.

It sucks that the 3300 doesn't even have redundant hard disk capability but we long ago got a 2nd hard disk that sits in waiting with the current OS loaded.

So; I'm selling the old Mitel system on the open market for $550 cash and we'll just continue buying licenses from Mitel as we need them and risk outage time if hardware should fail.

 

[IrwinMFletcher]

The MXe supports a raid array, and has power supply and fan redundancy. Even with dual HDDs, I would recommend an off-site backup drive as well, not to mention database backups.

Out of curiosity, what was the old system? What kind of licenses does it have?

 

[ACentury]

What's an MSe? Is that the 3300 we have? Our VAR said it only supports a single hard disk - an external array would be a great solution to what we have now.

Our VAR takes a full backup on their laptop every time they do anything. I take on-disk backups to a workstation but not offsite. Having it on a separate network is a real hassle since I can't include it in our regular network tape backups (we have an offsite rotation).

The 3300 that's for sale is on an EBAY store here. He bumped the price to $900 because he added some licenses.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mitel-3300-Cont...5|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318|301:0|293:1|294:50

 

[IrwinMFletcher]

There are 3 main variants of the 3300 now, the CX, the MXe and the AX. They look physically different so check the Mitel product page to find out what you have. The MXe is for the mid-high end and has the raid option. You most likely have the CX then (the AX is a heavy analog version).

The ebay looks like an MX or LX variant, the older versions. The one thing is does have is 64 compression licenses, which if you are buying it you would want to make sure that the additional two quad 161 dsp modules are included. It only states that there is a dual FIM, but no mention of what other internal modules there are.

 

[kwbMitel]

The one for sale is definitely an LX.

Based on your earlier comments I suspect you also have an LX or MX (If purchased before 2007)

The Software is worth more than the hardware as you've already surmised.

The software level can be upgraded very simply within limits. The LX/MX platform cannot be upgraded beyond Release 9.0 due to Ram Memory capacity so its lifespan is limited.

The box would be great as a resilient controller but I would think the components like the Power supply and Harddrive would be nearing their End Of Life.

It might be worth it if the re-licensing cost isn't prohibitive.

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Occam's Razor - All things being equal, the simplest solution is the right one.

 

[MitelInMyBlood]

By the way, Mitel absolutely will not relicense a dealer DEMO unit for an end user.

 

[kwbMitel]

CAUTION!!

I know it's probably a little late to be thinking this but better late than never.

It is possible for someone to transfer all the licenses off a system and still have them appear to be active on casual inspection.

The ONLY way to know for sure if the licenses are registered to the controller is to have Mitel provide a SYS-ID report.

Buyer Beware.

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Occam's Razor - All things being equal, the simplest solution is the right one.

 

[Lundah]

Maybe it's just me, but I would never, EVER buy a PBX off eBay, particularly at such a huge discount over the usual price. How long could your business survive without phone service? Is that worth gambling the money you're "saving" buy buying from some random stranger on the internet versus a factory-authorized dealer?

 

[slapin]

We buy eBay stuff for parts since it is cheaper then have it included in a maintenance contract with VAR. I have a full set of each kind of MITEL equipment in production. Fortunately enough that we didn't have any single module or system failed since day one except a couple of HDDs.