Merging trees DS 6.09 and DS 8.8

[susantci]

I need some help. In my client's environment, I want to take a new Netware 6 server that was partially configured here with a NDS and merge it into their production tree with one server running Netware 4.2.

One problem I may have, which I am trying to anticipate, is the continuation of running ccmail and some DOS apps on the 4.2 server until I can figure out a smooth way to move them over to the Netware 6. Any input would help!!

The second problem I am having is what is the best way to do this. Do I take the NW6 server and merge it into the NW4 tree? or do I do the reverse?

Thanks,
Susan

 

[Provogeek]

DS version 6.16, the most resent version of DS for NW 4, does not understand aux class atributes. This is the biggest problem with NDS 8x & 6x mixed enviroments. DS will always talk the lowest verb set, so if your NetWare 4 and NetWare 6 box share a replica, expect problems. They can both work on the network, just don't have them share any replicas of a partition.

For your merge to actually work, you have to be at the same DS level on the source and destiantion tree. This means you will need to have a NetWare 6 box already running (or 5.x) running the same DS version as the NetWare box you want to merge into the production tree. Since you have the NW4 box in the mix, remove all replicas from it. Choose a server that is running the same DS as your new NetWare 6 box and make it the master of all your partitions. Then use this box that is master of everything and use it as your destination tree server.

I bet you a glass of water that it will fail the first time due to some schema mismatch error, be sure to import the schema from the destiantion tree to the source tree and vise versa to ensure the schema's are the same on both trees.

If the source tree has nothing of value in it, using NWCONFIG just remove DS from the server. Then reinstall DS placing the server into the production tree.

If you don't already have a 5.1 or 6 server in the tree, read up on Certificate Authority.

I see no reason you would have any problems with your DOS apps, NetWare 6 is still a kick butt file server. But before you go through the pain of installing all of this into yoru production tree, build a test bed. It really sucks to work the long hours you will need to work to make this happen only to find out later down the road something is not compatible, or conflicts with the newer technology. If this happens, more than likely you will be SOL because support for those products more than likely doesn't exist anymore. Brent Schmidt CNE, Network +
Senior Network Engineer
KIS Computer Center

http://www.kiscc.com

 

[susantci]

Thanks.

Here is an idea? How about I upgrade the 4.2 server to the same version of the DS that the 6 server is running. I saw all this documentation on DSMERGE and it gives me the feeling that edirectory will run on a 4.x server. But other places I look says it won't. What is the deal?

The major problem with your idea is that I only have 2 Netware servers in the mix here. The 4.x server is holding all the replica information. That is why I was thinking of merging the 6 server into the 4 tree after installing edirectory. Any problems with that?

Susan Hebel, MASE, CNE
Senior Network Engineer
TCI Systems, Inc.

http://www.tcisystems.com

 

[Provogeek]

DS 86 was never tested on 4.x and is not supported. You can try it, but if you run into problems that you, nor the forum, nor any other tech forum can figure out, then TS. Novell won't support. You will get told to upgrade the NOS.

You do not have the option of merging the tree's, your enviroment does not fit the requirements. To do a merge both soruce and destination server MUST be running the same DS and have identical schema's.

Get your customer off of ccMail: And test those DOS apps.

If your test bed works fine, then go with the migration accross the wire (see this forums FAQ for help on that).

If your client is not giving you the time to do a test, be sure to explain to them very clearly and very slowly why you need to do this. If all else fails, here is what I tell my customers. I can build a test bed, and the time will be billable. I will use this test bed to ensure the migration will work with out issues. OR I can just jump forward and get it done THEN we wait and see what hand we got in this poker game. You MIGHT get everything working fine, but you are dealing with out dated software that has questions on compatibility (and no manufacture support). More than likely you WILL run into issues and it will affect the bottom line.

In my 6 years of doing consulting work, I have found that I can bill out more hours when the customer does not want me to do a test bed (the choice is normaly made because some CxO wants it done NOW and doesn't understand all the veriables). It may be great and wonderfull that I get to bill out more hours when I'm not allowed to do planning and testing, but it affects the customer relationship and can put both parties in a bad light. When I do the planning and I do the testing, my installs go smooth with little to no issues (most already found in test bed and resolution ready to implement if needed).

Give your customer the options and let them roll the dice.

Remember, testing is billable time and there is no such thing as a warranty on software functionality. Many customers try to dispute the hours for testing and resolving issues after a migration (they seem to think it should be free). Some customers I have run into seem to think that if I'm a CNE than I can just jump in and get it done. They don't understand that each network is completly different in design and veriables. A good way to work around this one is to get the customer to pay you up front. IF you have this type of contract, do not under estimate, always over estimate. It makes you look good when you finnsih before the estimate and it also ensures you get paid for all of the hours you put in.

Brent Schmidt CNE, Network +
Senior Network Engineer
KIS Computer Center

http://www.kiscc.com

 

[susantci]

Brent,
This is one of the TIDs I am basing my knowledge on:
Novell eDirectory 8.6 Readme Addendum - TID10063534. Am I wrong?

Susan Hebel, MASE, CNE
Senior Network Engineer
TCI Systems, Inc.

http://www.tcisystems.com

 

[Provogeek]

Susan,

Thats an awsome TID (wish it was around when I first had to do this). I don't see anything wrong with it, but I am also missing your question I think. I'm not sure what your wrong about. Based on previous posts these are the facts you need to know for this project.

1. To merge trees both source and destination server MUST be on the same OS version and same DS version.

2. You can NOT install eDirectory on a NetWare 4.x box the install will not even run it will pretty much tell you;

[Start Eric Cartman voice over]
"Go get your self a dang NetWare 6 box ya hippy"
[End Eric Cartman voice over]



If the DS merge utiltiy would allow you to merge NW4.11/DS6 with a NW6/DS86 tree you would probably see all your servers that hold a replica hack up a fur ball and start wacking you tree to death aka stuck obits all over the place. Good thing the merge utiltiy won't work, bullet holes in feet hurt (and ruin your shoes).

Not to be mean or rude, but get off the tree merge idea it's not going to work no mater how hard you try.

The TID you found has some really good pointers on how to acomplish what your doing. Try doing the schema import then install the 6 into the tree.

BTW - how many users is the network your working with? And the big picture is to replace the old 4.11 server eventually right? If they have a low enoug user count, you might want to talk to your client into exchanging their NetWare 6 with NWSmall Business 6; it will help you get them off of cc:Mail

And do that test bed for the DOS apps. Brent Schmidt CNE,Network +
Senior Network Engineer

http://www.kiscc.com